# The Libyan Revolution: Was it worth it? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 19, 2014, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697 "2014-05-19T00:04:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/21 "2014-05-19T22:36:12Z")
As for WW2, it succeeded in putting a tyrant in power over more than half of Europe, setting the stage for about 40 years of warfare and bloodshed. Hurray ! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2014, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/22 "2014-05-19T23:19:11Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Who, General Hifter? Did you have to Godwinze the thread so soon? ---
**Author:** ![OurLordPeace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e8c25b/32.png) [@OurLordPeace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OurLordPeace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/23 "2014-05-20T00:58:22Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > As for WW2, it succeeded in putting a tyrant in power over more than half of Europe, setting the stage for about 40 years of warfare and bloodshed. Hurray ! Indeed, the Allies were almost entirely composed of those who were attacked by the Axis. Try to think of a political program that would align Churchill and Mao … or Mao and Chiang Kai-Shek, come to think of it. Anyway, in the case of Libya, the war took the country with the highest Human Development Index on the continent and turned it over to kill-crazy (and racist) militias. Was the OP asking about the war/revolution in general, or the NATO involvement? I opposed it. I say that in response to **WillFarney**. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/24 "2014-05-20T01:43:15Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > I just wish the f\*\*\*ing idiots in the ME would realize without secular democracy they will live in squalor and be the laughing stock of the world ad infinitum. Keep in mind that America has without meaning to spent decades convincing people there that “democracy” means “lackey of America” and/or “massive destruction, chaos and bloodshed”. It’s hard to convince people to go for democracy when they associate it with puppet dictators, dead bodies in the streets and the collapse of their nation. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/25 "2014-05-20T02:41:20Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Would you have said the same thing about Iraq? More or less. The Iraqi war wasn’t really a revolution, so the analogy is kind of weak. But that generation of pan-Arabic dictators generally don’t seem to have been very successful in executing peaceful transfers of power to their heirs. And Saddam was probably in a weaker position then most. So I think Iraq probably would’ve suffered some sort of violent revolt had Saddam lasted longer. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/26 "2014-05-20T02:45:20Z")
> [@OurLordPeace](#): > > Was the OP asking about the war/revolution in general, or the NATO involvement? The former. ---
**Author:** ![Ryan\_Liam](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ryan_liam/32/3965_2.png) [@Ryan\_Liam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ryan_Liam)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/27 "2014-05-20T11:41:16Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Who, General Hifter? Yeah, the chaos in Libya is bringing about the environment in which support for a man to bring about law and order is increasingly looking apparent. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/28 "2014-05-20T13:23:47Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Gaddafi was brutal, detached from reality, possibly crazy, and astonishingly arrogant even for a despot. But ever since they got rid of him, the Libyans have been fighting each other, off and on. The [aftermath of the civil war](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aftermath_of_the_Libyan_Civil_War) has included a lot of [violence](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-civil_war_violence_in_Libya), some between tribes, some perpetrated by Islamist extremists, some by Benghazi/Cyrenaica autonomists, some by Civil War militias who never disarmed and appear to have morphed into criminal gangs. And now [a rogue general has attacked Parliament,](http://apnews.excite.com/article/20140518/ml-libya-5cdb9593fa.html) blaming the government for allowing Islamist extremists to exert influence. Was it worth it? Worth what? Worth the money we spent? Worth the lives lost? Worth being involved at all? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2014, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/29 "2014-05-20T13:44:12Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Worth what? > > Worth the money we spent? Worth the lives lost? Worth being involved at all? Worth all the fighting and trouble – and worth it to the Libyans, not us. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/30 "2014-05-21T11:22:41Z")
Its very similar to Egypt the Muslim brotherhood and extremists needs to be locked up and not governing period. Let the secular andiderates do what they have to do. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/31 "2014-05-21T13:44:54Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Worth all the fighting and trouble – and worth it to the Libyans, not us. How can we decide if it’s worth it to the Libyans? You’d have to ask them. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/32 "2014-05-21T15:40:48Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > How can we decide if it’s worth it to the Libyans? You’d have to ask them. We discuss this kind of question here **all the time.** ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/33 "2014-05-21T15:44:15Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Its very similar to Egypt the Muslim brotherhood and extremists needs to be locked up and not governing period. Let the secular andiderates do what they have to do. “Andiderates”? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/34 "2014-05-21T16:23:43Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > We discuss this kind of question here **all the time.** **BrainGlutton** , you’re a bad person. You hand me such great snarkbait, and I can’t even properly move in on it in this forum. You’re a snarktease, that’s what you are :). ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/35 "2014-05-21T16:32:33Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > **BrainGlutton** , you’re a bad person. You hand me such great snarkbait, and I can’t even properly move in on it in this forum. You’re a snarktease, that’s what you are :). “I know what snarkers like, I know what trolls want . . .” ---
**Author:** ![Uniqueorn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uniqueorn/32/2807_2.png) [@Uniqueorn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uniqueorn)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2014, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/36 "2014-05-21T17:26:22Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > “Andiderates”? Just google it! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2014, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/37 "2014-05-22T21:57:41Z")
> [@Uniqueorn](#): > > Just google it! 😃 I did. This thread is the only hit. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2014, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/38 "2014-05-22T22:00:23Z")
The government is trying to defuse this by [calling a new election for June 25.](http://www.cnn.com/2014/05/20/world/africa/libya-violence/) Meamwhile, General Hifter (or Haftar – variant name transliterations from Arabic to Roman letters appears to be a persistent problem with Libyan leaders) [is calling for a “crisis cabinet.”](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-27507539) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2014, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/39 "2014-07-08T17:19:21Z")
[Well, here’s some good news, at least.](http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/7/3/libya-oil-crisis.html) > [@](#): > > Libya’s acting Prime Minister Abdullah al-Thinni announced Thursday that the government has reached a deal with a rebel leader controlling oil ports to hand over the last two terminals and end a blockade that crippled the OPEC nation’s petroleum industry. > > “We have successfully reached an agreement to solve the oil crisis. We have received today Ras Lanuf and Es Sider oil ports thankfully without the use of force,” Thinni said at Ras Lanuf terminal in eastern Libya. “I officially declare this is the end of the oil crisis.” > > Thinni said the ports had been reclaimed after an agreement with Ibrahim Jathran, whose fighters had seized the terminals almost a year ago to demand more regional autonomy. > > Jathran told reporters that he had handed over the ports as a “goodwill gesture” to the new parliament, which was elected last month. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2014, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697/40 "2014-07-08T17:31:14Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Err, no ? After The ACW the country was flat broke, owed money to many other countries to boot, earned the enmity of the most powerful nation on the face of the Earth and had jack squat to show for it except a piece of paper. > > That Free America lasted as long as it did is a miracle. One that owes a lot to France’s prowess at being a giant pain in England’s dick. I think you’re confusing the American Revolution with the American Civil War. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-libyan-revolution-was-it-worth-it/688697.md?page=3)