# The Natsarim **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 20, 2012, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594 "2012-11-20T07:10:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/61 "2012-11-20T22:22:34Z")
I still want to know about those people around the world that started asking the same questions at the same time. How did they find each other, and where did they meet? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/62 "2012-11-20T22:24:33Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > You say put Judaism together with Christianity, remove some things we don’t like, add the “truisms” (things us Natsarims believe to be true), seek real truth, etc… [Here’s a website dedicated to Natsarim](http://www.fossilizedcustoms.com/NATSARIM.html) that is even less impressive than answersingenesis. That looks like Allen West on the far right (heh). West finally conceded defeat today. He set a record for most money spent by a losing candidate for the House of Representatives. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/63 "2012-11-21T06:24:58Z")
> [@romadea](#): > > Okay, the photos at the top of that page are scary as hell. I love how one of the things on the list is “First Fruits” nothing like truth in advertising. ---
**Author:** ![Scholar\_Beardpig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de053/32.png) [@Scholar\_Beardpig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scholar_Beardpig)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/64 "2012-11-21T07:46:11Z")
> [@Bosstrain](#): > > Actually it was Paul, he spoke about how those that followed the Messiah were being called Natsarim and it just sort of developed. As far as people that are influencial in the group, it starts with the Messiah Yahusha Himself as the head of course. I believe Paul was the second most influencial person, he did a lot of traveling and reached a great number of people. The only important person is the Messiah though, but people like Yahucanan (John) are pretty famous I’d imagine. Anyone in the new testament writings was a famous Natsarim. Yes, very good, but what’s happened with the Natsarim since then? ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/65 "2012-11-21T07:46:53Z")
WTF? Quote: **ROMAN CATHOLICISM IS MODERN MOLOCH WORSHIP - AND IT HAS “DAUGHTERS”.** Followed by a picture of Obama shaking hands with the pope and this caption: \*\* THE SOVEREIGNS OF THE EARTH HAVE COMMITTED WHORING WITH HER - REV 18:3\*\* I was willing to give the benefit of the doubt, but fuck that shit. I vote this stuff is _Cookoo For Coco-Puffs_ ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/66 "2012-11-21T08:19:24Z")
Isn’t what the OP describing pretty much textbook Fundamentalist - as in returning to the \*fundamentals \*of the religion - Christianity? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/67 "2012-11-21T12:24:06Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I still want to know about those people around the world that started asking the same questions at the same time. How did they find each other, and where did they meet? Presumably, they were able to recognize each other by the eerie white glow emanating from their eyes. [Here’s another Natsarim you all might be more familiar with.](http://thecomicking.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/tumblr_liapkaTjTY1qhauifo5_r1_400.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/68 "2012-11-21T15:01:25Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I still want to know about those people around the world that started asking the same questions at the same time. How did they find each other, and where did they meet? The Barcelona Olympics, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![vd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b19c9b/32.png) [@vd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vd)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/69 "2012-11-21T15:24:19Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Presumably, they were able to recognize each other by the eerie white glow emanating from their eyes. > > [Here’s another Natsarim you all might be more familiar with.](http://thecomicking.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/tumblr_liapkaTjTY1qhauifo5_r1_400.jpg) The video for “Total Eclipse of the Heart” must have been filmed in a [Natsarim monastery](http://www.threedonia.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/bright-eyes.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/70 "2012-11-21T22:36:09Z")
I love the Dope. It never fails to cheer me up. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/71 "2012-11-21T23:26:23Z")
> [@Bosstrain](#): > > We don’t consider it a religion at all. If you put Christianity and Judaism together, remove the Christian holidays, remove the Talmud, add in the restored names and text in Scripture (most importantly the true name of the Creator/Messiah), remove the belief in the trinity and only follow what the Scriptures actually say, then you get the Natsarim belief. That sounds a lot like Jehovah’s Witnesses. Throw in the Watchtower reference and it sounds even more like JWs. How does Natsarim belief differ from JW belief? Or, if you just want to talk about Natsarim belief in isolation, that’s cool, too. It does sound like a religion, though. What makes it not seem like a religion to you? ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/72 "2012-11-22T01:55:02Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > I have always yearned for the day that the TRUE name of the Creator/Messiah (Slartibartfast/Beeblebrox) would finally be reinstated. Heretic. The universe created itself, and then the gods were generated from forces you’re too young to be told the details of. Gaia-the-never-born was the first deity of consequence; she sired Uranus upon herself, then by him began Kronos and company. Kronos relieved Uranus of the burden of his balls, then with his sister Rhea began Zeus and his siblings, who after an unpleasant sojourn in their daddy’s intestines deposted him. With his aunt Metis Zeus began the greatest of all gods, Pallas Athena, who eventually kicked his ass out of Heaven. The throne of Olympus was then legitimately hers, but she’s not terribly interested in being worshipped; she just wants people to use their brain. She’ll still smite you for impertinent weaving, though. What? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/73 "2012-11-22T05:20:40Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Heretic. > > The universe created itself, and then the gods were generated from forces you’re too young to be told the details of. Gaia-the-never-born was the first deity of consequence; she sired Uranus upon herself, then by him began Kronos and company. Kronos relieved Uranus of the burden of his balls, then with his sister Rhea began Zeus and his siblings, who after an unpleasant sojourn in their daddy’s intestines deposted him. With his aunt Metis Zeus began the greatest of all gods, Pallas Athena, who eventually kicked his ass out of Heaven. The throne of Olympus was then legitimately hers, but she’s not terribly interested in being worshipped; she just wants people to use their brain. She’ll still smite you for impertinent weaving, though. What about Nyx? Everyone forgets Nyx. Even Zeus was afraid of Nyx. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/74 "2012-11-22T07:04:13Z")
**Bosstrain** - I have a few questions specifically about your personal beliefs. - How long have you been a Natsarim? - What religion were you born into? Did you go directly from that religion to being a Natsarim, or did you abandon your prior religion (to atheism?) first? - What about the Natsarim appeals to you? Why did you choose it as a belief system? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/75 "2012-11-22T07:45:46Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > . . . Pallas Athena, who eventually kicked his ass out of Heaven. The throne of Olympus was then legitimately hers . . . Wow! That’s a new one to me, and I thought I knew the mythos fairly well. I’ve read my Hesiod, etc. Where does that detail occur in the tales of the gods? (Something much like that happened in Wonder Woman comics, but I suspect you aren’t citing that!) ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/76 "2012-11-22T11:25:36Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Wow! That’s a new one to me, and I thought I knew the mythos fairly well. I’ve read my Hesiod, etc. Where does that detail occur in the tales of the gods? > > (Something much like that happened in Wonder Woman comics, but I suspect you aren’t citing that!) **Skald** is one of those Athenim. It’s not orthodox mythology. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/77 "2012-11-22T15:13:17Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Wow! That’s a new one to me, and I thought I knew the mythos fairly well. I’ve read my Hesiod, etc. Where does that detail occur in the tales of the gods? whooOOOOoosh! ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/78 "2012-11-22T15:14:34Z")
Heck, I’ll jump in. First, either Lew White or a follower owned a used record store on Bardstown Drive in Louisville, KY called Electric Ladyland. It had a psychedelic decor & sold used records, band T-shirts, music magazines, incense & for a time, smoking paraphanalia, AS WELL AS Natsarim literature before they actually settled on that term. I have early editions of some of the books offered on the site. That said- I have this question to the OP- What is the relationship between Abba Yahuah, His Son our Adonai Yahshuah, & the Ruach HaKodesh (Holy Spirit)? Are the Father & the Son co-eternal & co-Deity or was there a time it was Abba Yahuah alone without His Son or Ruach? Does Ruach have personality or is It the non-personal Divine Energy which flows from Abba through His Son? When redeemed humanity comes into their full Eternal state will they in any way share in the Divine nature of Abba & Adonai? For those who will not be redeemed, will they last forever in the Gehinnom or go out of existence OR be blotted out & then resurrected & eventually restored? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/79 "2012-11-22T15:22:15Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > I’m still not clear on how this is a “Great Debate”. No argument or hypotheticals were posed in the OP. Seems more like an attempt at recruitment. Maybe move it to MPISMS? All we’re debating is how silly a sect this is. Great Debates is also the forum set aside for witnessing, particularly religious witnessing. (We’ve occasionally broadened the definition of witnessing to include Conspiracy Theorists as a courtesy to them, but it typically refers to religious beliefs. 😛 ) = = = I had not encounterd the Natsarim, previously, but I would hope that the fossilizedcustoms website is either a parody or the work of a member who is really not part of their core believers. Every single paragraph in the page I read contained one or more historical or linguistic errors. (People can wrangle over theology, forever, but if one cannot get basic factual information right, there is not much point in worrying about the other stuff.) As a seeker of “truth,” the author of that page should probably just go to college and take some classes in relevant topics. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2012, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594/80 "2012-11-22T15:22:21Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > All Christian festivals are derived from pagan festivals? I guess that means the OP’s folks know nothing about [Pentacost](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentacost), aka [Shavuot](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shavuot). They would say that the Christian Pentecost is paganized in that it’s timing is set to the paganized Easter, whereas Shavuot is set to Passover. Also, if they follow the Pharasaic timing of Shavuot, they might denounce it’s always being on a Sunday, which interestingly was a Sadducean practice. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-natsarim/641594.md?page=5)