### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/1 "2020-12-28T08:49:12Z")
There is a solid practical argument to be made that if we want to put a serious dent in the upward curve of the virus, we should prioritize vaccinations for the self-centered jackwagons who are incapable of declining an opportunity for holiday socialization.
>
It may seem morally indefensible to reward these halfwit elbow-rubbers with early access to the vaccine, but from a purely utilitarian standpoint, it does make sense. They’ve amply demonstrated they have neither the intelligence nor the sense of social responsibility to modify their behavior. If your only goal is to ameliorate the crisis, they should be getting the early needle.
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### Author:  [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/2 "2020-12-28T08:53:56Z")
How many of those jackwagons believe covid is a hoax or are anti-vaxxers who would have to be forcibly held down to be vaccinated (I have an image of them being fed into cattle squeeze chutes used to immobilize farm animals while they’re vaccinated).
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### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/3 "2020-12-28T08:55:54Z")
In specific cases like these, I would not be opposed to applying a cattle brand as a tradeoff for early access to the vaccine, so others can benefit from knowing what kind of people they are.
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### Author:  [@eschrodinger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschrodinger)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/4 "2020-12-28T09:00:23Z")
It won’t work, though. The majority of people will generally be patient and wait their turn if the method of distribution seems fair. This would include anything up to completely random and arbitrary, but fair, distribution like drawing birthdates, I think.
But if it were expressly tied to “bad” behavior, then I think a lot of people would just figure that jumping the queue is fair game. They would either genuinely engage in the bad behavior in order to qualify, or just say that they did. I think there are multiple ways that distribution could work, but, even if it would make scientific sense, I think this idea would create more trouble than it would be worth on a practical level.
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### Author:  [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/5 "2020-12-28T09:31:50Z")
If we can identify them then we can prohibit them from getting the vaccine. They won’t mind, they don’t think they’re in danger of contracting the disease and probably wouldn’t bother to take the vaccine even if offered to them.
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### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/6 "2020-12-28T09:44:55Z")
But that’s my point. You don’t _want_ to prohibit them from being vaccinated, because they aren’t changing their behavior and they are contributing to superspreader events. From a standpoint of pure practicality (ethics/morals aside), vaccinating the party-hoppers will be a major factor in stabilizing society.
And to **eschrodinger** ’s point, you can eliminate the incentive by attaching a financial penalty to it. “If you are a congenital party animal, that’s fine, you will go to the head of the line for the needle, but every time you’re caught before then, the fine is half your monthly income.”
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### Author:  [@SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SayTwo)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/7 "2020-12-28T10:42:36Z")
I thought the vaccines don’t necessarily stop onward transmission? And I thought the growth was already slowing down?
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### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/8 "2020-12-28T10:55:45Z")
I’ve already told you not to expect me to respond to you outside of [the only forum where I can tell you what I actually think of you](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saytwo-is-an-ignorant-fuckstick-of-the-highest-order/924070/43).
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### Author:  [@SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SayTwo)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/9 "2020-12-28T13:03:21Z")
I do not need or wish for you in particular to respond to me, so please don’t feel a need to explain.
Has the science on this evolved so soon? Here’s [_Nature_](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-03441-8) from earlier this month:
> ## Do the vaccines prevent transmission of SARS-CoV-2?
>
> In addition to the Pfizer vaccine, regulators are poring over data from a similar [vaccine made by Moderna](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-03248-7) of Cambridge, Massachusetts, and a [third produced by AstraZeneca of Cambridge, UK, and the University of Oxford, UK](https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-03326-w). All three have been tested in large clinical trials, and have shown promise in preventing disease symptoms.
>
> But none has demonstrated that it prevents infection altogether, or reduces the spread of the virus in a population. This leaves open the chance that those who are vaccinated could remain susceptible to asymptomatic infection — and could transmit that infection to others who remain vulnerable. “In the worst-case scenario, you have people walking around feeling fine, but shedding virus everywhere,” says virologist Stephen Griffin at the University of Leeds, UK.
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### Author:  [@SayTwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SayTwo)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/10 "2020-12-28T13:54:16Z")
Here’s Scott Gottlieb suggesting the growth is slowing:
[https://twitter.com/ScottGottliebMD/status/1343207594811387904](https://twitter.com/ScottGottliebMD/status/1343207594811387904)
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### Author:  [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/11 "2020-12-28T14:10:29Z")
Health care settings are a more serious spread concern than secret LA parties. Trying to focus on party animals is silly.
Old people are mostly the ones dying from the disease. Once they are vaccinated, the upward trend of case numbers doesn’t matter so much.
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### Author:  [@Tfletch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tfletch1)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/12 "2020-12-28T15:20:41Z")
> [@Cervaise](#):
>
> If your only goal is to ameliorate the crisis, they should be getting the early needle.
And then promptly fine them and throw them in jail for having to waste a dose. That money goes straight into vaccine distribution and they won’t be spreading the virus in jail because they’re vaccinated. Win-win!
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### Author:  [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/13 "2020-12-28T15:23:19Z")
They’d have to be jailed for at least 3 or 4 weeks, depending on which vaccine they get, to ensure that the second dose is administered, too. Because you know they’ll think one is enough or that they shouldn’t have to take any.
Arrest 'em, vaccinate them, jail them, give them the second dose, then let them go after charging them for food, shelter, and all the other things keeping them in jail costs.
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### Author:  [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/14 "2020-12-28T15:40:53Z")
Sounds great. Americans do love jailing Americans!
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### Author:  [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/15 "2020-12-28T17:13:18Z")
> [@SayTwo](#):
>
> ## Do the vaccines prevent transmission of SARS-CoV-2?
As has been pointed out on other threads, this article just notes that we just have NO DATA YET on how well the vaccines prevent transmission from vaccinated people. And therefore, for the time being, people who are vaccinated should continue to wear masks and follow social distancing guidelines.
But this is only because data on transmission _from_ vaccinated people data are difficult data to obtain from trials. A priori, since we know that the vaccines induce a robust immune response, we have every reason to think that they will reduce transmission as well as reduce disease. We just don’t have proof yet.
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### Author:  [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/16 "2020-12-28T18:08:52Z")
> [@Cervaise](#):
>
> It may seem morally indefensible to reward these halfwit elbow-rubbers with early access to the vaccine, but from a purely utilitarian standpoint, it does make sense.
As has been noted, we know these vaccinations have \>90% efficacy in preventing disease. But we have no data on how well they prevent transmission _from_ the person being vaccinated. It’s unlikely that we will find that there is _no_ reduction in transmission, but it could easily be a much smaller number than 90%.
In any event, a significant portion of the benefit from vaccination accrues to the person being vaccinated, not to society at large.
I don’t know if the OP is meant seriously or not, but the serious answer is that we should be punishing irresponsible behavior, not rewarding it.
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### Author:  [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/17 "2020-12-28T18:24:02Z")
But of course, vaccines aren’t a reward.
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### Author:  [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/18 "2020-12-28T18:26:58Z")
> [@FigNorton](#):
>
> vaccines aren’t a reward
You’ll have to explain that comment. Demand vastly exceeds supply.
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### Author:  [@FigNorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FigNorton)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/19 "2020-12-28T18:29:12Z")
So we’re “rewarding” old people by targeting them for early vaccination? I don’t see what needs explaining. Vaccine rollout is planned to curb deaths, not reward people.
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### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [December 28, 2020, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-masque-of-the-vid-death/929077/20 "2020-12-28T18:34:06Z")
My OP is not a completely serious suggestion, mostly because it would never fly. But it is worth thinking about that basic underlying assumption: If your goal is a broad improvement in public health, then your most effective target is the cohort of selfish assholes who are making things worse for everyone else.
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