# The missing voice in the gun control debates **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 26, 2013, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422 "2013-01-26T08:06:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/141 "2013-02-06T02:29:19Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > **Ex-Tank** - what’s a BCG? [BCGs (old school)](http://www.armytimes.com/news/2012/01/military-eyeglasses-recruits-012012w/) ---
**Author:** ![rogerbox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/76d3ee/32.png) [@rogerbox](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rogerbox)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/142 "2013-02-06T03:02:54Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > My day-to-day observations of customers at gun stores and gun shows jibes with yours. I’m seeing more (not a lot, but more) blacks\* > \*Not gang-bagers or gangsta wannabes; just ordinary folks. Wow. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/143 "2013-02-06T03:13:47Z")
> [@Condescending\_Robot](#): > > I know and you know that all sorts of people buy guns, but one of the reasons that those populations aren’t visible gun owners (besides the general rhetorical help it provides to the confiscation side to only call upon neo-Confederates bent on a race war to fill the “gun rights guy to be yelled at by talk show host” slot on CNN) is that the NRA has hijacked gun rights to be about some broader conservative bullshit agenda that is very explicitly anti-immigrant and white-supremacist. The best thing we as gun rights supporters could do is make it clear that one can have a principled, absolutist stance on guns without associating with that particular group. I disagree. The leftist Hollywierd media machine has portrayed gun owners as conservative white-supremacist “bubbas” for so long that the meme stuck, and the NRA has never bothered to counter it. I do agree that for the longest time, at least the simple majority of the gun cultutre _was_ the predominantly white conservative suburban/rural type, and typically male. I think it’s slowly changing, and becoming more heterogenous. I think the NRA needs to resurrect and reinvigorate the “I’m the NRA” ad campaign with a focus on diversity. Jews for the Preservation of Firearm Ownership, and Pink Pistols, needs to be gladly embraced by the NRA; it may cost some old-school rank-and-file members, but I think it will garner more (and more worthy) broad-based support in the general population of non-NRA gun owners. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/144 "2013-02-06T13:57:48Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > [BCGs (old school)](http://www.armytimes.com/news/2012/01/military-eyeglasses-recruits-012012w/) Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/145 "2013-02-06T18:16:45Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > I disagree. The leftist Hollywierd media machine . . . :rolleyes: That bullshit **again?!** ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/146 "2013-02-06T21:22:59Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > :rolleyes: That bullshit **again?!** Is _that_ your only quibble? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/147 "2013-02-06T23:03:56Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > [BCGs (old school)](http://www.armytimes.com/news/2012/01/military-eyeglasses-recruits-012012w/) Yeah, but now they’re worn by hipsters. Which makes them even worse. ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/148 "2013-02-07T02:42:32Z")
> [@rogerbox](#): > > Wow. :rolleyes: Okay, I can see on review how that comment could very easily be taken out of context. I don’t always remember that not everyone else has my background and experiences, so let me clarify (bear in mind I’m not a liberal or politically correct): The vast majority of people I’ve seen at the gun shows I’ve attended for the past 15-16 years are just ordinary folks of every size, shape, and color you can conceive of humanity. If you were standing in line next to them at the grocery store, you wouldn’t bat an eye. But the vast majority of them have also been white. But, on occasion, you would see [this.](http://shylocksbane.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/ha_hs.jpg) And [This.](http://cdn.motinetwork.net/imsogangsta.org/gangsta/1101/rapper-thug-slim-somebody-rapper-rerun-gangsta-1294361255.jpg) Unfortunately, for the longest time, the latter was a greater proportion of the blacks I saw at gun shows. Equally unfortunately, the former was the pervasive stereotype amongst the virulently anti-gun people I’ve met online. Lately, I’ve been seeing more and more of [this.](http://www.netbrawl.com/uploads/adec4bc2f473b17a9d166e0e94d83cbe.jpg) Or, more seriously, people like [this.](http://img2-3.timeinc.net/people/i/2012/news/120806/sherman-hemsley-1-300.jpg) **Condescending Robot** , while I disagree with him, does make a valid point about the perceptions of the NRA and gun owners amongst non-whites. I see that changing more nowadays, and would like to see it change even more. Not just perceptually, but _actually._ I _want_ more everyday folks (even if they look like [this,](http://www.teenvogue.com/images/fashion/fall-trends/2012-08/goth-glam-beauty-look-01.jpg) or [this](http://chicagorants.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/hipster-looks-like-robert-lee1.jpg)), and gays, and Asians, and Latinos, and everone else to actually become safe, happy gun owners and members of the gun culture. Because then the perception of the gun culture amongst anti-gun politicians and the greater public won’t necessarily be [this.](http://seniorark.com/Humor/Redneck%20Things/Redneck%20Images/redneck.gif) And _then_ the politics of division will be _much_ less effective. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/149 "2013-02-07T03:13:22Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Yeah, but now they’re worn by hipsters. Which makes them even worse. How did the hipster burn his tongue? He was eating pizza before it was cool! ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/150 "2013-02-07T03:45:18Z")
> [@ExTank](#): > > But, on occasion, you would see [this.](http://shylocksbane.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/ha_hs.jpg) And [This.](http://cdn.motinetwork.net/imsogangsta.org/gangsta/1101/rapper-thug-slim-somebody-rapper-rerun-gangsta-1294361255.jpg) Looks like a good argument for [discretionary issuance/denial of carry-permits.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=681321) ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/151 "2013-02-07T04:16:52Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Yeah, but now they’re worn by hipsters. Which makes them even worse. Hey, if it keeps them from breeding… ---
**Author:** ![ExTank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/35a633/32.png) [@ExTank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ExTank)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/152 "2013-02-07T04:18:57Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Looks like a good argument for [discretionary issuance/denial of carry-permits.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=681321) And your argument looks like an argument for “pre-crime.” You can’t deny rights to people based upon how they look, whether they share your skin color or not. This pasty white conservative seems to have a better grasp of “equality under the rule of law” than you. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/153 "2013-02-07T05:54:16Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Looks like a good argument for [discretionary issuance/denial of carry-permits.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=681321) You should also include a photo of Martin Luther King, Jr. He applied for a permit after his house was bombed in 1956 but the state of Alabama decided he didn’t need one. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/154 "2013-02-07T05:56:32Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > You should also include a photo of Martin Luther King, Jr. He applied for a permit after his house was bombed in 1956 but the state of Alabama decided he didn’t need one. He seems to have done well enough without one; being armed would not have saved his life. James Earl Ray **not** being armed would have. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2013, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422/155 "2013-02-07T22:45:19Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > He seems to have done well enough without one; being armed would not have saved his life. James Earl Ray **not** being armed would have. So, based on his looks, it was okay for MLK, Jr. to be denied a permit to carry a concealed firearm? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-missing-voice-in-the-gun-control-debates/648422.md?page=7)