# The Music Man **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 26, 2007, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078 "2007-10-26T05:20:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![anyrose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/54ee81/32.png) [@anyrose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anyrose)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/21 "2007-10-26T17:54:21Z")
[QUOTE=Musicat] I saw it live once with Forest Tucker, who was sort of a Robert Preston clone (and a very distant relative).\… [/QUOTE] heh. and Robert Preston thought \*he \* (himself) couldn’t sing… ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/22 "2007-10-26T18:45:41Z")
Great honk! Ye, gods! _Balzaac_ You watch your phraseology! Ah, memories. Need to see this again, soon. I always get a snippet of one song in my head: “…as cold as our falling thermmometer in December, when you ask about our weather in July. And we’re so bygone stubborn we can stand with our noses touching for a week at a time and never see eye to eye…but what the heck, you’re welcom, join us at the picnic–you can eat your fill of all the food you bring yourself.” it goes round and round in my head. Just that part. I also love the piano in the duet that **anyrose** mentions above. I don’t think I could hear that piano without that “mistake”! ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/23 "2007-10-26T19:42:32Z")
A long time ago, when I was living with a boyfriend, he was at work and I was happily settling down to watch The Music Man on TV when I got a phone call from one of our neighbors. She needed to come over and talk to me right away. I knew what the problem was…apparently my boyfriend had cheated on me again and the girl was coming to tell me about it. I was getting used to it. The part that really rankled, however, was that we’d be wasting time talking about his shenanigans while The Music Man was on! :mad: Despite that memory, it’s still one of my all-time favorites. I really like the scene in the library with Professor Hill and Maaaaaaaaar… ---
**Author:** ![teela\_brown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d9b06d/32.png) [@teela\_brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teela_brown)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/24 "2007-10-26T20:09:34Z")
_The Music Man_ is my favorite musical! This thread made me go over to the IMDB and look up trivia on MM. It seems that the movie company really wanted Frank Sinatra to play Harold Hill, but Meredith Wilson told them, “No Robert Preston, no Music Man,” so they caved. Thank God. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/25 "2007-10-26T20:12:46Z")
Sinatra would have sucked in that role. (I didn’t like him in Guys n’ Dolls–I’m not much of a Frankie fan). Love the Richie Cunningham in-joke. I also really like Shirley Jones in the role of Marian–I run hot or cold on her performances. Didn’t like her in Oklahoma (don’t like Oklahoma that much anymore) etc. ---
**Author:** ![anyrose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/54ee81/32.png) [@anyrose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anyrose)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/26 "2007-10-26T20:19:56Z")
[QUOTE=eleanorigby] Love the Richie Cunningham in-joke. [/QUOTE] which in joke would that be? Ronnie Howard did Music Man even \*before \* he was in the Andy Griffith Show ---
**Author:** ![Sarahfeena](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sarahfeena/32/519_2.png) [@Sarahfeena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sarahfeena)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/27 "2007-10-26T20:38:07Z")
[QUOTE=anyrose] which in joke would that be? Ronnie Howard did Music Man even \*before \* he was in the Andy Griffith Show [/QUOTE] From my post [upthread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9112891&postcount=11). ---
**Author:** ![LH75](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lh75/32/4438_2.png) [@LH75](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LH75)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/28 "2007-10-26T21:05:54Z")
As I understand it, Sinatra told the movie company “not only will I not take the part, but if you cast anyone but Robert Preston, I won’t even go see the movie” (sorry, no cite. It may just be an internet legend) ---
**Author:** ![anyrose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/54ee81/32.png) [@anyrose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anyrose)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/29 "2007-10-26T21:06:34Z")
[QUOTE=Sarahfeena] From my post [upthread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9112891&postcount=11). [/QUOTE] ah - missed that - thanks ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/30 "2007-10-26T21:31:52Z")
Robert Preston later essentially reprised his Harold Hill role in [_The Last Starfighter._](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Starfighter) ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/31 "2007-10-26T21:34:34Z")
[QUOTE=Musicat] I saw it live once with Forest Tucker, who was sort of a Robert Preston clone (and a very distant relative). With respect to the ending, which I always thought was a cop-out and weak, I refer to the “Music Man Syndrome” when someone asks me why anyone would want to watch a video I made at our local school. They want to watch it for the same reason that the kid’s band sounded good at the end to the parents – “That’s my Johnny on the tuba!” Meredith Willson was different from most musical theatre writers of the era – he wrote not only the music and lyrics, but the book (dialogue) as well. Other works were typically by teams – Sondheim/Bernstein, Lerner/Lowe, Rogers/Hammerstein, Rogers/Hart… [/QUOTE] He wrote of the the best musicals ever (Music Man) 😃 and also one of the worse (Here’s Love)! ☹ ..Pinecones and holly berries… His other musical (Unsinkable Molly Brown) is pretty nifty too. Wilson also wrote the song [Go You Chicken Fat, Go](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af2j59zzX3Q) for President Kennedy’s youth fitness program. 😛 Here Robert Preston sings. ---
**Author:** ![anyrose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/54ee81/32.png) [@anyrose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anyrose)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/32 "2007-10-26T21:37:48Z")
[QUOTE=ouryL] He wrote of the the best musicals ever (Music Man) 😃 and also one of the worse (Here’s Love)! ☹ ..Pinecones and holly berries… His other musical (Unsinkable Molly Brown) is pretty nifty too. Wilson also wrote the song [Go You Chicken Fat, Go](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af2j59zzX3Q) for President Kennedy’s youth fitness program. 😛 Here Robert Preston sings. [/QUOTE] I have it in my brain (have had for decades) that he also wrote “It’s Beginning to Look A Lot Like Christmas” but lastely I’ve come to suspect I may be wrong. I had been under the impression that it was from Here’s Love, but it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2007, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/33 "2007-10-26T22:20:41Z")
[QUOTE=anyrose] I have it in my brain (have had for decades) that he also wrote “It’s Beginning to Look A Lot Like Christmas” but lastely I’ve come to suspect I may be wrong. I had been under the impression that it was from Here’s Love, but it isn’t. [/QUOTE] [allmusic.com](http://allmusic.com) says that you’re right (that it was Willson. Unclear as to whether or not it was from Here’s Love). ---
**Author:** ![Indyellen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/indyellen/32/4176_2.png) [@Indyellen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indyellen)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2007, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/34 "2007-10-27T00:30:24Z")
My daughter’s middle school is putting on a dinner theater version of something called “The Music Man Junior”, which I presume is somewhat abridged. She’s a “pick-a-little” lady. 🙂 I’m on the costume committee. I also have fond (but distressing) memories of a young people theater group that put on a production where Harold Hill had NO sense of rhythm. _shudder_ But the original - fantastic. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2007, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/35 "2007-10-27T01:35:04Z")
Trouble in River City and the train song both remind me of hip-hop. Outside of Jesus Christ, Superstar songs, Trouble in River City is my favorite song from a musical ever. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2007, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/36 "2007-10-27T07:59:29Z")
[QUOTE=longhair75] As I understand it, Sinatra told the movie company “not only will I not take the part, but if you cast anyone but Robert Preston, I won’t even go see the movie” (sorry, no cite. It may just be an internet legend) [/QUOTE] Hmm, I heard the same quotation allegedly from Cary Grant re casting Rex Harrison in _My Fair Lady_. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2007, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/37 "2007-10-27T13:35:20Z")
[QUOTE=anyrose] I have it in my brain (have had for decades) that he also wrote “It’s Beginning to Look A Lot Like Christmas” but lastely I’ve come to suspect I may be wrong. I had been under the impression that it was from Here’s Love, but it isn’t. [/QUOTE] According to: [http://www.talkinbroadway.com/regional/sanfran/s165.html](http://www.talkinbroadway.com/regional/sanfran/s165.html) …it is indeed from _Here’s Love_. > [@](#): > > The sole memorable song from the musical is “It’s Beginning to Look a Lot Like Christmas” which has become a holiday standard. However, I have my doubts that it first appeared in the musical, as it was recorded in 1952 by major artists, yet the musical is credited as following _Music Man_ and _Molly Brown_, which I think would put it later. Perhaps he borrowed the song from his own repertoire and inserted it into the musical. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2007, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/38 "2007-10-27T13:41:08Z")
To expand on my theory of first the song, then the musical (It’s beginning to look a lot like Christmas/Here’s Love), Willson was known for having a trunkful of songs and partly-completed songs and he reportedly drew upon that trunk in writing his musicals. _Lida Rose_, IIRC, was in that category. ---
**Author:** ![anyrose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/54ee81/32.png) [@anyrose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anyrose)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2007, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/39 "2007-10-27T13:41:31Z")
Thank you, \*\*Walloon \*\* and **Musicat**. I feel so much better, now. 🙂 [QUOTE=Indyellen] I also have fond (but distressing) memories of a young people theater group that put on a production where Harold Hill had NO sense of rhythm. _shudder_ [/QUOTE] I remember while home for summer break, I volunteered at both the kids’ summer playhouse (as assistant director) and the adult community theatre (props and costumes - I got home too late for auditions) both companies were doing TMM. I found it thoroughly amazing that the kids (none older than 12) were able to do the train scene in better, more accurate rhythm than the adults. ---
**Author:** ![teela\_brown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d9b06d/32.png) [@teela\_brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teela_brown)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2007, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078/40 "2007-10-27T21:20:01Z")
[QUOTE=eleanorigby] Sinatra would have sucked in that role. (I didn’t like him in Guys n’ Dolls–I’m not much of a Frankie fan). [/QUOTE] Youse got trouble. Ya don’t believe me? It’s even money That youse guys got trouble! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-music-man/424078.md?page=3)