# The Media Treatment of Rand Paul - Knee Jerk Reactionism by Mental Midgets **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 23, 2010, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445 "2010-05-23T08:12:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/341 "2010-05-29T18:58:58Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > I hope he gets elected, learns the ropes and overtime I believe he can become a political force for libertarians. He has made some rookie mistakes. I give him a pass because I understand the underlying philosophy. I think he will learn over time. So you’re a better libertarian than Rand Paul? The man you refer to as brilliant? What does that make you? Mega-brilliant? ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/342 "2010-05-29T19:06:18Z")
> [@kingbighair](#): > > You are arguing from a philosophical standpoint, not from economics. Did you read any of those links? Or did you do the same thing you were complaining about that other people were doing and just gloss over them? > > If you are doing a mental exercise, you are right. No business would limit its customers because it exists in a hypercompetitive environment and would quickly fold when customers flock to the competition. That’s what the Austrian school says. But guess what? The real world is not a mental exercise. Often there are only a couple businesses in the area. If, like I posted in the other thread, the most popular club out of only a couple in the city discriminates entry based on race, where else are you going to go? And what if you live in a very racially homogeneous area, and the residents do not really mind if some other race is being discriminated against? These are very real situations. > > The fact that you and the people of your age group in your area are not racist does not mean society is the same. I think you will be right in 25-30 years. But we are not there yet. This is why I say you are not living in reality. In reality, racial discrimination is very prevalent. Look at the major corporations linked above that have admitted to discriminating in employment based on race. Did you see those cases all over the news? Doubtful. If these stories did not make major headlines and produced no major, effective backlash, why do you think local businesses would? > > How do you respond to the Denny’s and Pizza Hut cases I linked? Those were very real situations where black customers were discriminated against. Where is this huge public backlash you suggested would be inevitable? I read the articles. I have not and would never claim that racial discrimination doesn’t exist. Non of these cases was an example of policy being to not allow black people to eat at these restaurants. Nobody put up a sign saying “Whites Only”. These appear to be isolated incidents and there was plenty of public outcry. Another case I saw regarding Denny’s said this: \*"In the latest lawsuit against Denny’s, an African American family in East St. Louis, Illinois sued the restaurant chain for racial discrimination and has been awarded $600,000 in damages by a federal jury. Sandra Green says that when her family went out to eat at Denny’s Restaurant, a white waiter deliberately ignored them and used racial slurs when the family finally did get service. Denny’s later fired the waiter."\* This was the case of a racist employee embarrassing the company. I am not defending this in any way, shape or form. I have read many cases like this, and in nearly every case there is a public backlash. What would happen if a business chain’s policy is to exclude black people? What if a business put up a Whites Only sign? The outcry would be deafening. You are right that racism still exists but it is on the way out. I don’t defend Property Rights because I condone racist behavior, I defend them so the government doesn’t confiscate your property through eminent domain. If you purchase your property, you should own it. You should be able to do what you like without permits and government harassment if you don’t harm anybody else. And, also, I believe the same effects that proponents of Civil Rights support could be accomplished without sacrificing the principle of property ownership in the process. I think this could be accomplished. We cannot legislate away racism. In fact, government policies typically inflame racial tensions rather than ease them. I see where you are coming from but I believe the principle of who owns private property is too important to violate even for so noble a goal as fighting discrimination. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/343 "2010-05-29T19:06:58Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > Why do we have a Department of Education then? We have had “Head Start”, “No Child Left Behind” and similar federal initiatives for a long time. The idea that K-12 is not heavily controlled by the Federal Government is not consistent with the facts. No Child Left Behind took effect in 2002. > [@](#): > > I personally don’t want any government involvement in education. The key is allowing every student choices for where they go to school. Money is not the issue, competition is. Would you support a voucher program? What if the Federal Government sent out a voucher to the parent of every child for, say $7000-$8000. And it could be used to go to any private school. Would you support this? It would give people choices for education and they could get out of the government monopolized school system entirely. Do I understand this correctly; you want to reduce the federal deficit by sending $8,000 to every school-age child in the country? For that matter, you seem to have argued that federal reimbursement of Medicare and Medicaid patients has destroyed the quality of health care, but you want federal reimbursement for all K-12 education? ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/344 "2010-05-29T19:13:39Z")
> [@Mince](#): > > When the OP gets banned, for his benefit I recommend he [go here,](http://www.prisonplanet.com/) where his political canons will be indiscriminately accepted and praised, though he likely already knows that. Obviously, I’ve done nothing that merits being banned. I’m just sorry you feel so threatened by a contrary voice on this forum. I don’t just associate with people who agree with me. I put my views out there for a debate, not for people to reinforce what I already believe. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/345 "2010-05-29T19:18:37Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > Here is the question you need to ask yourself: From 1930-1970 we had by far the best health care system in the world. This wasn’t in dispute. And we had more or less free markets, competition and choice. Most people paid for doctors visits out of pocket. You really want to include the Depression years in that? I need a cite for this as I flatly disbelieve it. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/346 "2010-05-29T19:22:28Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > I’m going to tackle this one specifically, because it is beyond dumb: _The United State’s also has the most private enterprise involvement in health care of any industrialized country. But somehow these clowns think that by going even further down that road we will make it better._ > > We don’t have private enterprise involvement. We have Corporatism, lobbyists, Drug company lobbyists, government regulations and government involvement in all accounts. We have hardly any free market involvement whatsoever. If there’s no private enterprise involvement, who do you think is paying all these lobbyists? > [@](#): > > Here is the question you need to ask yourself: From 1930-1970 we had by far the best health care system in the world. This wasn’t in dispute. And we had more or less free markets, competition and choice. Most people paid for doctors visits out of pocket. > > Since then, we have seen the quality of health care go way down,… Average life expectancy for a white male born 1929-1931 - 59.12 years Average life expectancy for a white male born in 2004 - 75.7 years [Cite.](http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0005140.html) Yeah, the quality of our health care has just gone to hell since 1930. ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/347 "2010-05-29T19:25:03Z")
> [@](#): > > But if a society wants good public health at a reasonable cost, the profit-seeking market mechanisms are not efficient at providing it. It is much easier for individual insurers to profit via counterproductive shortcuts like cherry-picking the lowest-risk customers, rejecting customers who are already sick, using loopholes to deny coverage for claims, and seeking lawsuit opportunities to recover claim payments via damages awarded for negligence. > > The private insurance industry cares jack shit about whether Americans in general have good public health or decent health care coverage. And the invisible hand isn’t effective enough in this case to make it worth while for them to care. > > Public health is a social good that is riddled with positive externalities, meaning that lots of its benefits are disseminated in ways that can’t be captured for a fee. Therefore, reasonably priced universal and effective health care is not intrinsically a profit-making business. > > Other countries have figured this out, and have shifted the main burden of health care coverage provision to the non-market mechanisms that are best able to handle it, leaving markets free to concentrate on the widget-type enterprises that they’re so good at. Our libertarian market-fundamentalists, though, with their blind conviction that markets can do no wrong, will simply never admit that there’s any such thing as a market failure or any area where government intervention is the solution rather than the problem. Here you demonstrate a stunningly poor understanding of how free markets work. Health Insurance companies are not free markets at all. They are a third party payer system. This is what a free market in medicine would look like: I want to see a doctor so I shop around to see who is the best. I pay exclusively out of pocket for all basic tests and procedures. All these doctors are competing for my business so they offer competitive prices to seek me as a patient. This lowers the costs. Quality rises due to the competition among doctors. Go to a cosmetic dentist or a acupuncturist or alternative doctor and see how they treat you if you doubt what I say. Literally, nobody pays out of pocket for doctors anymore. The price is fixed, everybody is charged the maximum. There is no price competition among doctors. There are regulations, massive paperwork that adds to the cost and much more. Insurance is supposed to measure risk. That is, if you have health insurance you should only need it if you have a heart attack or a stroke and need to stay in the hospital for a while or some other catastrophic health condition happens that is unexpected. For the rest, you should be paying out of pocket for your health care. There should be doctor choice, no HMOs, just freely fluctuating prices and private doctors competing for your business. This would lead to dramatically lowered prices and increased quality. THAT is what a free market in medicine would look like. Incidentally, that was how medicine was in the 60s before the mandated HMOs, Medicare, the Health Insurance and Pharmaceutical lobby fucked things up for everyone. And it worked pretty well. ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/348 "2010-05-29T19:28:59Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Break up the teachers union, did you say? All those free, responsible people who have joined together to negotiate and sign contracts? > > Your reasoning astounds me. Teachers can’t be fired anymore. They are not responsible. There are good unions and there are corrupt and destructive unions. Check out these links and get back to me: > **[AFT Facts](https://aftfacts.com/)** > **[UFC Streaming](https://t.me/s/ufc_streaming_live)** > > UFC Paris • UFC Streaming > 🔁 Suivez tous les combats UFC en streaming live — UFC Paris, UFC (Fight Night, PPV) et plus encore. > 📌 Liens haute qualité, notifications instantanées, analyses & moments forts. > ➡️ Rejoignez-nous pour ne rien rater de... > **[Teacher's Unions Exposed](http://trueteaching.blogspot.com/2009/10/nea-info.html)** > > National Education Association (NEA) National Headquarters 1201 16th Street, NW Washington, DC 20036 Basic Facts: Total Receipts - $35... By the way, why not respond to my other points about education reform? There was a lot more than just teachers unions on my agenda. ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/349 "2010-05-29T19:38:01Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > In post #157 I asked:. > Will you please answer this question, **jrodefeld**? Yes, it certainly is. There are quite a few people I respect that disagree with Libertarianism on some aspects. As long as some thought is put into the positions. I do think that many people don’t really take the time to understand these positions. That is my experience. Although I am dwelling on the differences, I believe there are many positions that libertarians and liberals can agree on, like: Ending the wars overseas and cutting the defense budget Allowing Gay Marriage and repealing Don’t Ask Don’t Tell (Ron Paul was one of the only Republicans to vote to repeal it) Ending the War on Drugs Ending Corporate Welfare and Agricultural Subsidies Auditing the Federal Reserve Allowing increased transparency and accountability on all levels of government. Finding bipartisan ways to fix the budget and reduce the deficit I’m sure there is more than that. I agree with liberals on quite a few things. I get frustrated when they excuse Obama for betraying them time and again however. That doesn’t mean we can’t work together to get some of these things accomplished. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/350 "2010-05-29T19:43:54Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > Quality rises due to the competition among doctors. Go to a cosmetic dentist or a acupuncturist or alternative doctor and see how they treat you if you doubt what I say. Cosmetic dentistry, accupuncture, and alternative doctors (whatever that means) are examples of the quality of health care we could expect under a fully private system. Seriously? Depends on how you measure quality, I guess. Better magazines in the waiting room, soft music playing while I’m producing a urine sample, hotter nurses; it’s things like that that will make you stand out in a highly competitive market. ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/351 "2010-05-29T19:45:39Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Six pages of posts, a few hours of youtube videos, several tens of thousands of words of cites and you finally present an appropriate debate topic. > > If this was what you wanted to discuss, why the fuck didn’t you say so in the first place? I think what I presented already was an “appropriate” debate topic. The difference between private property and government property, the media treatment of Rand Paul, libertarian ideology, Free Market vs corporate and government health care, etc. I’m glad I finally got to a topic _ **you** _ approve of. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/352 "2010-05-29T19:46:58Z")
Question deleted ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/353 "2010-05-29T19:51:18Z")
> [@](#): > > You know who was the one who brought up the Nobel Prize as an award indicative of one’s authority on a given subject? You. Yeah, thats why I said sometimes they get it right. Its certainly not the only qualification that I would champion for my cause. I would also argue that the Nobel commission has gotten significantly more politicized and less objective in the forty years or so since Hayek won. I mean, nobody can claim that Al Gore and Barack Obama deserve that prize. Come on. ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/354 "2010-05-29T19:58:07Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Be careful what you wish for. It might become widely known how [close Ron Paul is to the John Birch Society](http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/409):You idol is a right wing crackpot. Give me a break. I don’t support the John Birch Society, but I know they have been somewhat unfairly demonized over the years. Ron Paul is NOT a member. He spoke to them. He also sometimes speaks with Alex Jones, but he doesn’t endorse his positions on the issues. You cannot continue this guilt by association thing. Some members of the John Birch Society support Ron Paul. Some potheads support Ron Paul. Some College Students support Ron Paul. Some conspiracy theorists support Ron Paul. Some Christians support Ron Paul. Some Antiwar activists support Ron Paul. And, yes, even some racists support Ron Paul. It is a fallacious argument to claim that Ron Paul supports the views of all these different groups of people. He cannot be held accountable for everything some supporter of his believes. You are going to have to do better than calling him a “crackpot”. Go down the list, tell me every position that is batshit crazy that he holds. ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/355 "2010-05-29T20:04:33Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Why are you avoiding this simple question I asked in posts #157 and #234, **jrodefeld**? > > Do you think it is possible for others to think these arguments through, understand them, and still disagree with them? I did. I am a couple pages behind. I am trying to answer every post if I can. Yes, it is possible to understand libertarian positions and still disagree with them. Of course I am partial to my own views. ---
**Author:** ![UTejas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UTejas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UTejas)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/356 "2010-05-29T20:05:25Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > Yeah, thats why I said sometimes they get it right. Its certainly not the only qualification that I would champion for my cause. I would also argue that the Nobel commission has gotten significantly more politicized and less objective in the forty years or so since Hayek won. I mean, nobody can claim that Al Gore and Barack Obama deserve that prize. Come on. No, but Al Gore and Barack Obama won the **Nobel Peace Prize**. The peace prize is, for better or worse, often awarded on achievements that are more or less current. Connecting raising awareness of global warming to the cause of peace is a little strained. Similarly, Obama’s Nobel was an award designed to use the force of his prize to urge his presidency to pursue peace. Both are strained explanations but it’s Oslo’s prize to give as they see fit. The **Nobel Memorial Prize in Economic Sciences** , like the literary and scientific prizes, is awarded years or even decades after the relevant work or body of work so that its significance can be properly put into context. The economics prize is extremely prestigious, and Hayek and Krugman were deserving winners. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/357 "2010-05-29T20:05:34Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > Teachers can’t be fired anymore. They are not responsible. There are good unions and there are corrupt and destructive unions. Check out these links and get back to me: > > [http://teachersunionexposed.com/](http://teachersunionexposed.com/) > > [http://www.thecartelmovie.com/](http://www.thecartelmovie.com/) > > [The Truth About "Schooling": Teacher's Unions Exposed](http://trueteaching.blogspot.com/2009/10/nea-info.html) And how did they get to where they are? If teachers unions have managed to negotiate provisions in their contracts that secure jobs for their members, don’t those contracts have to be honored? I don’t know who negotiates on behalf of the public (is it the school board?), but if they wanted the right to fire bad teachers, they should have put it in the contract. Probably would have had to give in on some other issue, like money. I also find it somewhat against your libertarian ideals to break up the teachers unions. Who’s going to do this breaking up, the federal government? That means laws, regulations, enforcement, and a budget to pay for those things. What’s libertarian about that? > [@](#): > > By the way, why not respond to my other points about education reform? There was a lot more than just teachers unions on my agenda. I picked that one item (and a few others, recently) for two reasons. One, you seem to be quite outnumbered and lagging behind the current posts already. There are plenty of plates spinning in this thread without adding more. Two, you are the OP, and your argument seems to be quite dogmatic and inflexible. To argue against it, I only need to find the weakest points to start making the first cracks. I would rather make one point simply and clearly than try to crush someone under the weight of a long, point-by-point treatise. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/358 "2010-05-29T20:07:00Z")
> [@jrodefeld](#): > > I think what I presented already was an “appropriate” debate topic. The difference between private property and government property, the media treatment of Rand Paul, libertarian ideology, Free Market vs corporate and government health care, etc. I’m glad I finally got to a topic _ **you** _ approve of. :rolleyes: “An” appropriate debate topic? “An”? Then you go on to list at least 5 topics? Thanks for illustrating my point re: the OP’s clarity and focus. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/359 "2010-05-29T20:10:04Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > And how did they get to where they are? The free market allows teachers to organize and collectively bargain with their employers. Something must be done! (libertarianially, of course) ---
**Author:** ![jrodefeld](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/59ef9b/32.png) [@jrodefeld](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrodefeld)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445/360 "2010-05-29T20:14:50Z")
> [@](#): > > He’s a flake, that’s why. There’s no need to “smear” him. MSNBC isn’t the “left wing media”; there IS no left wing equivalent of Fox in America. Well, you can have your opinion. By the way, Rand Paul, to me is nowhere close to being the model of libertarianism the way Ron Paul is. I think he has potential, but we will have to see how it goes. The focus of this thread is more on libertarian belief that influenced Rand and Ron Paul and the merits of that belief. > [@](#): > > Garbage. America is a deeply bigoted nation. Remove the rules against them and whites-only establishments would spring up like mushrooms. Entire towns would go white-only just like the old days. This statement is completely unbelievable. Where do you live? What possible indications do you have that there is that level of racism in this country? The only place I could see it ever happening are in certain small, backwards pockets of the deep South. Even then I think they would get shit for it. Don’t you think we’ve made even a little bit of progress in fifty years? Don’t you see that the reason we had a civil rights bill in the first place was due to the public outcry? > [@](#): > > And it exemplifies one of the key errors of libertarianism; the baseless conviction that non-governmental groups and powerful individuals aren’t just as prone to corruption and abuse than the government, with fewer means of reigning them in. The power one wields with the Federal Government is second to none. People are prone to corruption and so are business owners and State governments. Their ability to do harm is much less. You still didn’t acknowledge the issue which is, you are saying people are backwards and dumb and we need a Federal Government to regulated personal behavior or else we will revert to the dark ages. I am saying that the government is just a reflection of the people. How do you think they will do a better job than the people themselves? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-media-treatment-of-rand-paul-knee-jerk-reactionism-by-mental-midgets/540445.md?page=19)