# The NFL and bigger than 55" TVS.. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 1, 2004, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102 "2004-02-01T23:22:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/1 "2004-02-01T23:22:10Z")
55" is ok but 60" isn’t? What the fuck is up with that? The NFL says showing the Superbowl[sup]TM[/sup] on TV’s bigger than 55" violates their copyrights. How the hell do they figure that? What difference does the size of the screen make? Charlotte had planned several parties using large screen tv’s but the NFL said no. I wondered why their was not a viewing party in the now named.\*\* Bank of America\*\* stadium. Now I know. Does anyone have any ideas?? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/2 "2004-02-01T23:34:29Z")
Probably has to do with bars showing the game. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/3 "2004-02-01T23:42:17Z")
> [@Mr. Blue Sky](#): > > Probably has to do with bars showing the game. Under 55" is fine. It’s the size that matters. I just don’t understand why. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/4 "2004-02-02T00:00:17Z")
Got link, anyone? ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/5 "2004-02-02T00:09:01Z")
> [@](#): > > In determining whether an event violated the NFL’s copyrights, the league considered the location’s size, **whether TV screens were larger than 55 inches** and whether people had to pay to get in. Some hotels scrapped party plans entirely, while others scrambled to accommodate the estimated 274,000 visitors expected in Las Vegas for the weekend. “As far as I’m concerned, the NFL is full of soup,” Las Vegas mayor Oscar Goodman said. “I would tell them to go shove it.” [http://www.fresnobee.com/sports/story/8076017p-8934994c.html](http://www.fresnobee.com/sports/story/8076017p-8934994c.html) > [@](#): > > here is a super controversy over super Sunday – and it could mean lots of lost money for the Palms Hotel and Casino. The NFL has sent a letter to the hotel casino telling them to cancel their super-sized party planned for Superbowl Sunday. The game was to be shown on the big screens at Brenden Theaters. **Officials say copyright laws allows them to show the game on big screen TV’s up to 55 inches in diagonal, or any kind of commercial screen. But the league disagrees.** [http://www.kvbc.com/Global/story.asp?S=1621555&nav=15MVKUbO](http://www.kvbc.com/Global/story.asp?S=1621555&nav=15MVKUbO) ---
**Author:** ![Michael\_Ellis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/977dab/32.png) [@Michael\_Ellis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael_Ellis)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/6 "2004-02-02T00:50:12Z")
Hey **Reeder** , is there any way we can blame Bush? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/7 "2004-02-02T01:02:08Z")
It’s a question of how many people can watch the game on a given TV. They have made the determination that any larger than 55" can accomodate a few hundred people, therefore it’s a violation of their copyright, trademark, whatever. I don’t think it’s unreasonable. If I were a bar, I’d show the game on multiple TVs to circumvent that rule. All it does is prevent massive private Super Bowl parties that might be using that as a draw for other purposes the NFL may not condone. So what’s the problem? If you made a show and someone used it without your permission to make a lot of money and you saw none of the proceeds, wouldn’t you be pissed? I would be. ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/8 "2004-02-02T01:58:34Z")
> [@](#): > > If you made a show and someone used it without your permission to make a lot of money and you saw none of the proceeds, wouldn’t you be pissed? I would be. Well except, It’s all those people watching the game, be it on 60 inch TVs or 12 inch TVs, in home or bars, which persuades NBC to spend billions to get the right to show the games in the first place. That’s how the NFL gets their proceeds. It just seems stupid to start being a pain in the ass about people watching your game, when the point of your game is to be watched by as many people as possible. ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/9 "2004-02-02T02:06:08Z")
Hee! Maybe the NFL figured that 55" was the minimum size required to get a good view of Janet Jackson’s tit? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/10 "2004-02-02T02:09:18Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Well except, It’s all those people watching the game, be it on 60 inch TVs or 12 inch TVs, in home or bars, which persuades NBC to spend billions to get the right to show the games in the first place. That’s how the NFL gets their proceeds. It just seems stupid to start being a pain in the ass about people watching your game, when the point of your game is to be watched by as many people as possible. Never underestimate corporate greed. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/11 "2004-02-02T02:10:08Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Well except, It’s all those people watching the game, be it on 60 inch TVs or 12 inch TVs, in home or bars, which persuades NBC to spend billions to get the right to show the games in the first place. That’s how the NFL gets their proceeds. It just seems stupid to start being a pain in the ass about people watching your game, when the point of your game is to be watched by as many people as possible. The viewership is going to be massive no matter what, NBC knows they’re going to get their money, and the NFL already got paid. The NFL simply doesn’t want people making substantial amounts of money off their product wthout getting their cut. Fine with me. ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/12 "2004-02-02T02:16:51Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > The viewership is going to be massive no matter what, NBC knows they’re going to get their money, and the NFL already got paid. > > The NFL simply doesn’t want people making substantial amounts of money off their product wthout getting their cut. Fine with me. OK, a little more seriously this time. The network gets its money based on ratings, so the NFL by extension lives off ratings. For a very long time, NFL telecast partners have been complaining that Nielson ratings understate the audience for their games by failing to count the traffic in bars, restaurants and other “communal viewing” venues. There’s an estimation process, IIRC, but the complaint is that this process is completely inadequate for sports events, and in particular large sports events. I suspect this whole thing is a PR thing more directed at Nielsen (or the purchasers who make decisions based on ratings) than it is an actual enforcement action aimed at the actual trangressors. ---
**Author:** ![Reeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Reeder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reeder)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/13 "2004-02-02T02:18:45Z")
The game is on CBS. Just fyi ya know. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/14 "2004-02-02T02:49:13Z")
> [@Reeder](#): > > The game is on CBS. > > Just fyi ya know. CBS, NBC, FOX, CBN, Playboy…whatever. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Bouncer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9d8465/32.png) [@Bouncer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bouncer)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/15 "2004-02-02T06:12:43Z")
I am curious though… I’m not sure if they would actually be successful. The venues are recieving an over the air signal broadcast on a public medium. How do you prove intent? I mean, I have a bar with seven 70 inch screens and they coincidentally happen to be recieving a broadcast on a federally mandated and publicly owned channel, not a pay per view (private broadcast) or tape recorded event. And I happen to be open for normal operations (as I happen to be on every super bowl sunday and every news year eve to boot). How does the NFL prove that A) I infringed a copyright on a public broadcast which every reciever in the US is eligible to recive and B) that it cost the NFL money? Where’s the financial loss? Regards, -Bouncer- ps: If any of this ever actually goes to court, would someone point me to it so I can follow this case? ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lodoen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b3f665/32.png) [@Jeff\_Lodoen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lodoen)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/16 "2004-02-02T11:24:11Z")
I seem to recall ASCAP has gone after businesses that just had a radio on a music station. Urban legend? What I haven’t heard is: did the casinos even try to make an agreement with the NFL? Why is there a stink this year? Sounds a bit like the power-plays between network affiliates and cable companies of the last few years. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/17 "2004-02-02T14:15:33Z")
Bouncer, I think you’ll lose that suit. I recall back in the day, the Buffalo Bills rarely sold out the stadium, resulting in a blackout in Buffalo and “neighboring” Rochester, but not in Syracuse, which is about an hour from Rochester. A bar on the far edge of Rochester, roughly a 2hr drive from Rich Stadium, pointed some high-powered antenna at Syracuse and showed the games. Found an [article](http://buffalo.bizjournals.com/buffalo/stories/1998/08/17/story4.html) dealing with the general issue. No Fun League. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/18 "2004-02-02T14:28:49Z")
Shit I **knew** they were lying, size does matter. ---
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/19 "2004-02-02T14:41:54Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > CBS, NBC, FOX, CBN, Playboy…whatever. 😛 I have this mental image of **Airman Doors, USAF** watching the “Queer Eye” marathon on NBC and wondering when the heck the game was going to start … ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102/20 "2004-02-02T16:23:45Z")
I can honestly say that I have never seen “Queer Eye” the whole way through (at most about 5 minutes until I get annoyed) and frankly I find the whole concept of that show utterly loathesome, but that’s another story altogether. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nfl-and-bigger-than-55-tvs/227102.md?page=2)