The moon in the sky, as seen in movies

[Chronos]

Quoth Paxx:

If by “any other phase” you mean the other three principal phases (New Moon, First Quarter, Last Quarter), each of which occurs on a specific date, then okay. But, if you are including the intermediate phases, how did you arrive at the conclusion that a full moon is “more likely”?

When the moon is full, it will on average be visible during twelve nighttime hours. When the moon is at a quarter phase, it will on average be visible during six nighttime hours. When the moon is gibbous midway between quarter and full, it will on average be visible during nine nighttime hours. Even when it’s a day away from full, it will on average be visible during a little over eleven nighttime hours.

[Paxx]

A full moon appears for about one night per month but a waxing or waning gibbous moon appears for about seven nights. It seems that the gibbous moons are more likely to be seen at night, based on number of nights per month and number of hours per night.

In any case, I think it’s obvious that a shot of the moon in a movie has little if anything to do with the moon’s actual phase at the time that a scene’s action was shot.

[Channing_Idaho_Banks]

Any shot of the moon setting will Indicate the end of the night.

[pmwgreen]

@AtomicDog

Give me a nice, thin crescent moon anytime.

Or a gibbous moon in a blue daytime sky.

Do you get gibbous moons in a blue sky? I thought they were nearly full, so mostly near dawn or dusk.

Anyway, I suspect you get full moons for the same reason that all frogs in movies sound like the frogs you get near Hollywood, which is that the sound is stock and added later.

[TriPolar]

It’s got to be a full moon so it hits your eye like a big pizza pie.

[TYphoonSignal8]

Channing Idaho Banks - you’re dead right. The Moon is an indicator to the audience underscoring that the action is set in or has moved into the night.

I am wracking my brains to think if there is a movie where the moon is seen in a dark and dangerous city, when normally ambient light would prevent it from being seen…

@CalMeacham

There’s a big cultural history to “stars between the tips of the crescent moon”.
A lot of ancient civilizations used a symbol consisting of a star within the body of a crescent moon shortly before and after the Christian era. It appeared in Byzantium and in Rome and in medieval heraldry. It’s not evident if this was anything more than a symbol, rather than an observation.

The star and crescent was famously the symbol of the Ottoman empire, and from there became generally associated with Islam.

Star and crescent - Wikipedia
It’s mentioned in The Rime of the Ancient Mariner. Of course, there’s a high proportion of weird in that poem, so it fits perfectly in the mood. Someone pointed out the impossibility, and Coleridge apparently changed it to “near the nether tip” in later editions

In November 1668, Cotton Mather reported seeing a star-like point of light within the dark part of the crescent moon. Mather was a pretty good observer, so people give this some credence.

In 1795 the Royal Astronomer, Rev. Nevil Maskelyne, also reported seeing lights in the dark portion of the moon. A Mr. Wilkins also reported a light inside the dark part of the moon, but I don’t know if it was at the same time.
Similar reports were made in 1847 and 1867

In 1869 the Royal Astronomical Society of Great Britain investigated reports of lights on the moon.

In 1877 there were several reports of lights on the lunar surface.
One theory for these was that they were due to meteor strikes. At the time, it was suggested it might be volcanic activity.

http://cavinessreport.com/ad3_3.html

It’s used in lots of modern flags (see the Wikipedia article above).

There was a legend that the Ottoman symbol derived from an observation. IIRC, a friend of mine wrote an article about this, where he said the origin of the symbol is “lost in antiquity”

See also the original Proctor & Gamble logo. https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/c5/P%26G_logo.jpg

[Der_Trihs]

@Lumpy

It isn’t even just random, they always point the horns the wrong way (i.e. show the crescent moon as a “C”). There’s got to be a reason behind this but I don’t know what.

It might simply be imitation. Somebody originally showed it the wrong way, other people copied it, and since then people just keep copying off one another repeating the mistake. That sort of thing happens.

@Chronos

And while one can debate whether the full or crescent moon is more aesthetic, nobody wants a gibbous moon.

@The_Tooth

Gibbons might.

Weregibbons.

[Melbourne]

@Gyrate

It’s the same reason every window in Paris has a view of the Eiffel Tower.

Speaking of the full moons and animated films, this reminds me of a goof in the first Despicable Me film. At the beginning of the film Gru comes home and says “Good morning” to his neighbour. About ten minutes later he’s standing framed by a full moon in the night sky. Sloppy.

C’mon, that’s deliberate. It establishes him as an asshole.

@Gyrate

As always, there’s an xkcd for that.

“There’s an xkcd for that” or “obligatory xkcd” is such a common meme, that I always wonder, is there an xkcd for it? Surely?

[terentii]

@TYphoonSignal8

I am wracking my brains to think if there is a movie where the moon is seen in a dark and dangerous city, when normally ambient light would prevent it from being seen…

The full moon has a magnitude of negative 12.6. Not even the light pollution of a major city could wash it out.

[Chronos]

Quoth TYphoonSignal8:

I am wracking my brains to think if there is a movie where the moon is seen in a dark and dangerous city, when normally ambient light would prevent it from being seen…

No city could ever have so much light pollution as to prevent the Moon from being seen: The amount of light pollution needed to do that would not only blind but literally cook every inhabitant. You could maybe do it with thick smog, though.

[pulykamell]

@terentii

The full moon has a magnitude of negative 12.6. Not even the light pollution of a major city could wash it out.

I was wondering whether I understood TyphoonSignal’s post correctly. I mean, you can even see the moon during the day. But, even so, I live in Chicago, which is fairly light polluted, and you can see at least a couple dozen stars with the light pollution as it is. To obliterate that and then make the jump to obliterating the moon–I can’t even conceive of how much light would be required.

[Nava]

@pulykamell

It’s weird, but my instinct is always to draw a crescent moon in that way (as a “C” with the horns to the right.) Ever since being a little kid and drawing moons in nighttime scenes, it was always that way. Wonder why. Maybe because I’m right handed?

I remember being taught to recognize the phase of the moon by the rule “the initial of what the moon is doing is the opposite of the way it looks”: if it looks like a D it’s creciendo, waxing; if it looks like a C it’s decreciendo, waning. In heraldry, the horns-and-star that CalMeacham mentioned often has it horns-up; when the crescent it used as a symbol of defeating muslims it goes horns-down.

[terentii]

@pulykamell

I live in Chicago, which is fairly light polluted, and you can see at least a couple dozen stars with the light pollution as it is. To obliterate that and then make the jump to obliterating the moon–I can’t even conceive of how much light would be required.

Maybe negative 40 (Hiroshima)? :eek:

[TYphoonSignal8]

@Chronos

No city could ever have so much light pollution as to prevent the Moon from being seen: The amount of light pollution needed to do that would not only blind but literally cook every inhabitant. You could maybe do it with thick smog, though.

In Osaka in the late 90s, when the air around Kadoma (where Panasonic/Matsushita is based) was very heavily polluted, I recall thinking that I never saw the moon. You’re probably right - a combination of both ambient light and especially air pollution. Or perhaps not looking in the right direction. :smack: Certainly I never saw any stars.

[ftg]

@pulykamell

I was wondering whether I understood TyphoonSignal’s post correctly. I mean, you can even see the moon during the day.

Light pollution indeed doesn’t hold a candle to the Sun. If you can see any non-trivial crescent Moon during the day, you can definitely see it in any city that’s not putting out a insane level of light (nor Beijing level pollution).

[Chronos]

I’ve seen advice to photographers that, when you’re taking a picture of the Moon, you should use the same settings that you would for a rock that’s sitting in direct sunlight… because that’s exactly what the Moon is.

[AHunter3]

Every time I see this thread title, I hear this (minus the ad of course) in my head.