# The Little Mermaid is GASP! Black **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 7, 2019, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651 "2019-07-07T01:30:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/121 "2019-07-10T02:04:24Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Kirsten Dunst I’ll give you, though I would suspect those supporting the theory would say she predated the issue. > > They also cited Meg (and her mom) from A Wrinkle in Time, and Starfire (from Titans, I assume). Wally West from the Flash, and Jimmy Olson from Supergirl. I even found [this article saying it’s not only true but a good thing](https://www.revelist.com/pop-culture/zendaya-mary-jane/4346). > > I would not agree. Even if **Chronos** ’ reasoning is correct, I would consider it a problem if people with one characteristic were more likely to be racially recast. Especially if that characteristic is being ginger, i.e. one that has actually faced some discrimination of its own (albeit outside the US.) Hilariously, The Root (gah) tried to claim that Starfire was not just being played by a black woman. But is a black superhero being played by a black woman. IN THE COMICS. Starfire is a black woman? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/122 "2019-07-10T02:16:09Z")
Not only is the orange Starfire played by a black person in _Titans_, but the green Beast Boy is played by an Asian! (A not painted green Asian.) ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/123 "2019-07-10T02:22:08Z")
From that ravelist article [For one thing, roles for Black women in Hollywood are rare](For one thing, roles for Black women in Hollywood are rare) With a billion channels all having their own original programming?? I dunno. I think we live in a golden age for actors. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/124 "2019-07-10T02:24:03Z")
I knew that they changed Meg’s race (and that of her mom) in _A Wrinkle in Time_ (and for the record, thought it was a good artistic decision, in that specific case). But I never realized that Meg was originally red-haired. I’m pretty sure that my mental image of her was somewhere in the light brown-dark blond range, though I don’t remember if that’s ever stated in the books. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/125 "2019-07-10T02:29:26Z")
Since mermaids have no souls, and [neither do gingers](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gfRtgMWUgs), it’s appropriate that a the Little Mermaid should be played by a redhead. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/126 "2019-07-10T02:52:10Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Since mermaids have no souls, and [neither do gingers](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gfRtgMWUgs), it’s appropriate that a the Little Mermaid should be played by a redhead. Dude. Not to junior mod, [but](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVN_0qvuhhw)… 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/127 "2019-07-10T02:56:55Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > But I never realized that Meg was originally red-haired. She wasn’t. Her mother and her friend Calvin are both red-haired, but Meg’s hair is described as “mouse-brown”. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/128 "2019-07-10T03:11:57Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Anyways, the second idea I brought up (which no one has hooked on) is the one I thought might be more important: is Hollywood’s attempt at diversification focusing too much on black people, and forgetting about other minorities? How well represented are black people now? My half-white, half-Asian daughter was 15 when\* Mulan\* came out, which means she had no Disney Princess characters that “looked like her” when she was a kid. She identified with Belle, but she didn’t look anything like animated Belle, and certainly looks nothing like Emma Watson’s Belle. She very much likes Emma Watson, though, so she’s cool with her being cast as anyone. ---
**Author:** ![Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b2d939/32.png) [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Go_Arachnid_Laser_1)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/129 "2019-07-10T09:09:24Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Hilariously, The Root (gah) tried to claim that Starfire was not just being played by a black woman. But is a black superhero being played by a black woman. IN THE COMICS. Starfire is a black woman? I don’t know if Starfire even existed before Wolfman and Perez took over the Teen Titans, but [Perez gave Starfire afrolatina features](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/5XEAAOSwYm5a1rc9/s-l1600.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 9:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/130 "2019-07-10T09:23:05Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Shockingly, there’s been little reaction to the possibility that [Ursula the Sea Witch may be played by the non-purple non-white-haired non-tentacled Melissa McCarthy.](https://variety.com/2019/film/news/melissa-mccarthy-little-mermaid-ursula-1203217481/) Funnily enough, Ursula’s daughter appears in _Descendants 2_, played by the distinctly unpale [China Anne McClain](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Anne_McClain). But hey - remember that time when all those people lost their shit about them casting a swarthy hairy actor to play blond pale clean-shaven Aquaman? Yeah, me neither. (Although, knowing the internet, someone probably did.) ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/131 "2019-07-10T09:33:18Z")
> [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser](#): > > I don’t know if Starfire even existed before Wolfman and Perez took over the Teen Titans She did not. There were a couple other characters by that name, but Koriand’r first appeared in a 1985 story drawn by Perez. ---
**Author:** ![planetcory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/planetcory/32/1032_2.png) [@planetcory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/planetcory)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/132 "2019-07-10T12:23:32Z")
Starfire isn’t any earthly color. So it’s revealing how many people just defaulted her to white. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/133 "2019-07-10T12:24:33Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I would not agree. Even if **Chronos** ’ reasoning is correct, I would consider it a problem if people with one characteristic were more likely to be racially recast. **Especially if that characteristic is being ginger** , i.e. one that has actually faced some discrimination of its own (albeit outside the US.) Very few “gingers” are cast to play red-heads. What we typically get are actresses dying red their blonde or brunette hair. So even if a white person was cast to play these roles, it’s only _faux_ representation. Imagine Rachel Dolezal cast as a black character. That’s equivalent to what “ginger” casting largely is today. You can’t get any more faux than cartoon Ariel. All that red hair and not a freckle in sight, despite all that UV exposure? Right. A true red-head would be a flaky sunburned mess out there in the ocean; her unmet need would be a bottle of SPF 50, not love or a pair of legs. > [@](#): > > To be honest, Ariel being black wasn’t even the first thing I noticed–as the image I saw had the typical “Hollywood lightening” of the girl’s face. The first thing I noticed was the lack of red hair and wondered if she’d wear a wig. You know that black women dye their head red all the time, right? They are no different than white women in this respect. Overanalyzing the most mundane of mundane issues sends the impression that you think black people belong to a separate species or something. It’s cringey. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/134 "2019-07-10T13:05:44Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’ve actually know people who would be upset if she’s not played by a drag queen. I mean, her original design was based on one, and they want representation. Oh ugh ugh ugh ugh Ursula’s design may have been based on Divine but the actual voice actress from the animated film, Pat Carroll, is not a drag queen so it’s not like a role has been taken away from anyone. Disney already has a problem with queer-coded villains, let’s not actively make it worse. Melissa McCarthy is a fine workhorse casting choice. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/135 "2019-07-10T13:51:31Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > But hey - remember that time when all those people lost their shit about them casting a swarthy hairy actor to play blond pale clean-shaven Aquaman? Popular Facebook memes aside, Aquaman has been a joke since forever and the changes were seen as an attempt to make a derided character “cool” versus any sort of racial pandering. While I’m sure that classic Aquaman had his defenders, he’s hardly in the same popularity league as Ariel. I don’t give a crap what race Ariel is depicted as (or played by) but the two events aren’t really the same. Plus the message feels like “If you don’t lose your shit over these non-Aryan actors, you can’t lose your shit over these either” which I’m guessing isn’t going to result in greater acceptance and tolerance from the shit losing community. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/136 "2019-07-10T14:24:26Z")
> [@Go\_Arachnid\_Laser](#): > > I don’t know if Starfire even existed before Wolfman and Perez took over the Teen Titans, but [Perez gave Starfire afrolatina features](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/5XEAAOSwYm5a1rc9/s-l1600.jpg). I don’t really see it in your example, but Perez himself has said : In real life, let’s see now… Koriand’r, she’s so many characters I’ve used: Marilyn Monroe, my first wife, oh gosh, there was a stripper somewhere, …… . (Laughter.) She was so many. so there’s plenty of wiggle room there. Although elsewhere he’s also said she’s basically “Space Red Sonja”. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/137 "2019-07-10T14:32:16Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Anyways, the second idea I brought up (which no one has hooked on) is the one I thought might be more important: is Hollywood’s attempt at diversification focusing too much on black people, and forgetting about other minorities? How well represented are black people now? If the entire Little Mermaid cast is riddled with various non-whites, then it’s not Disney who is focusing too much on black people. It’s the people who are whining about Ariel who are focusing too much on black people. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/138 "2019-07-10T14:32:19Z")
Aquaman’s had a beard off-and-on since the mid-90s in the comics, so again it comes down to whether he’s “pale and blonde” or “swarthy”… I realize you were parodying, **Gyrate** , but yeah, some people did lose their shit. Probably used worse words in private, too… ---
**Author:** ![planetcory](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/planetcory/32/1032_2.png) [@planetcory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/planetcory)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/139 "2019-07-10T14:47:07Z")
The original plan for Aquaman was to tie Polynesian sea mythology into his origins. I’m pretty sure there would’ve more shit lost if they had continued on that less European course. ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2019, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651/140 "2019-07-10T15:55:53Z")
This decision to change Ariel’s race puzzles me. Granted, the original movie is 30 years old, but for those of you who think The Little Mermaid isn’t a fixture for girls today, you’re waaaay off base. Disney has spent millions upon millions of dollars over the past 30 years marketing the “old” version of Ariel in various ways, [and that hasn’t really slowed down much recently](https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=UwcmXe2OAaq5ggefmKigAQ&q=ariel+merchandise&oq=ariel+merchandise&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0l2j0i22i30l8.1929.5060..5488...2.0..0.263.1766.17j1j1......0....1..gws-wiz.....10..35i39j0i131j0i10j0i3.QoEU5Q0WgMI); in fact, Disney has just launched a new line of Ariel-themed merchandise to commemorate the film’s 30th anniversary. To change the physical appearance of the character now seems short-sighted, based on the massive investment they’ve made in her. It would be akin to making Mickey Mouse orange. (I realize Mickey is far more ubiquitous than Ariel, but you get my drift.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-little-mermaid-is-gasp-black/836651.md?page=8)