# The NYC biker gang beat down **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 3, 2013, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236 "2013-10-03T01:14:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2013, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/201 "2013-10-10T21:06:59Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Those videos really piss me off. I’m just really fucking angry right now. > > Bunch of fucking savages. Pretty much covers it. I wonder… since there is so, so much evidence of the crimes… If a defendant like Cruz got on the stand and denied what he did, since he is under oath, would that be contempt of court? You can’t lie to the court without repercussions, correct? It would be a clear lie. And it’s recorded on video. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2013, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/202 "2013-10-10T21:31:16Z")
It would be perjury, but people don’t generally get charged with perjury for merely refuting evidence introduced against them. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2013, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/203 "2013-10-10T21:57:46Z")
One wonders if (or how much) the telling of lies when refuting the prosecutor’s allegations and evidence affects the judge’s/jury’s use of discretion in deciding on the severity of the sentence. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/204 "2013-10-11T00:49:30Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > [Like this (- Jay Meezee (From his track It’s Nuttin.):](https://soundcloud.com/jay-meezee/its-nuttin)(audio plays directly, skip to 1:10 The other linked rap upthread, or maybe it’s the same one, seems to have some trouble developing its theme. It starts with ‘cocaine’, but seems lyrically devoid of further content. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/205 "2013-10-11T00:55:43Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > It would be perjury, but people don’t generally get charged with perjury for merely refuting evidence introduced against them. If Cruz continues to claim that “he was looking for his friends” I feel sorry for the jury. You’re not supposed to laugh in the jury box. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/206 "2013-10-11T02:31:27Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Well yeah, a line of large Harleys is going to require at least a Semi or a Hummer. my car has reverse. And if I’m swarmed by crazy people on motorcycles I’m going to be doing S turns to knock them over as they try to pass. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/207 "2013-10-11T02:54:59Z")
While it’s easy to fantasize about it, I would be seriously scared if I was up against a gang of crazed biker thugs. With only a four wheel drive vehicle. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/208 "2013-10-11T03:44:46Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > While it’s easy to fantasize about it, I would be seriously scared if I was up against a gang of crazed biker thugs. With only a four wheel drive vehicle. I would be scared but not because I was in an SUV. A 4 wheeled steel cage with seat belts and air bags is to a machine gun what a 2 wheel motorcycle is to a knife. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/209 "2013-10-11T04:05:52Z")
In actual trial, he probably won’t take the stand. Those statements probably won’t enter into it. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/210 "2013-10-11T06:00:31Z")
No mention of hitting a biker who was blocking the road, now they’re saying it was during a lane change. [ > [@](#): > > Nearly two weeks later, some bikers are suggesting SUV driver Alexian Lien, knowingly or not, instigated the confrontation off-camera earlier by clipping one of the bikes in a rally on the Henry Hudson Parkway in Manhattan. > > Authorities are looking into everything that unfolded along the ride’s path from lower to upper Manhattan, including the possibility a motorcyclist hit the SUV, not the other way around, and broke its side mirror before the encounters on the video, said a law enforcement official, who hadn’t been authorized to discuss the inquiry and spoke to The Associated Press on the condition of anonymity. > [@](#): > > Attorney Gloria Allred, representing Edwin Mieses Jr., the biker who was crushed, claims Lien bumped another motorcycle while changing lanes on the highway 2 to 3 miles before his SUV knocked into biker Christopher Cruz. > > “We have evidence that he hit that (first) bike and didn’t stop,” Allred said by phone. > > Mieses, of Lawrence, Mass., didn’t see any earlier encounter but got off his motorcycle to defuse the tense situation and was headed back when he was hit from behind by the SUV, she said. He broke his legs and suffered a spine injury and likely is paralyzed, his family has said. > > Allred declined to say what other witnesses had contacted her, but another biker who participated in the rally, Louis Castaldo, gave a similar account in an interview on Fox 5 News. > > Castaldo said that when bikers tried to approach Lien’s Range Rover, Lien “decides to run over three or four people. … He should have just apologized.” ]([http://bigstory.ap.org/article/bikers-camera-acts-led-nyc-driver-run](http://bigstory.ap.org/article/bikers-camera-acts-led-nyc-driver-run)) Sorry buddy, but when I see bikers swarming around an SUV and trying to blockade it, followed by a biker trying to open the driver’s door of the SUV, things have gone beyond “a simple apology” and into “attempted retribution”, and that assumes that Lien did hit a biker, a fact which hasn’t actually been established yet. ---
**Author:** ![epbrown01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@epbrown01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/epbrown01)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 6:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/211 "2013-10-11T06:42:20Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Sorry buddy, but when I see bikers swarming around an SUV and trying to blockade it, followed by a biker trying to open the driver’s door of the SUV, things have gone beyond “a simple apology” and into “attempted retribution”, and that assumes that Lien did hit a biker, a fact which hasn’t actually been established yet. This is finally making the media, but members of the group have long claimed online that Lien hit someone’s bike, starting the chase. What this doesn’t mention is they admit they were attempting to block access to the road with the bike when he did it, meaning they are _still_ responsible for the instigating act - they have no more right to use their bikes to block the road than they do to use them to force someone to stop, as Cruz does. Definitely this doesn’t authorize them to pursue the guy recklessly down the highway, try to force him to stop or off the road, or to break his window, drag him from his car and beat him and cut him. ---
**Author:** ![snailboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/97f17d/32.png) [@snailboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snailboy)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/212 "2013-10-11T09:50:08Z")
I fear this is going to reflect poorly on all sportbikers. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/213 "2013-10-11T11:55:47Z")
After Lien is supposed to have hit the bike, how many phone calls to the police did the bikers make? How many phone calls to the police did Lien or his wife make? ---
**Author:** ![grude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47774/32.png) [@grude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grude)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/214 "2013-10-11T12:25:19Z")
This story and the evidence and continuing developments is one of the absolute craziest things I have ever seen. I can’t believe anyone, anywhere could side with the bikers. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/215 "2013-10-11T13:47:17Z")
The way they where riding is about as unpredictable as I’ve ever seen. Doesn’t surprise me in the least if one of them got bumped. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/216 "2013-10-11T14:06:04Z")
What is this ‘evidence’ Gloria? Why haven’t you brought it forward to the police? ---
**Author:** ![newcomer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e5b9ba/32.png) [@newcomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newcomer)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/217 "2013-10-11T14:12:36Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > While it’s easy to fantasize about it, I would be seriously scared if I was up against a gang of crazed biker thugs. With only a four wheel drive vehicle. I think about that too. I mean, the intimidation may affect different person differently and someone else might have crashed the SUV perhaps even rollover in the attempt to make a “clean break”. It’s astonishing that people are questioning SUV driver’s motives. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/218 "2013-10-11T16:05:04Z")
> [@newcomer](#): > > I think about that too. > > I mean, the intimidation may affect different person differently and someone else might have crashed the SUV perhaps even rollover in the attempt to make a “clean break”. > > **It’s astonishing that people are questioning SUV driver’s motives.** Defense lawyers, it’s what they do. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/219 "2013-10-11T16:29:35Z")
That they do it in the media rather than just before the courts is often cringe worthy. At what point is a lawyer gaining fame (and clients) at the expense of the client gaining further notoriety, and just how does such notoriety help the client when the matter is before the court? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2013, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236/220 "2013-10-11T18:03:50Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Defense lawyers, it’s what they do. Allred appears to be representing him as a plaintiff in a civil action against the SUV driver, not as a defendant in a criminal case. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-nyc-biker-gang-beat-down/670236.md?page=12)