I just realized something. Now, like most TV shows, I doubt there is going to be an actual plot this intelligent.
In other threads it has been extensively discussed how difficult it would have been for Nazi Germany to carry out an invasion of the USA. Near impossible.
Except. What if, by some science fiction means, they could access future information, from their own projected future (“what will happen if we do what we plan to do”). Some super secret bunker somewhere, some crazy science fiction equipment lets them access information from their own future.
This explains the films. Also explains how the Nazis won - if they could somehow get exact blueprints for high end jet engines, compact nukes, and tactical information about where enemy forces are concentrated and the projected outcomes of specific battles, they would have won.
I think you’re on the right track, but it’ll turn out to be not just the Nazis. I think there are several parties with access to alternate universes. The Nazis found one that was either naturally ahead in tech or timeshifted ahead a few decades, and were able to use that to jumpstart their technology, as you suggest. Others see “our” universe, which is where most of the films came from. At least one other film came from another universe altogether. TMITHC, who I think isn’t actually Hitler, also has some ability to see in the future, which is how he gets the information he trades to the resistance.
The Nazis obviously have the most to lose if the tech really gets out there, so they try to collect the tapes and clamp down on the information flow as much as possible.
I haven’t read any other threads yet, but I finished the series and found it a terrible letdown. I agree that Smith was by far the best character and I liked every scene he was in, but I am pissed that I watched for ten hours and didn’t get an explanation for what the films were or who made them. What a waste of time.
That sucks. The show is also slow. I’ve only watched the first 7 episodes, and I had been planning to sprint through the last 3 in the hope of a hint for what this film thing is about.
It’s a basic story. You have protagonists, people chosen to make you feel sympathetic for them. The protagonists face some kind of conflict, something preventing them from reaching their goals. In the case of the character who is a secret Nazi agent, part of the conflict is internal as he does not want to betray a beautiful woman.
The unfortunate fact is our protagonists goals seem to be “let the bells of freedom ring” and there is no plausible means for them to accomplish this. 2 invading nations have already defeated them years ago. This film is the plot McGuffin, some hint at a way to address the fundamental problem, and by not actually going through with the storyline, just wasting the viewer’s time, it’s not a very good story.
The strong part of the story is the setting, like a classic play with top tier scenery. Some eye bleedingly good visuals, in the background you can see all kinds of fantastic vehicles the Nazis had as concept vehicles but never had the chance to really develop/put into mass production. They seem to have a supersonic jet among other things. But if you spend a hundred million dollars on the setting but don’t have a story…
I actually like this idea of the Nazis getting information from other timelines and such. That makes all the different films have an explanation and gives a way that the Nazis could have gotten better tech to win WWII.
I still enjoyed the show over all, though I do wish they had explained things better. I know PKD wrote some strange stuff, but usually it made some sense.
I’m not entirely sure why the need to explain the films or who made them. Are these folks not interested in additional seasons or something? Adding more films that demonstrated different information changes our perception of what the films are or could be. Tons of speculation involved, especially considering the person who is collecting a lot of the films.
I thoroughly enjoyed the show, particularly all the cultural and societal changes in Nazi America. Having never read the book, I foolishly assumed that there would be some sort of explanation about the significance of the films and the alternate time lines. So I was watching the series as sort of a mystery, trying to figure out the answer.
But from reading this thread, it seems there isn’t one. That puts it in the realm of Lost and other shows that never resolve the story and never intended to. Then they put the onus on the viewer to come up with some explanation.
If that’s the case, I’m probably out. Might tune in once in a while just to see what Obergruppenführer Smith is up to, but that’s it.
I didn’t realize it would have additional seasons, I thought it was more of a mini-series, fully-contained show. Is a second season even confirmed?
I thought it would at least answer some of the mysteries it started. The fact that it didn’t made me think of LOST, and how mysteries there were either never answered or by the time they were you no longer even cared.
The showrunner definitely wants a Season 2, so I’m sure that is part of his thinking. He didn’t plan this as just a mini-series.
And I guess I approve the answering of mysteries in a different way. As my favorite show on TV right now (and it isn’t even close) is The Leftovers, I’m perfectly fine with not answering the mysteries right away and instead dealing with how the mysteries affect people.
A second season with a definite ending and a minimum of Juliana, I would watch. An ongoing series, no. I got played by the X-Files in that sucker’s game. Never again.
Vox did a very cool interview with the showrunner:
About the films:
To him the most interesting part is, basically:
I think his focus is fascinating. In essence by making the Nazis American it forces us to confront that there was nothing specially evil about Germans.
I agree it is fascinating. One of my favorite scenes that sold me on the series, and I mean favorite in that I found it interesting and horrifying, was when the small town sheriff nonchalantly talked about how they burned “sick people and cripples” for “the good of the state”. I was like…wow.
Blah, blah, blah. Another, “it’s not about the mystery, it’s about the characters” excuse that TV writers with no imagination serve up when they can’t deliver a finale to the hook that kept the audience watching.
Or, you know… maybe the answers aren’t actually the interesting part and looking at television narratives in a different way may allow folks to see that?
The finale had quite a bit of a hook to keep me wanting a Season 2.
If the answers aren’t that interesting, then the whole mystery around the films shouldn’t have even been included. A dystopian alternate-reality show where the Axis won WWII and the Nazis are in control of the US and there are resistance groups banding together around the country is fascinating enough in itself. But when you make so much of the plot about What are the films!? Why does everyone want these films!? Who made these films!? Secrets secrets mystery mystery…, then well, the narrative becomes “What’s the deal with the films?” And to not answer that is cheap and lazy.
That works okay in a movie. In a TV series it shortly devolves into yanking the audience’s s collective crank. See Lost, The Prisoner, and Thd X-Files for reference.
I can see it being done either way. You could have a solution to the mystery and done properly it could be very compelling. You could also do it where it is a MacGuffin and have it be very interesting. Lost I don’t think is a good example. In Lost they were constantly answering questions but raising new ones, some would say raising more than were answered, which is why I lost (see what I did there) interest in the show. If the makers of this show want to go that route they should try to stay consistent and just let it be that. The films are important because. Because why? Because … shut up.
Personally, I like the story and the action and reaction of the characters to the world.
Again to be clear, it is equally doable to have a show where the film play a definite role, that is well defined and emerges from good storytelling. But it certainly isn’t necessary. YMMV.
Note: I’ve never seen The Prisoner or X-Files so I have no idea whether they are good examples or not.
