# The Nazis Were Funded by wall street **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 5, 2013, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364 "2013-08-05T03:08:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 9:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/141 "2013-08-06T09:34:27Z")
^^^ also, after WWI but before 1939, there wasn’t any reason not to do business with the Nazis. They weren’t our enemies or any of our allies and if the pogroms had started nobody knew. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/142 "2013-08-06T11:15:49Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Most won’t admit it now of course, since Nazism has become such a byword for evil. But before that happened yes, support for Nazism was widespread among Christians because Communists were officially atheists, and to Christians there’s nothing worse than atheism. It’s better to murder in the name of religion than it is to save lives and be an atheist. How widespread? Give me figures. How popular was Nazism in the US in the 1930s? If that belief was so popular, then why is it that when Father Coughlin started spreading the “At least Nazism stops the Communists” line, his popularity started plummeting? For that matter, if Christians were so pro-Nazi, how come Christian Poland fought back when they were being invaded? How come Christian England and Christian France declared war? And is it at all possible that the reason there was such dislike for Communism in the United States was not because they were atheists but because they were violent revolutionaries who condemned democracy and private property and openly called for the overthrow of the United States government? Do you think that could have engendered some ill will among rank and file Americans? ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/143 "2013-08-06T11:20:19Z")
I don’t have figures, but US support for the Nazi regime before the war is well documented. They weren’t our enemies at the time, and nobody knew about the killings yet. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/144 "2013-08-06T11:40:56Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > I don’t have figures, but US support for the Nazi regime before the war is well documented. So there’s plenty of evidence…but you don’t have any of it? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/145 "2013-08-06T11:57:41Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > ^^^ also, after WWI but before 1939, there wasn’t any reason not to do business with the Nazis. > They weren’t our enemies or any of our allies and if the pogroms had started nobody knew. The Nuremberg Laws were passed in 1935 and Kristallnacht was in 1938, so I think your definition of “any reason” might be a little suspect. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/146 "2013-08-06T19:03:29Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Most won’t admit it now of course, since Nazism has become such a byword for evil. But before that happened yes, support for Nazism was widespread among Christians because Communists were officially atheists, Horseshit. Just like your statement that “Nazis had quite a bit of support in America, something people choose to forget.” They didn’t forget it; they don’t remember it because it never happened. > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > and to Christians there’s nothing worse than atheism. It’s better to murder in the name of religion than it is to save lives and be an atheist. You’ve got an enormous Jesus complex for someone claiming not to believe in religion. Really, get off of the fucking cross already. You’re not being persecuted by evil Christians, and atheists are not the most despised group on the planet. Name me one Christian who has said it’s better to murder in the name of religion than it is to save lives and be an atheist. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/147 "2013-08-06T19:12:27Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > The Nuremberg Laws were passed in 1935 and Kristallnacht was in 1938, so I think your definition of “any reason” might be a little suspect. Before WWII, none of that would be considered a reason not to do business with a country. There’s lots worse going on right now in places where we do business > [@Czarcasm](#): > > So there’s plenty of evidence…but you don’t have any of it? Topic was discussed in my high school history class. So yes, widely known, and no, I don’t have my textbook handy. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/148 "2013-08-06T19:15:18Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > Before WWII, none of that would be considered a reason not to do business with a country. That’s different from saying there was no reason. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/149 "2013-08-06T19:21:22Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > Topic was discussed in my high school history class. So yes, widely known, and no, I don’t have my textbook handy. Aren’t you suspicious of “well-documented evidence” that seems to reside only in a school textbook? I know _I_ would at least question such evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/150 "2013-08-06T19:24:53Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > The Nuremberg Laws were passed in 1935 and Kristallnacht was in 1938, so I think your definition of “any reason” might be a little suspect. Yeah, but only Jews, Pinkos & other suspicious types cared about that stuff. During the 50’s Commie Hunts, “premature anti-Fascist” was considered a bad thing to have been. (If I’d been alive then, I’d have been proud to wear that label.) [Prescott Bush’s assets](http://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar) were seized in 1942 under the “Trading With the Enemy” act, But the family wasn’t really sympathetic with the Nazis–they were just in business to make money. And, of course, the family was & is as WASPy as you can get… ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ea5d25/32.png) [@Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Scrappy_Hero_Pup)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/151 "2013-08-06T21:41:06Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Most won’t admit it now of course, since Nazism has become such a byword for evil. But before that happened yes, support for Nazism was widespread among Christians because Communists were officially atheists, and to Christians there’s nothing worse than atheism. It’s better to murder in the name of religion than it is to save lives and be an atheist. That’s true. Book of Kings, IIRC. The special “barracks” for clergy at Dachau was actually a myth propagated by JP Morgan as part of a stock split with Goldman and Sachs. The three million Polish Catholics? A decoy created by Rothschild to later control the Polish Pope. COINCIDENCE??? I saw a doctor in the ER today. Looked squirrelly- like an atheist, so I had to go out and burn down an orphanage. True story. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/152 "2013-08-06T22:42:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Aren’t you suspicious of “well-documented evidence” that seems to reside only in a school textbook? I know _I_ would at least question such evidence. To be even more cynical, he didn’t even actually say there was any evidence in his high school text book, he only said it was discussed in his high school class and that he didn’t have his textbook handy; that the text book might state such nonsense is only implied. Seriously **aNewLeaf** , you claim it’s a well known fact with plenty of evidence, but you are unable to find even the tiniest shred of evidence, just an anecdote from your high school class that’s even bereft of any details. Do you think anyone is buying that? Here’s the extent of the “quite a bit of support in America” that there was for the Nazis: [Zenith of the German American Bund](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_American_Bund): > [@](#): > > Arguably, the zenith of the Bund’s history occurred on February 20, 1939 at Madison Square Garden in New York City. Some 20,000 people attended and heard Kuhn criticize President Roosevelt by repeatedly referring to him as “Frank D. Rosenfeld”, calling his New Deal the “Jew Deal” and denouncing what he believed to be Bolshevik-Jewish American leadership. Most shocking to American sensibilities was the outbreak of violence between protesters and Bund storm troopers. “Some 20,000” listening to a speech is hardy quite a bit of support. One may as well say the Aryan Nations has quite a bit of support in the US today. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/153 "2013-08-06T22:46:45Z")
> [@](#): > > One may as well say the Aryan Nations has quite a bit of support in the US today. I would actually agree with that statement- though not at the levels of pro-German sentiment before WWII. Seriously, you guys didn’t get this in US History? Granted, my class was 30 years ago, but we talked a while about how there were people supporting Germany. Perhaps the problem is the qualifier- I don’t intend to say there were a majority, or even a large plurality who supported the Nazis. But 20,000 people (at one rally) can correctly be called “quite a few people”. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/154 "2013-08-06T23:26:25Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > Yeah, but only Jews, Pinkos & other suspicious types cared about that stuff. During the 50’s Commie Hunts, “premature anti-Fascist” was considered a bad thing to have been. (If I’d been alive then, I’d have been proud to wear that label.) Yes, the way I read it, it’s not so much that active _Nazi ideological_ sympathy was so massively high (though it was real), as that a very large isolationist wing with strong nativist/racist factions (KKK was riding high at the time) did not care whatever some guy with a terrible haircut was doing in and around Germany to movements, people and religions that many of themselves viewed as needing to be put in their place anyway or at best not worth losing sleep. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2013, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/155 "2013-08-06T23:30:52Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > As long as they keep Steve Gutenberg a star, I’m fine with it. Though I’m not too happy with them keeping Atlantis off the maps. Sheesh guys, we already know about it, and the Martians you’re trying to keep under wraps. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/156 "2013-08-07T00:49:39Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > I would actually agree with that statement- though not at the levels of pro-German sentiment before WWII. > Seriously, you guys didn’t get this in US History? Granted, my class was 30 years ago, but we talked a while about how there were people supporting Germany. > > Perhaps the problem is the qualifier- I don’t intend to say there were a majority, or even a large plurality who supported the Nazis. > But 20,000 people (at one rally) can correctly be called “quite a few people”. See the [Silver Shirts](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_shirts). They didn’t get far, but they existed. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/157 "2013-08-07T03:47:48Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > But 20,000 people (at one rally) can correctly be called “quite a few people”. Not really. Forty thousand would be considered a disappointing turnout for a college football game. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/158 "2013-08-07T03:51:44Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Not really. Forty thousand would be considered a disappointing turnout for a college football game. Football is one thing, and politics is another, and college football is a **religion.** ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/159 "2013-08-07T04:32:00Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Football is one thing, and politics is another, and college football is a **religion.** Okay, how about this: [Twenty-Thousand Expected to Attend World Pork Expo](http://nationalhogfarmer.com/resources/twenty-thousand-expected-attend-world-pork-expo). So in terms of cultural influence, the Bund ranks with the National Pork Producers Council. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2013, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364/160 "2013-08-07T06:39:28Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > I would actually agree with that statement- though not at the levels of pro-German sentiment before WWII. You’ve got to be kidding. The Aryan Nations by no stretch of the imagination has quite a bit of support in the US today. They are a miniscule group far out in the margins of American society. > [@](#): > > Seriously, you guys didn’t get this in US History? Granted, my class was 30 years ago, but we talked a while about how there were people supporting Germany. I’d suggest you provide some actual evidence rather than providing the same anecdote of your history class bereft of any actual details again. I was aware of the German American Bund when I was in high school, but then again I knew far more about WW2 than any of my high school teachers. I was reading books on the topic by authors such as Alan Clark, Basil H Liddell Hart, J F C Fuller, John Keegan, Carlo D’Este and the personal memoirs of Erich von Manstein, Erwin Rommel and such in high school. > [@](#): > > Perhaps the problem is the qualifier- I don’t intend to say there were a majority, or even a large plurality who supported the Nazis. > But 20,000 people (at one rally) can correctly be called “quite a few people”. Some 20,000 people **at the largest rally they ever had** that occurred 7 months before Hitler started the war can hardly be correctly called quite a few people considering > [@](#): > > In 1940, 1,237,000 people of German birth lived in the United States, the largest foreign-born ethnic group except for the Italians. Further, if one considered the children of families in which both parents were German-born, the number of Germans in the country reached 5 million and, counting families with one German-born parent, the number rose to 6 million. Source [here](http://www.nps.gov/history/history/online_books/personal_justice_denied/chap12.htm), and note this isn’t even the total Americans of German decent, it’s only the total of immigrants who were born in Germany and the children of immigrants born in Germany living in the US in 1940; second and longer generation immigrants of German descent aren’t included in those numbers. The German American Bund had no power or influence in the US, members never held a single elected office in the US, nor did they come remotely close to being elected to one. Saying that “Nazis had quite a bit of support in America, something people choose to forget." as **Der trihs** does is flatly untrue. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nazis-were-funded-by-wall-street/665364.md?page=9)