# The official "Mr. Moto is a clueless right-wing Republican shill" thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 29, 2005, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797 "2005-07-29T19:54:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/301 "2005-08-03T01:00:03Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Well, that vote smart site doesn’t have info on Santorum: > > Also, his web site seems to be mostly fluff. (Most elected politicians web pages don’t have any real meat on the bones these days.) So, I don’t know. Why don’t you guys tell me: Is he more extreme than Pelosi? If so, who cares? It’s not as if the republicans have him running the party. You know, I was going to jump all over this, but you have demonstrated your own cluelessness far more clearly than anything I could add. I will just let your inanity speak for itself. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/302 "2005-08-03T01:06:36Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > You know, I was going to jump all over this, but you have demonstrated your own cluelessness far more clearly than anything I could add. I will just let your inanity speak for itself. I think he’s made it pretty clear that the only thing he knows is what the Libruls are doing that he doesn’t like. He doesn’t know what the Libruls are doing that he likes. He doesn’t know what the Conservatives are doing that he doesn’t like. He doesn’t know what the Conservatives are doing that he likes. Therefore the score will always be Libruls -1, Conservatives 0. Seems pretty clear to me that his is a mind that’s closed tighter than one of those really tight things. -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/303 "2005-08-03T01:32:09Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Shit. My bad. I always get Santorum and Wellstone confused. I apologize. > > Let me read up on his site and compare with Pelosi. I’ll let you know what I come up with… You don’t know who Santorum is and yet you’re in here yapping as if you know something about politics? ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/304 "2005-08-03T02:33:09Z")
What’s the point of arguing with a Pet Rock? In other news, kudos, **Bricker** , for showing the kind of integrity you’re often lauded for and I rarely ever have the pleasure of experiencing with my own eyes. Why you’re able to do that and still support a lying, murdering MF as your President, I’ll never pretend to even begin to understand. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/305 "2005-08-03T03:16:35Z")
Confusing Santorum and Wellstone is like confusing Obi-wan Kenobe with Jobba the Hutt. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/306 "2005-08-03T04:14:40Z")
> [@](#): > > **Mr. Moto** : I note that Bob Dole, when faced with similar circumstances in 1996, chose to resign his Senate seat, concluding that he couldn’t be an effective senator and a presidential candidate at the same time. And thus he became neither. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/307 "2005-08-03T10:44:30Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Santorum is a wacky far left liberal This line is just too good to pass up; I think I’ll be quoting it when **Debaser** enters political threads :). Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/308 "2005-08-03T13:27:28Z")
Great job, team! I momentarily confused two senators. (One with a reputation for being the biggest foam in mouth liberal in the land, the other with a reputation for being the biggest foam in mouth conservative.) For this I deserve to be mocked forever by a crowd of SDMB’s finest. :rolleyes: This is much easier than actually dealing with the reality that your party has veered off the tracks and is controlled by a bunch of loons from the lunatic left fringe. It saves you the trouble from actually thinking. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/309 "2005-08-03T13:28:58Z")
And, cue the whining about a pile on… ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/310 "2005-08-03T13:30:22Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > For this I deserve to be mocked forever by a crowd of SDMB’s finest. I’m not mocking you - I just shall never consider your opinion on politics to be worth anything anymore. Umm… you do know Wellstone is dead, don’t you? Almost three years now. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/311 "2005-08-03T13:37:10Z")
> [@This Year's Model](#): > > Umm… you do know Wellstone is dead, don’t you? Almost three years now. Post #289. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/312 "2005-08-03T13:44:41Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Post #289. I must have been confused by all the times you typed “Santorum” in that post. 😛 P.S. That was mocking. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/313 "2005-08-03T13:53:46Z")
I know! That’s right. I confused them. I must be an idiot. This is one of the things that really sucks about the SDMB sometimes. Any weakness, any momentary lapse or chink in the armour is exploited immediately, often at the expense of reasoned debate. Yes, I momentarily confused the two senators. For some reason I always mix them up: Santorum and Wellstone. I do know who they both are, obviously. I was saying Santorum was dead, and thinking he was liberal. That sounds like Wellstone to you, does it not? I further compounded my weakness by admitting that I was going to go and do some research on Santorum’s actual positions before commenting on who is more extremist: him or Pelosi. I know he’s a conservative guy, but I didn’t want to make an argument that he was “more” conservative than Pelosi is liberal without doing a bit of research. From this people took the rediculous assumption that I don’t know who he is at all, and now will never listen to another word I say. _shrug_ Anybody close minded enough to use such a silly mistake to discount my opinion forever is obviously not worth talking with in the first place. Maybe I should just be like **Fear Itself** and just call my opponents clueless without even bothering to make an argument at all. ---
**Author:** ![coleridge78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@coleridge78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coleridge78)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/314 "2005-08-03T13:54:54Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Great job, team! I momentarily confused two senators. (One with a reputation for being the biggest foam in mouth liberal in the land, the other with a reputation for being the biggest foam in mouth conservative.) For this I deserve to be mocked forever by a crowd of SDMB’s finest. :rolleyes: This is much easier than actually dealing with the reality that your party has veered off the tracks and is controlled by a bunch of loons from the lunatic left fringe. It saves you the trouble from actually thinking. And so you neatly, again, avoid answering any of the questions or requests for evidence that have been made of you. Additionally: you obviously didn’t just “momentarily confuse two senators”. You then admitted that you had _no idea_ who Rick Santorum was, his positions on issues, or his position in the Republican ranks. Don’t try to distract from the issue. You do know that the hallmark of someone who is not only stupid but also truly delusional, is abject distortions directed at the same people that were paying attention to the original exchange. Just thought I’d point that out as a concerned reader… ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/315 "2005-08-03T13:57:10Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > And, cue the whining about a pile on… **Sam** should be here in a second to help with the whining. Although maybe not. After all, if he did that he might have to come back to his economics thread in GD. Oh, and **Debaser** , I thought that Kerry was the most liberal senator. Or is that a label attached only to whichever librul is most convenient at the time? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/316 "2005-08-03T13:58:44Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > Any weakness, any momentary lapse or chink in the armour is exploited immediately, often at the expense of reasoned debate. Reasoned debate? When have heard anything but mindless liberal bashing from you? Regurgitating talking points from your favorite blog is not reasoned debate, **Debaser**. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/317 "2005-08-03T14:03:58Z")
> [@coleridge78](#): > > And so you neatly, again, avoid answering any of the questions or requests for evidence that have been made of you. This is a lie. I have posted arguments with numerous cites to back up my claims. > [@](#): > > Additionally: you obviously didn’t just “momentarily confuse two senators”. You then admitted that you had _no idea_ who Rick Santorum was, his positions on issues, or his position in the Republican ranks. This is a lie. I admitted no such thing. ---
**Author:** ![coleridge78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@coleridge78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coleridge78)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/318 "2005-08-03T14:10:12Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > This is a lie. I have posted arguments with numerous cites to back up my claims. First example off the top of my head: despite repeated queries, you never bothered even an attempt at either defining the center. Hard to have a discussion about where people are in regards to the center unless you, um, say what the center is. Second: despite repeated queries, you never outlined your own perspective–your own relation to the “center”. This despite repeatedly being asked to do so after claiming to hold a number of “liberal” and quite mainstream positions. So. It was not a lie. You offered one list whose methodology is a joke, as detailed by other posters, and have not made any good faith attempt to even establish a baseline for the discussion. Nice try. How about rather than calling me a liar, you answer those questions? I’ll be silent and not distract you anymore… > [@Debaser](#): > > This is a lie. I admitted no such thing. Again: Not a lie. You admitted having to go look up Santorum’s positions (ie, you knew nothing other than maybe that he was a Republican, if even that). You also tried to claim that he was of no importance to the party, which is untrue (as pointed out by another poster). So, again: you neither knew his positions, nor his status in the party, and hence if you _did_ know his name it hardly matters as you knew nothing relevant about him. So. It was not a lie. How about rather than calling me a liar, you answer those questions? I’ll be silent and not distract you anymore… ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/319 "2005-08-03T14:23:53Z")
> [@coleridge78](#): > > First example off the top of my head: despite repeated queries, you never bothered even an attempt at either defining the center. Hard to have a discussion about where people are in regards to the center unless you, um, say what the center is. When outnumbered 10 to 1 it’s difficult to respond to every request made of you. The only person who asked for the definition of “center” was one newby poster who was also busy posted incorrect facts without cites and tossing all kinds of requests at me on how I should be framing my argument. Yes, I ignored some of his requests. Some of them were pointless and not related to my main argument. But I did try to answer most of them. I don’t think it’s nessesary to define the center in order to label Pelosi or Kerry an extreme leftist. I notice you guys haven’t bothered to define the center and you are having no trouble labelling Santorum an extreme conservative. How does one go about “defining the center” anyway? > [@](#): > > Second: despite repeated queries, you never outlined your own perspective–your own relation to the “center”. This despite repeatedly being asked to do so after claiming to hold a number of “liberal” and quite mainstream positions. I gave my position on many issues. Name an issue and I’ll tell you my position on it. I’m not hiding anything. It’s silly to attack my as if I’m being unresponsive when it’s not even clear what it is you want from me. > [@](#): > > So. It was not a lie. Yes it was. You claimed that I “ **avoid answering any of the questions or requests for evidence that have been made of you.** ” This is demonstrably false. I’ve answered many of the questions and requests for evidence that have been made of me. Maybe not every single one of them, but definitely most of them. Your statment is not true. If you read the last couple pages of this thread you would know it’s not true. That makes it a lie. > [@](#): > > Again: Not a lie. You admitted having to go look up Santorum’s positions (ie, you knew nothing other than maybe that he was a Republican, if even that). You also tried to claim that he was of no importance to the party, which is untrue (as pointed out by another poster). Yes, it is another lie. I admitted I wanted to do some research before stating whether or not Santorum was more extreme, IMO, than Pelosi. For you to infer that this means I don’t know anything about him is just stupid. I also stated “it’s not as if Republicans have him running the party” ie, comparing him to Howard Dean the DNC chair. For you to insist that this means I don’t know anything about Santorum’s status in the party is also simply stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2005, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797/320 "2005-08-03T15:01:07Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > When outnumbered 10 to 1 it’s difficult to respond to every request made of you. … I don’t think it’s nessesary to define the center in order to label Pelosi or Kerry an extreme leftist. Having been the “1” in the 10-on-1 position you describe, I’m very sympathetic to your plight… but I must step in again and object to Senator Kerry’s being characterized as an extreme leftist. Now, I’ll admit I’m taking a snapshot of “Senator Kerry, Democratic candidiate for President,” and not “Senator Kerry: 20 Years a Senator.” I agree that in the early part of his career, he was much more leftist than he is now. But NOW, TODAY, Senator Kerry is, in my view, a moderate, centrist Democrat. We’ve already been down this road on guns, and I believe you ended up saying that he was taking anti-gun, but not outrageously anti-gun, positions. I would argue that even there, mild, non-onerous regulation of guns is something the average American favors. (Not I - but then, I’m conservative, not centrist.) I don’t believe you can point to other policies drawn from his campaign that paint Senator Kerry as a far-leftist, either. If you can, I’m all ears (eyes?). If not, I would humbly suggest it’s wiser to leave that label off Kerry, who doesn’t deserve it and whose presence on the list dilutes the list’s persuasiveness. Pelosi? Dean? Sure. Kucinich? You betcha. Ted Kennedy? Yes. Kerry? Nope, not now. - Rick [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-official-mr-moto-is-a-clueless-right-wing-republican-shill-thread/314797.md?page=17)