# The moderation here is getting ridiculously heavy handed **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [July 23, 2014, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869 "2014-07-23T19:46:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/61 "2014-07-23T23:21:28Z")
This moderation has been, front to back, a mess. I cannot fathom how [mentioning where the topic of satire took place](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17573658&postcount=23) is a warnable offense. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/62 "2014-07-23T23:22:10Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > This has already been stated several times in this thread, by various moderators. Clear? Direct quote from the closed Pit thread: “If you have a problem with the way the board is moderated, the proper place for it is ATMB, not the Pit.” Warning issued to GrandWino for doing exactly what that mod suggested (IMHO). I can understand the confusion. So no, not clear. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/63 "2014-07-23T23:23:00Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > What! You missed the last time he did that? Okay, now that is funny. ---
**Author:** ![Emiliana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@Emiliana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emiliana)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/64 "2014-07-23T23:23:34Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > I’d comment, but I’m unsure of the rules anymore, and I honestly have no clue what is allowable and what isn’t anymore. That’s pretty amazing considering there is only really one rule here, and that’s don’t be a jerk. I’m not seeing any jerks here. The rule: any complaint about moderation that involves, directly or indirectly, Czarcasm is not a complaint about moderation but rather than an insult directed at Czarcasm. I don’t think Czarcasm is asking for all this special protection so I’m not sure why it’s being provided. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/65 "2014-07-23T23:25:02Z")
I would further suggest that “complaining about getting a warning” is never a frivolous complaint, and opening a single thread about the warning in question should never be a warnable offense. I re-read GrandWino’s thread here in ATMB, and I cannot understand how it drew a warning. I’d extend that courtesy to trolls, racists, and whoever else has skated by with fewer warnings for more egregious offenses, even. There should never be repercussions for explicitly following the rules and questioning a warning in the proper way. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Barchetta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/da6949/32.png) [@Red\_Barchetta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Barchetta)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/66 "2014-07-23T23:25:39Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > I’m not seeing any jerks here. Must…refrain…from…obvious…counterpoint ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/67 "2014-07-23T23:28:52Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > “So-and-so gets away with things that others don’t” is going to be moderated as a personal insult going forward, yes, it’s clear. “So-and-so gets away with things that others don’t” is an accusation: that is firmly and clearly and unambiguously aimed at the moderators. I don’t think that there is an issue with that statement being posted here. As I pointed out in the other thread though, the statement that got moderated went beyond simply making that accusation. The full statement was: "I thought we all decided there was a Czarcasm exception to that rule? You know, like a cop not giving another cop’s wife a ticket for something that anyone else would have gotten a ticket for. " That went beyond simply making a comment about the moderation: and directly called out the moderating staff as “being corrupt”, and IMHO, was rightly moderated. The accusation that Czarcasm gets away with stuff that other people don’t is, again, IMHO, not proven. I cited a thread in GQ with much worse behaviour where people were not moderated, despite reports. I’m not a fan of Czarcasm or his posting style. But this pile on is not based on objective evidence: but on subjective opinion. If you want to show that Czarcasm is not treated the same as other posters: you guys really need to show more evidence than what has been posted so far. Cause I’m not seeing it. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/68 "2014-07-23T23:29:31Z")
> [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > WTF is going on around here? I hope the first person to figure that out will enlighten the rest of us. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/69 "2014-07-23T23:30:14Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > “So-and-so gets away with things that others don’t” is going to be moderated as a personal insult going forward, yes, it’s clear. What’s not clear is: Isn’t “so-and-so gets away with things that others don’t” also a comment on moderation? If so, does this mean that there is no forum on the board where you can say “so-and-so gets away with things that others don’t”? You know the answer to this, and I suspect you’re just provoking, but I’ll answer you anyway. The accusation that the moderators allow someone to “get away” with something that someone else got scolded for, is an issue that can be raised in ATMB. The focus should be calm and rational decision (no spittle, please.) The focus should also be on a specific situation, with links, since a generic accusation is meaningless. We believe that we can distinguish pretty easily between a serious accusation and mere “recreational outrage.” The moderator could agree with you, and rescind the scolding; or could scold the other person; or could disagree with you and stick by their original decision – for example, if the two situations are NOT similar, even though you see them as such. OK? PS - Sorry, in the time that I was composing this and before posting, I see **Banquet Bear** already said this, more concisely than I did. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/70 "2014-07-23T23:32:22Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > Personal insults are not permitted in this forum, not even if disguised as “a lot of people observe…” Warning issued. I challenge this warning. I did not intend any insult, nor do I see how my remarks could reasonably be construed as insulting. Review. : You stated: _“some feel that Giraffe gets preferential treatment as an ex-moderator”_ Assuming that you were making a mistake, I replied that I have never seen such an accusation levelled against Giraffe. I then named the individual who does sometimes get that accusation. No insult intended, just offering a correction to your presumed mistake. I did not state or imply that I agree with the accusation. Edit: What’s more, according to you: - The accusation that the moderators allow someone to “get away” with something that someone else got scolded for, is an issue that can be raised in ATMB. \* Why, then, should I get warned just for discussing that very thing? ---
**Author:** ![Reyemile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@Reyemile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reyemile)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/71 "2014-07-23T23:34:13Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > You know the answer to this, and I suspect you’re just provoking, but I’ll answer you anyway. The accusation that the moderators allow someone to “get away” with something that someone else got scolded for, is an issue that can be raised in ATMB. The focus should be calm and rational decision (no spittle, please.) The focus should also be on a specific situation, with links, since a generic accusation is meaningless. We believe that we can distinguish pretty easily between a serious accusation and mere “recreational outrage.” > > The moderator could agree with you, and rescind the scolding; or could scold the other person; or could disagree with you and stick by their original decision – for example, if the two situations are NOT similar, even though you see them as such. > > OK? So to clarify: “Gets away with things” is a personal attack because it’s broad and could be seen as a general attack on posting habits, but “Gets away with things XXXX and YYYY as seen in these threads” is acceptable because its a factual discussion. Is that correct? ---
**Author:** ![x-ray\_vision](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/x-ray_vision/32/351_2.png) [@x-ray\_vision](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/x-ray_vision)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/72 "2014-07-23T23:35:30Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > You know the answer to this, and I suspect you’re just provoking, but I’ll answer you anyway. The accusation that the moderators allow someone to “get away” with something that someone else got scolded for, is an issue that can be raised in ATMB. The focus should be calm and rational decision (no spittle, please.) The focus should also be on a specific situation, with links, since a generic accusation is meaningless. We believe that we can distinguish pretty easily between a serious accusation and mere “recreational outrage.” > > The moderator could agree with you, and rescind the scolding; or could scold the other person; or could disagree with you and stick by their original decision – for example, if the two situations are NOT similar, even though you see them as such. > > OK? You gave Peter Morris a warning for supposedly making a personal insult. Now you’re claiming the warning was because there was no specificity to it and it’s recreational outrage? Specificity has been given several times in the threads regarding this issue. Recreational outrage is the same as a personal insult? This is fucking crazy! ---
**Author:** ![Lobot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ce7236/32.png) [@Lobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobot)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/73 "2014-07-23T23:36:17Z")
It seems to me that people are just confused and frustrated. The easiest way to make all the noise here go away would be clear, unambiguous rules followed through consistently and a tolerance for posters’ frustration in the meantime. None of that seems to be happening at the moment, and IMHO the frustration will only build because of it… and the noise with it. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/74 "2014-07-23T23:37:38Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > I’ve never seen anyone make such a complaint against Giraffe. It’s Czarcasm that gets all the complaints. A lot of people observe that Czarcasm is ignored, when anyone else would be told to ‘knock it off’ and gets a ‘knock it off’ when anyone else would get an official Warning. > [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > Personal insults are not permitted in this forum, not even if disguised as “a lot of people observe…” Warning issued. This is another joke, right? Right? We are seriously down the rabbit hole here now. > [@hajario](#): > > Everyone, every single one of us, understands this. This is **NOT** the issue. The issue is whether or not SOME of the posts in that thread actually violated the above. > > Pretty much everyone agrees that the OP of the Pit thread violated the spirit of the rules and that the poster was trying to be cute. The disagreement is specifically about if the post by **GrandWino** in the Pit thread and his follow-up ATMB thread were rules violations. To his credit, **Marley** has agreed to reconsider. > > Clear? It’s perfectly clear if you’re actually looking. The problem is that someone with his fingers in his hears, intoning “We have always been at war with Eastasia,” might not be in the best position to see the obvious. As for the rest of you, the mods’ arms must be getting tired by now, and their knees are sore from constantly knocking on the underside of their desks, so i’m here to help them out: > [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > “So-and-so gets away with things that others don’t” is going to be moderated as a personal insult going forward, yes, it’s clear. What’s not clear is: Isn’t “so-and-so gets away with things that others don’t” also a comment on moderation? If so, does this mean that there is no forum on the board where you can say “so-and-so gets away with things that others don’t”? That’s a paddlin’. > [@Emiliana](#): > > Seriously?? This is a complaint about moderation, not an insult directed at Czarcasm. Why are you so invested in refusing to see this? > > This is utterly asinine. That’s a paddlin’. > [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > WTF is going on around here? That’s a paddlin’. > [@Erdosain](#): > > We’ve finally broken Marley and Dex. Wait, can I even say that anymore? I’m thoroughly confused by Dex’s new rule of “no mocking moderator actions.” That’s a paddlin’. > [@hajario](#): > > I read that as he was sincerely confused and looking for clarification. I really don’t think he was trying to hide an insult. That’s a paddlin’. > [@Morgenstern](#): > > I’d comment, but I’m unsure of the rules anymore, and I honestly have no clue what is allowable and what isn’t anymore. That’s pretty amazing considering there is only really one rule here, and that’s don’t be a jerk. I’m not seeing any jerks here. That’s a paddlin’. > [@Clockwork\_Jackal](#): > > That is not an insult, that is a legitimate complaint about the moderation here. If you cannot understand that, or if you and the other mods are incapable of taking any kind of criticism, you should not be mods here. (Or anywhere else for that matter.) I’m sorry if you think that’s insulting. But you seem either incapable of understanding our criticism or you are deliberately misinterpreting it. That’s a paddlin’. > [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > This moderation has been, front to back, a mess. I cannot fathom how [mentioning where the topic of satire took place](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17573658&postcount=23) is a warnable offense. That’s a paddlin’. > [@wguy123](#): > > Warning issued to GrandWino for doing exactly what that mod suggested (IMHO). > > I can understand the confusion. So no, not clear. That’s a paddlin’. > [@Emiliana](#): > > The rule: any complaint about moderation that involves, directly or indirectly, Czarcasm is not a complaint about moderation but rather than an insult directed at Czarcasm. > > I don’t think Czarcasm is asking for all this special protection so I’m not sure why it’s being provided. That’s a paddlin’. > [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > I would further suggest that “complaining about getting a warning” is never a frivolous complaint, and opening a single thread about the warning in question should never be a warnable offense. I re-read GrandWino’s thread here in ATMB, and I cannot understand how it drew a warning. That’s a paddlin’. > [@Red\_Barchetta](#): > > Must…refrain…from…obvious…counterpoint That’s a paddlin’. > [@John\_Mace](#): > > I hope the first person to figure that out will enlighten the rest of us. That’s a paddlin’. > [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > That went beyond simply making a comment about the moderation: and directly called out the moderating staff as “being corrupt”, and IMHO, was rightly moderated. The accusation that Czarcasm gets away with stuff that other people don’t is, again, IMHO, not proven. I cited a thread in GQ with much worse behaviour where people were not moderated, despite reports. I’m not a fan of Czarcasm or his posting style. But this pile on is not based on objective evidence: but on subjective opinion. If you want to show that Czarcasm is not treated the same as other posters: you guys really need to show more evidence than what has been posted so far. Cause I’m not seeing it. I thought that was a paddlin’ for a minute, because i saw the name “Czarcasm” in there, but i think your post qualifies you for a gold star and elevation to moderator. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/75 "2014-07-23T23:40:32Z")
> [@Lobot](#): > > It seems to me that people are just confused and frustrated. The easiest way to make all the noise here go away would be clear, unambiguous rules followed through consistently and a tolerance for posters’ frustration in the meantime. None of that seems to be happening at the moment, and IMHO the frustration will only build because of it… and the noise with it. There are two ways to make this go away. 1) Rescind all the warnings, with the possible exception of the first warning to the OP of that Pit thread. While it was a pretty marginal warning, at least it had something to do with a rule we’ve had around here for a while (no complaints about moderation in the Pit.) None of the other warnings had even a fig leaf of justifiability. 2) Wait it out. Obviously #1 would be the best approach, but we’ve all seen #2 used, and it works. Eventually. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/76 "2014-07-23T23:41:11Z")
> [@x-ray\_vision](#): > > You gave Peter Morris a warning for supposedly making a personal insult. > > Now you’re claiming the warning was because there was no specificity to it and it’s recreational outrage? Specificity has been given several times in the threads regarding this issue. Recreational outrage is the same as a personal insult? This is fucking crazy! It must be National Through The Looking Glass Day-- that’s the only explanation that makes sense. Everything will be back to normal tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/77 "2014-07-23T23:42:05Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > That’s a paddlin’.That’s a paddlin’.I thought that was a paddlin’ for a minute, because i saw the name “Czarcasm” in there, but i think your post qualifies you for a gold star and elevation to moderator. …calling it as I see it. If you have evidence that Czarcasm regularly breaches the rules but gets ignored after being reported feel free to show it. ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/78 "2014-07-23T23:43:55Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I thought that was a paddlin’ for a minute, because i saw the name “Czarcasm” in there, but i think your post qualifies you for a gold star and elevation to moderator. Criticizing mod actions with an element of humor? Oh, you better believe that’s a paddlin’. ---
**Author:** ![Emiliana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f0a364/32.png) [@Emiliana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emiliana)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/79 "2014-07-23T23:44:58Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …calling it as I see it. If you have evidence that Czarcasm regularly breaches the rules but gets ignored after being reported feel free to show it. This is a separate issue, no? One could make a more or less well-founded claim that Czarcasm gets away with violating the rules. But it would still be a complaint, more or less well-founded, about moderation rather than an insult directed at Czarcasm. Geez, I’ve said Czarcasm so many times that I fear I shall be banned shortly. ---
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2014, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869/80 "2014-07-23T23:50:23Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > There are two ways to make this go away. 1) Rescind all the warnings, with the possible exception of the first warning to the OP of that Pit thread. While it was a pretty marginal warning, at least it had something to do with a rule we’ve had around here for a while (no complaints about moderation in the Pit.) None of the other warnings had even a fig leaf of justifiability. 2) Wait it out. Obviously #1 would be the best approach, but we’ve all seen #2 used, and it works. Eventually. I know we really don’t have a vote here, but I vote for option 1. I’ve been a member here for a few years, and have never gotten a warning so I’m no troublemaker, or at least I don’t recall getting a warning, but this episode has been the most convoluted BS I have seen on this forum. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-moderation-here-is-getting-ridiculously-heavy-handed/693869.md?page=5)