# The Most Significant SF & Fantasy Books of the Last 50 Years **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 5, 2003, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233 "2003-03-05T13:55:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/61 "2003-03-05T22:00:13Z")
24, plus a few partials. I need to catch up. I agree with you all about Terry Brooks. Forget about Dan Simmons, Julian May, George R.R. Martin or my beloved Guy Gavriel Kay - I’d put _Margaret Weiss and Tracy Hickman_ on that list before that Shanarra crap. Sheesh. ---
**Author:** ![NoCoolUserName](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5fc32e/32.png) [@NoCoolUserName](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NoCoolUserName)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/62 "2003-03-05T22:23:54Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by Exapno Mapcase \* \*\*About 44 or so. Top Geek! Cue the Kenny Rogers music! The only ones I’m sure I’ve missed are Shiras, Matheson, Crowley and Cordwainer Smith. So I rank you there. It’s been so long since I read Bester and Haldeman that I will have to revisit them. The list is crap, as are all Top x lists, but it gives us something to talk about while waiting for meaning to come into our lives. The Foundation Trilogy is a set of books, not one (also Book of the New Sun, Cities in Flight). A Wizard of Earthsea is one of a set, as is Dune, Gateway, Potter, Hitchhiker, Vampire, Rama, Shannara (yuck), and To Your Scattered Bodies Go. Does one judge the book on its own or as part of the set? Wizard of Earthsea doesn’t really stand alone, nor To Your Scattered Bodies Go…the rest maybe. Dangerous Visions is a collection. What makes something a “book”? Being published all in the same cover? I was surprised that Snow Crash made the list. It’s really just a comic book made into a novel–prettily written, but no character development, no message, nothing in the way of depth. Someone asked why people rag on Thomas Covenant. Here’s why: The guy is a whiner! ---
**Author:** ![Weird\_AL\_Einstein](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c67d28/32.png) [@Weird\_AL\_Einstein](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weird_AL_Einstein)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/63 "2003-03-05T22:36:33Z")
Oy vey. I’ve only read nine on that list. Probably the least of anyone here calling themselves a sci-fi fan. Of course I did read all of the top four, and two of those are actually trilogies, so I feel I should get more credit for them… ---
**Author:** ![NoCoolUserName](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5fc32e/32.png) [@NoCoolUserName](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NoCoolUserName)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/64 "2003-03-05T22:52:03Z")
Credit? There’s credit to be had? My F&SF collection has more than 500 books in it, and I’ve read them all! What do I win, Johnnie? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/65 "2003-03-05T22:52:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Peyote Coyote \* > \*\*Exapno: You are correct about the dates of the Narnia books, but I think if you’re going to include the Foundation Triology (the bulk of which was written in the 1940’s) and the Okie series (much of which was written before 1950), it should be permissible to include a series which has four books appearing after 1953. > \*\* If I called out Asimov and Blish, I had to be consistent in mentioning Lewis’ publishing dates. **NCUN** , If you haven’t read Crowley and Smith, you’re in for a treat. They are some of the best (or most interesting or whatever) work on a weird and wonky list. You’re right in that it’s a best 87 or something list. At least _Dune_ and _Gateway_ and _Rama_ and _Bodies_ won Hugos in their own rights, before the seriesitis started. I think I count 16 Best Hugo novel winners on the list. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/66 "2003-03-05T23:12:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by NoCoolUserName \* > A Wizard of Earthsea is one of a set, as is Dune, Gateway, Potter, Hitchhiker, Vampire, **Rama** , Shannara (yuck), and To Your Scattered Bodies Go. \ (Bolding mine) Slight nitpick, but the sequels to Rama were co-written by Clarke and Gentry Lee, and were pale imitations of his original work. I’d personally hesitate to call Rama one of a set for this reason. ---
**Author:** ![NoCoolUserName](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5fc32e/32.png) [@NoCoolUserName](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NoCoolUserName)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/67 "2003-03-05T23:19:58Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Exapno Mapcase \* > [ **NCUN** , If you haven’t read Crowley and Smith, you’re in for a treat. They are some of the best (or most interesting or whatever) work on a weird and wonky list._\* Ah, but these are supposed to be “The Most Significant” books. The local library has The Rediscovery of Man–it also is a collection. I’ve got it on reserve. They also have I Am Legend–a vampire story. Hmmm… Can’t find Crowley or Shiras. Dang. ---
**Author:** ![Badtz\_Maru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e36b37/32.png) [@Badtz\_Maru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Badtz_Maru)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/68 "2003-03-05T23:31:56Z")
I’ve read 22 of them. It’s not the worst list I’ve seen. ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/69 "2003-03-05T23:44:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Fiver \* > \*\*\*\*Tars Tarkas\*\*You don’t have to like it for it to be significant. Robinson’s trilogy is the high-water mark for hard science fiction (and more specifically, the terraforming subgenre). \*\* How common is the terraforming subgenre? besides the movie for total recal, i can’t think of another real one. Robinson’s terrible characterizations and racial generalizations turned me off from reading Years of Salt and Vinegar (or whatever the name is), despite being a huge Alternate History fan. I’ll probably try it eventually if i see it at a used book store, but it is no longer must get. Alternate History seems more of an important subgenre, and is not represented on the list (unless i missed one), and i thought discworld covered the hard sci-fi (or am i wrong in remembering during every Enterprise vs. Star Destroyer thread people chiming in about how they fight unrealistically and to read Discworld for what would really happen?) ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/70 "2003-03-06T00:41:21Z")
Since nobody has posted it yet, I’d like to stick in this link to **Fenris’** old thread on “What every well-read science fiction fan should read-maybe”: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=74792](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=74792) The final list I think is pretty darn good. However I believe fantasy was specifically excluded ( when are you going to get around to doing the definitive fantasy thread **Fenris** 😉 ? ). - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Frink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/977dab/32.png) [@Mr.Frink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Frink)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/71 "2003-03-06T01:03:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tars Tarkas \* > \*\* Alternate History seems more of an important subgenre, and is not represented on the list (unless i missed one), \*\* **The Man in the High Castle** by Philip K. Dick checks in a #33. It’s one of the best of the “Germany & Japan win WWII” alt history genre. It won the Hugo award and put PKD on the map. Check it out! ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/72 "2003-03-06T01:09:09Z")
Hmm. Only about 9. But then again I’m not hardcore and not into fantasy. And I do have a bit of a problem dealing with the listings of “a book” that are really collections/compilations. Loved seeing Miller’s “Canticle for Leibowitz” in the list, though. ---
**Author:** ![Avumede](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/avumede/32/7235_2.png) [@Avumede](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Avumede)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/73 "2003-03-06T01:16:02Z")
I thought I was more of a sci-fi fan. I only read 13. No Silverberg? Well, I suppose so. Silverberg is not incredbly influential, although he is one of the best sci-fi authors out there, and has been so for a long time. The problem with the list is that it’s hard to be influential when you are way beyond what anyone else is doing. Philip K Dick’s more important works (“Valis”, etc) were not listed. Stanislaw Lem, the most popular sci-fi writer on the planet, was not listed, as far as I saw. They aren’t influential because they are too good to copy. ---
**Author:** ![Avumede](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/avumede/32/7235_2.png) [@Avumede](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Avumede)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/74 "2003-03-06T01:17:26Z")
Then again, I just looked at the list, and saw that it was “Most significant” not “Most influential”. The list is therefore way off. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/75 "2003-03-06T01:24:02Z")
> [@](#): > > I feel compelled to point out that the list appears to be in alphabetical order. Look again, you fatuous jackass. Looks like the list was originally alphabetical, then some items were moved around. I’d like to see _Brain Wave_ by Poul Anderson on that list, but that’s just because I liked it so much. ---
**Author:** ![NicePete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ee7513/32.png) [@NicePete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NicePete)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/76 "2003-03-06T02:43:32Z")
I’ve got 25, weighted toward the SF side. I thought Varley should have made it for \Steel Beach\ or for the \Titan\ trilogy. ---
**Author:** ![RawkStah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@RawkStah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RawkStah)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/77 "2003-03-06T02:46:53Z")
1. Am I still a geek? I’m glad to see that “Ender’s Game” was on the list. Mostly because I just read the series like 2 weeks ago. With the “Foundation” trilogy – I read 'em, but I’m not a big fan. Mostly because I couldn’t accept psychohistory as being valid. I’m glad that they just included “Dune”, but not the whole series. And with the Brooks-bashing that’s going on… I’ve not read any (apart from his adaptation of “The Phantom Menace”), but didn’t he want to set is stuff in the Tolkien universe, but the Tolkien estate said “Nope.”? ---
**Author:** ![NicePete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ee7513/32.png) [@NicePete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NicePete)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/78 "2003-03-06T02:52:03Z")
Um, Baldwin, not to be fatuous or a jackass, but numbers 11 through 50 are pretty clearly in alphabetical order when I pull the list up. The only exception I see to that is that 36 and 37 seem to be reversed. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/79 "2003-03-06T03:17:26Z")
37 If I’m allowed to count stuff that I started but either didn’t finish or started and then hurled the book across the room(the abysmal **Dahlgren** , for one, or Thomas Covenant books 2 and 3), I clock in in the low '40s Overall good list: Personally I _love_ Shiras, but I don’t know that she deserves to be on the list: Except for the fact that Stan Lee (cough) “borrowed” heavily from the concept (a school for mutant children who are hated and feared), she’s sadly forgotten today (and even back when, no-one remembered anything past the first story “In Hiding”). I’d have substituted the far superior Zenna Henderson “People” books. And WTF with Brooks. You could make a case for Piers Anthony starting the big '70s light-fantasy craze with **A Spell For Chameleon** , but Brooks? C’mon. I thought **Needle** was a _far_ better book than **Mission of Gravity**. Hell: **Iceworld** was a better book. But at least they got a Clement on the list! Overall a decent list…not the same list _I’d_ have made, but a legit one. Fenris ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233/80 "2003-03-06T03:28:57Z")
> [@](#): > > Um, Baldwin, not to be fatuous or a jackass, but numbers 11 through 50 are pretty clearly in alphabetical order when I pull the list up. The only exception I see to that is that 36 and 37 seem to be reversed. I’d better clear this up – I was quoting **myself** , from my first post in this thread (about the list being in alphabetical order), and calling **myself** a fatuous jackass. Just a little self-deprecatory humor. I would never start throwing insults around at my fellow Straight Dopers like that. Just occurred to me, Clifford Simak should be on the list, only I’m not sure for what specific book. And where’s John Wyndham? Oh well, it’s hard to put together such a list without being biased by one’s personal taste. So this list could never be definitive, but look what an interesting discussion it’s started. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-most-significant-sf-fantasy-books-of-the-last-50-years/159233.md?page=5)