# "The Origin of Tipping" and the origin of "tip" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [March 9, 2005, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687 "2005-03-09T17:29:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Interrobang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/interrobang/32/17463_2.png) [@Interrobang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Interrobang)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2005, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/1 "2005-03-09T17:29:23Z")
In [Cecil’s 1976 column](http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_333.html) on tipping, he mentions this common origin story: > [@Cecil Adams](#): > > The most charming explanation refers us back to the days of Dr. Johnson and his eighteenth century circle of wits. Upon entering his local coffeeshop for a session of epigram-flinging, Dr. Johnson (or rather, one presumes, his flunky, Mr. Boswell) would drop a few pence in a box labeled “To Insure Promptness” (“T.I.P.”–get it?) in order to encourage a greater display of vigor on the part of the generally listless attendants. Cecil doesn’t use that as an explanation – the word clearly predates that story – but he doesn’t say the story is untrue. (He just implies it.) [Snopes](http://www.snopes.com/language/acronyms/tip.htm), on the other hand, explicitly says that those “to insure promptness” boxes just didn’t exist, and puts the word’s earliest use at around 1610. Obviously, the word isn’t an acronym. But is the Johnson story or a variation thereof at least partly true? Etymologists have been busy since 1976 – hell, we know where “OK” and “The Big Apple” came from now – so what’s new in the origins of “tip”? Also, what’s the origin of the acronym explanation for “tip”? Where does this bogus explanation come from? (This is prompted by last night’s trivia quiz, where the quizmistress asked what “tip” originally stood for. Thankfully, even though we knew the story was untrue, we knew what she thought she was asking for.) ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2005, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/2 "2005-03-09T17:45:08Z")
A mad desire to fill in all the empty spaces in etymology with spurious acronyms appears to have arisen during the 20th century, possibly as a result of the acronym-happy Second World War. ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2005, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/3 "2005-03-09T18:41:30Z")
**A** cronymic **C** itations **R** arely **O** r **N** ever **Y** ield **M** uch **S** ense 😛 Anyway, I have to hand a copy of _Brewer’s Dictionary of Phrase and Fable_, and here’s what is has to say on the matter: > [@](#): > > **Tip.** A small present of money, such as that given to a waiter or porter, from the cant\* verb (common in the 16th and 17th centuries) “to tip”, meaning “to hand over”, which also gives rise to the other signification of the verb, i.e. private warning, such secret information as may guide the person tipped to make successful bets or gain some other advantage. - “cant” is cross-referenced, the meaning being “The specialized vocabulary of a particular group of people, such as thieves, lawyers or journalists.” So basically, it is related to the other meaning of “tip”, in the betting sense. ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2005, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/4 "2005-03-09T18:48:24Z")
Or, in other words, pretty much what Cecil and Snopes said. I’d love to get hold of whoever invents all these cutesy acronyms, and give them a good working over with a G.O.L.F. club. ---
**Author:** ![Interrobang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/interrobang/32/17463_2.png) [@Interrobang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Interrobang)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2005, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/5 "2005-03-09T19:42:34Z")
I know the acronym origin story is bogus. I wasn’t as clear on that as I should’ve been. (The OED gives the 1610 date as the earliest citation for “tip” as “To give; to hand, pass; to let one have; to put on, present, or exhibit the character of: usually with dative of person.” 1706 is the earliest citation for “To give a gratuity to; to bestow a small present of money upon (an inferior), esp. upon a servant or employee of another, nominally in return for a service rendered or in order to obtain an extra service; also upon a child or schoolboy.” Unfortunately, I wasn’t able to access the OED site through the Seattle Public Library when I first posted this thread.) I guess my real question is: who came up with the acronym origin? When does it date to? As **John W. Kennedy** says, lots of acronym origins sprang up after WWII, but there’s still got to be someone somewhere who came up with this particular story at a particular time, and I’m wondering when that is. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2005, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/6 "2005-03-10T04:29:47Z")
> [@Interrobang!?](#): > > I guess my real question is: who came up with the acronym origin? When does it date to? As **John W. Kennedy** says, lots of acronym origins sprang up after WWII, but there’s still got to be someone somewhere who came up with this particular story at a particular time, and I’m wondering when that is. A quick search of major newspapers found an 1895 cite which gave the origin as the box in an English tavern with the “T.I.P.” over it. I’ll search a bit more. I have no doubt that the mistaken idea goes back even farther. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2005, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/7 "2005-03-10T19:12:19Z")
Well, here’s the thing. Just beauce “tip” didn’t originate from “T.I.P. boxes” doesn’t mean that such boxes never existed. For example- there was a HUGE UL going on for years about aluminum cans & pop tops- each pop-top was worth a minute on a kidney machine or some such. However, after about a decade of showing this UL false and debunking it, some companies actually started asking for the pop-tops! :smack: :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2005, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/8 "2005-03-10T23:35:47Z")
[Word Detective](http://www.word-detective.com/030600.html#tip) on “TIP” ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2005, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/9 "2005-03-11T01:18:26Z")
The “Word Detective” article goes astray on one point, though. “In-” and “en-” were pretty much interchangeable in the 18th century. Quibbling on “ensure” _vs._ “insure” in period is useless. ---
**Author:** ![Faldage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Faldage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Faldage)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2005, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/10 "2005-03-17T01:31:13Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > A quick search of major newspapers found an 1895 cite which gave the origin as the box in an English tavern with the “T.I.P.” over it. This is very interesting. If pre-WWII acronyms are so rare why would we find a pre-20c claim to an acronymic origin for anything? ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2005, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/11 "2005-03-17T02:02:43Z")
“Rare” is not “nonexistent”. Medieval Judaism was very fond of acronyms, and back-acronyms are far from unknown. (For example, the word “cabal”, actually derived from Hebrew via mediaeval Latin, was explained in the Restoration as **C** lifford, **A** rlington, **B** uckingham, **A** shley, **L** auderdale, five lords who pretty much controlled the government of Charles II for some time, and the myth that this was the actual origin of the word lasted at least into the 1950’s. ---
**Author:** ![APB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@APB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/APB)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2005, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/12 "2005-03-18T16:18:14Z")
> [@John W. Kennedy](#): > > For example, the word “cabal”, actually derived from Hebrew via mediaeval Latin, was explained in the Restoration as **C** lifford, **A** rlington, **B** uckingham, **A** shley, **L** auderdale, five lords who pretty much controlled the government of Charles II for some time, and the myth that this was the actual origin of the word lasted at least into the 1950’s. [nitpick] Everyone at the time who used ‘cabal’ to describe Clifford, Arlington, Buckingham, Ashley and Lauderdale knew that it was an older word - that’s what made the joke (vaguely) amusing - and, as several of the best-known memoirs of the time explain it, there was never a time thereafter when the correct explanation had been completely forgotten. Macaulay knew it was older, as did the compilers of the first edition of the _OED_. [/nitpick] ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2005, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/13 "2005-03-18T20:28:36Z")
> [@APB](#): > > [nitpick] > > Everyone at the time who used ‘cabal’ to describe Clifford, Arlington, Buckingham, Ashley and Lauderdale knew that it was an older word - that’s what made the joke (vaguely) amusing - and, as several of the best-known memoirs of the time explain it, there was never a time thereafter when the correct explanation had been completely forgotten. Macaulay knew it was older, as did the compilers of the first edition of the _OED_. > > [/nitpick] Sure, the people who invented it knew better, and scholars knew better. But I actually remember being taught that “Clifford, Arlington, Buckingham, Ashley and Lauderdale” was the true orgin. It doesn’t matter how stupid something is. Put it in print, and people will believe it. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2005, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/14 "2005-03-18T21:23:42Z")
> [@John W. Kennedy](#): > > Put it in print, and people will believe it. You’re absolutely right! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Interrobang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/interrobang/32/17463_2.png) [@Interrobang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Interrobang)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2005, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/15 "2005-03-19T02:01:35Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Just beauce “tip” didn’t originate from “T.I.P. boxes” doesn’t mean that such boxes never existed. This is a good point, and another of my questions. No doubt “tips” predate the “to insure prompt service” box story. But did those boxes exist, with T.I.P.S. written on them, explained by the acronym? Or are the boxes themselves as bogus as the explanation? ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2005, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/16 "2005-03-19T02:53:37Z")
> [@Interrobang!?](#): > > This is a good point, and another of my questions. No doubt “tips” predate the “to insure prompt service” box story. But did those boxes exist, with T.I.P.S. written on them, explained by the acronym? Or are the boxes themselves as bogus as the explanation? I’ve posted my 1895 “find” to the American Dialect Society Mailing List. Perhaps in the next few days we’ll have some info from some experts about the origin of acronyms in the 19th Century. If you want an educated opinion, …NO, there were never any “tip” boxes. The idea that there was even a discussion of acronyms at that point was of surprise to one of the list members who is one of the experts. If I don’t report back in a few days, someone jog this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Interrobang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/interrobang/32/17463_2.png) [@Interrobang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Interrobang)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2005, 7:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-origin-of-tipping-and-the-origin-of-tip/293687/17 "2005-03-28T07:30:15Z")
**Samclem** : not reporting back. Thread: jogged.