# The original Mary Poppins has had its {UK} rating raised over discriminatory language **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [February 27, 2024, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160 "2024-02-27T12:09:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/61 "2024-02-28T13:21:50Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > This is a word I’d heard before, but not enough to catch its meaning. It had connected with “Hot to trot” in my brain, so I thought it was just some old-timey phrase for someone who thought they were “all that.” You’re not the only one. That’s exactly what I thought the word meant. > [@Odesio](#): > > I’m also curious to find out how many words, phrases, or images have racist or bigoted origins. Well, the word “kaffir” is falling out of favor in the English-speaking world. You might not have come accross it, but if you’ve ever cooked Thai or even other Southeast Asian food, kaffir limes and lime leaves are common. The word itself is _extremely_ offensive in South Africa, on the level of the word “nigger” in the US (to my understanding). The preferred term now is either “makrut limes” or “Thai limes”. (Now the etymology of the “kaffir” in “kaffir limes” may not be the same as in the pejorative word – it is uncertain. I don’t think I’ve read any definitve etymology, but it’s so strong and occasionally I do interact with South Africans, so it’s just safer for me not to ever need to use it except in discussions about the word.) “Gypsy” is maybe another one. That’s crossed the line into a word I avoid. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/62 "2024-02-28T13:52:47Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > > [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](#): > > > > a favorite insult of Captain Haddock in the _Tintin_ comics, where it was spelled “bashi-bazouk.” > > Here was me thinking that was a Belgian’s interpretation of what a scottish person says when they are drunk 🙂 Apropos of this thread, Hergé supposedly gave Haddock his trademark array of insults because the censors wouldn’t let the character “swear like a sailor.” ---
**Author:** ![Mikkel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikkel/32/13151_2.png) [@Mikkel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mikkel)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/63 "2024-02-28T13:56:35Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > Why, then, can we spell out “hottentot”? Shouldn’t it be the H-word? I think there are too many offensive words. We will end up with guessing what word is not spelled out. I’m quite certain that my vocabulary is not up to that challenge. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/64 "2024-02-28T14:02:28Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > “Gypsy” is maybe another one. That’s crossed the line into a word I avoid. In recent months I used that word and a friend told me “Gypsy was just as bad as the n-word.” Another friend piped up, “It can’t be just as bad because you were willing to say it but wouldn’t say the other word.” But you’re right, it’s a word that is rapidly fallout out of favor here in the United States and I try to say Roma when I’m talking about the Roma. Language does change and sometimes what was acceptable becomes unacceptable. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/65 "2024-02-28T14:20:07Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Moderating: > > > [@Dinsdale](#): > > > > > [@MrDibble](#): > > > > > > Coloured South African > > > > That’s 1! I’ll make sure not to use THAT term when chasing and whipping people of color - in South Africa or elsewhere. > > > > Of course, I could imagine some persons not appreciating being called “coloured”. 😉 > > Don’t be a jerk. He just said it’s an offensive slur that was used against him. And the way it was used in the movie is AS A SLUR. His use of the word “colored” was not a slur. On reflection, this was really beyond the pale, and this is a formal warning for being a jerk, and dancing around referring to another poster by an ethnic slur. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/66 "2024-02-28T14:24:19Z")
The British are trying to come to terms with their colonialism. This is becoming a bigger deal as Britain becomes more multicultural (or, perhaps rather, as the post war colonial POC immigrants have become a second and third generation that holds money and power). Like in the U.S., its a push pull - Brexit being a pull back to the “good ole days” of white colonialist Britain - recognizing and addressing colonial language being a push forward to “maybe its important for us to address our past.” (Empireland by Sathnam Sanghera is worth a read - very readable. Also, reading about Sara Baartman is worthwhile - she’s the “Hottentot Venus” and her body was owned and displayed and analyzed in some really disturbing ways. And thanks Odesio for using the word Roma, its a long battle to get Americans to even realize there is a historically oppressed ethnic identity in there - frankly, Americans are so focused on our own horrifying treatment of African-Americans that we tend to have blinders on that we and the rest of the world have been engaging in racism against a LOT of different people for a LONG time) ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/67 "2024-02-28T14:32:14Z")
We’ve been here before with the “c-word” - there are a few words - and its only a few - that are so offensive that when a person who is in that group reads them or hears them there is sometimes a physical response - they are trigger words. But context can matter. For instance, I don’t get a visceral response to “gypsy” generally - I did when reading it in a recent academic paper about the Roma in the Holocaust - there is was not an appropriate word and the author and their reviewers should know better. I almost always do to the c-word. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/68 "2024-02-28T14:33:33Z")
> [@Mikkel](#): > > I think there are too many offensive words. > [@Odesio](#): > > In recent months I used that word and a friend told me “Gypsy was just as bad as the n-word.” Another friend piped up, “It can’t be just as bad because you were willing to say it but wouldn’t say the other word.” Just in case it isn’t obvious: Offensiveness is not an all-or-nothing dichotomy. Not all problematic words are equally bad. Just because one word isn’t as bad as another doesn’t mean we can or should use it with impunity. And, conversely, just because some people find a word offensive does not mean it should necessarily be the same level of taboo as other offensive words. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/69 "2024-02-28T15:03:22Z")
There’s also (or there was) a DC Comics character named “[Gypsy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gypsy_(comics)).” No doubt they’ll quietly drop her from view, as they should. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/70 "2024-02-28T15:08:21Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > There’s also (or there was) a DC Comics character named “[Gypsy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gypsy_(comics)).” And a [Broadway musical](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gypsy_(musical)). ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/71 "2024-02-28T15:08:52Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > But context can matter. This is key but sometimes hard to know? Sometimes an innocent usage of something that has a slur context or even sounds like a slur word is to be avoided. And who is the arbiter? Context in the movie was clearly part of a casual racist and colonialist mindset that was common of the era and that stands out today. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/72 "2024-02-28T15:19:08Z")
Which is why its best to avoid those words altogether. Because just like most people don’t want to accidentally trip someone else, most people don’t want to hurt someone with their words. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/73 "2024-02-28T15:24:53Z")
“The past is a foreign place, they do things different there.” Addressing words that are used today is important (renaming sports teams, for instance). Disclaiming them as they’ve been used in the past is important (identifying them as used in Mary Poppins and putting the disclaimer around it). However, trying to edit history, rewrite literature, bury art - that isn’t great. We need to see the past to understand it. See also “if the study of history isn’t making you uncomfortable, you are doing it wrong.” ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/74 "2024-02-28T15:51:05Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > “Gypsy” is maybe another one. That’s crossed the line into a word I avoid. Which got a bit of attention a couple years ago when the [Entomological Society of America formally adopted “spongy moth”](https://entsoc.org/news/press-releases/spongy-moth-approved-new-common-name-lymantria-dispar) as the standard common name for the species Lymantria dispar, previously called “gypsy moth”. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/75 "2024-02-28T18:37:00Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Well, the word “kaffir” is falling out of favor in the English-speaking world. You might not have come accross it, but if you’ve ever cooked Thai or even other Southeast Asian food, kaffir limes and lime leaves are common. The word itself is _extremely_ offensive in South Africa, on the level of the word “nigger” in the US (to my understanding). The preferred term now is either “makrut limes” or “Thai limes”. Thanks, I hadn’t known this. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/76 "2024-02-28T18:58:06Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The word itself is _extremely_ offensive in South Africa, on the level of the word “nigger” in the US (to my understanding). Oh yes. _Worse_ in some senses - _nobody_ is trying to take “kaffir” back and there is no dialect form of it. And it will get you jail-time. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/77 "2024-02-28T19:02:08Z")
I apologize to those I offended in this thread, and to puzzlegal for causing her the need to moderate in response to my posts. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2024, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/78 "2024-02-28T19:28:17Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Oh yes. _Worse_ in some senses - _nobody_ is trying to take “kaffir” back and there is no dialect form of it. I had no idea that the word existed until I saw Trevor Noah’s riff on that word versus the N-word, and how in America, he gets assaulted in the dairy aisle. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2024, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/79 "2024-02-29T12:51:04Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > Others are unhappy with Barbarian because it was used as an insult to “other” those outside the dominant group. Even today, sometimes we refer to behavior as barbaric or even a group as barbarians. Even if the word doesn’t apply to a specific demographic today, it makes some people uncomfortable using the word. You know how I know that “barbarian” isn’t offensive nowadays? Because only white people are called barbarians. Non-white people are called “savages” - which _is_ offensive. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [February 29, 2024, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160/80 "2024-02-29T13:01:23Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@pulykamell](#): > > > > The word itself is _extremely_ offensive in South Africa, on the level of the word “nigger” in the US (to my understanding). > > Oh yes. _Worse_ in some senses - _nobody_ is trying to take “kaffir” back and there is no dialect form of it. > > And it will get you jail-time. Oh wow, i had no idea. I think i have only ever heard it applied to limes, in the context of recipes. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-original-mary-poppins-has-had-its-uk-rating-raised-over-discriminatory-language/998160.md?page=5)