# The Pentagon is tracking a Chinese spy balloon **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 3, 2023, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228 "2023-02-03T01:32:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/241 "2023-02-05T07:06:33Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Yes, it was a much better place to stop an intrusion into US airspace. Except that the DoD is saying they used the opportunity to gain valuable information about China’s capabilities while making sure the balloon didn’t actually relay anything useful. So, if accurate, it was better to let it drift until it was in a good place to retrieve the payload on the eastern shore than to have shot it down over the Pacific. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/242 "2023-02-05T07:10:10Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > You contradict yourself. I contradicted your notion of a time machine. My original post about shooting it down before it traveled across the US is backed up by Biden wanting it shot down on Wednesday. You assume Bden was aware of it on Saturday. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/243 "2023-02-05T07:11:48Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > My original post about shooting it down before it traveled across the US is backed up by Biden wanting it shot down on Wednesday. You assume Bden was aware of it on Saturday. I’ve provided the timeline. Saturday: Balloon is over Aleutians Tuesday: Ballon reenters over Idaho; Biden is informed and orders it shot down Biden can’t possibly have ordered it shot down before he knew about it, and by the time he did it was no longer over the Aleutians. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/244 "2023-02-05T07:12:29Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Except that the DoD is saying they used the opportunity to gain valuable information about China’s capabilities while making sure the balloon didn’t actually relay anything useful. That had that ability while it was in the Pacific Ocean. Your premise that it was inconvenient for the Military to retrieve it before invading US airspace does not make sense in the context of what the Military is for. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/245 "2023-02-05T07:14:11Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > That had that ability while it was in the Pacific Ocean They had the ability to observe and get intelligence from it drifting over the US while it was over the Pacific? > [@Magiver](#): > > does not make sense in the context of what the Military is for. Intelligence gathering is part of what our military does. The Pentagon says that they gained valuable intelligence by observing its flight to the east coast. Sounds working as intended. _"I would also note that while we took all necessary steps to protect against the PRC surveillance balloon’s collection of sensitive information, the surveillance balloon’s overflight of U.S. territory was of intelligence value to us,” the official said. "I can’t go into more detail, but we were able to study and scrutinize the balloon and its equipment, which has been valuable._ ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/246 "2023-02-05T07:14:53Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Your premise that it was inconvenient for the Military to retrieve it before invading US airspace Where is it easier to retrieve a downed balloon? A) In shallow water off the coast of the Carolinas where the seas are calm and the temperatures are moderate B) The Bering Sea, which is thousands of feet deep, it is the middle of winter and seas are high and dangerous, it is currently snowing with gale force winds, and the Russian border is only a few miles away Show your work. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/247 "2023-02-05T07:19:35Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > So you’re saying Biden made the right call, and therefore that Trump made the wrong call by not shooting down the three previous balloon incursions? > > I didn’t expect that from you. Again, YOUR the one who dragged Biden and Trump into the conversation. My original statement didn’t involve Biden. You don’t know when Biden was made aware and there is no information beyond a sound bite regarding Trump. So maybe, just maybe you can grasp the idea that if Biden wanted it it shot down on Wednesday then he would have wanted it shot down on Saturday when it would make sense and that he wasn’t made aware of it. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/248 "2023-02-05T07:20:56Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > You don’t know when Biden was made aware As per the NYT article I already linked upthread; > [@](#): > > Tuesday, Jan. 31 > > The balloon re-enters the United States over Idaho, to the surprise of officials at Northern Command as well as at the Pentagon. > > Gen. Mark A. Milley, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, alerts President Biden ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/249 "2023-02-05T07:24:18Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Where is it easier to retrieve a downed balloon? The military doesn’t base defending airspace on how easy it is. You keep repeating this and it has no meaning. It’s EASIER to defend our airspace before it happens rather than allowing an intrusion to travel thousands of miles through it. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/250 "2023-02-05T07:25:43Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The military doesn’t base defending airspace on how easy it is Is “defending airspace” the ONLY goal of our military? Is there no value in gathering intelligence, especially when the “intrusion” in question presents absolutely no threat? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/251 "2023-02-05T07:26:45Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Is “defending airspace” the ONLY goal of our military? Is there no value in gathering intelligence, especially when the “intrusion” in question presents absolutely no threat? they were able to observe it for thousands of miles in the Pacific. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/252 "2023-02-05T07:27:10Z")
An assessment was obviously made that the balloon posed no threat to US airspace. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/253 "2023-02-05T07:27:20Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > they were able to observe it for thousands of miles in the Pacific. Ahem. > [@Jophiel](#): > > They had the ability to observe and get intelligence from it drifting over the US while it was over the Pacific? ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/254 "2023-02-05T07:31:02Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > There’s a pilot, who after admiring the freshly painted balloon on his plane, is heading off to the o-club where he’s gonna get rather drunk while not spending a cent. I wonder if s/he will have earned themselves a new callsign (and whether it might be slightly disparaging). ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/255 "2023-02-05T07:32:58Z")
What I want to know, as a Canadian, is why were we not told about this? The first I heard about it was from CNN. The balloon overflew Canadian airspace, and we heard nothing from our own government, though they knew about it: > **[Defence minister says Canada supports U.S. downing of Chinese balloon](https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/defence-minister-says-canada-supports-u-s-downing-of-chinese-balloon-1.6260328)** > > The federal defence Minister says Canada 'unequivocally supports' the United States government's decision to shoot down a high-altitude surveillance balloon that was suspected of spying for China, noting the balloon violated Canadian airspace. > [@](#): > > She [Canadian defence minister Anita Anand] said Canada has been closely engaged with its American counterparts on the decision and went on to thank the U.S. for its close collaboration. > > . . . > > On Friday, Anand’s office declined to comment on whether the balloon flew over Canadian airspace, **but her Saturday statement says it "violated U.S. and Canadian airspace** and international law." Emphasis added by me. We Canadians heard nothing about it until it hit US airspace over Montana. And then, it had already traversed Canadian airspace, over British Columbia and Alberta and possibly Saskatchewan. But our government was silent, and so our media was silent, and the only news we got about it came from American sources, such as CNN. And now, … no, I will withhold further comments. I’m rather pissed about this, and could say more as you might guess, but for now I’ll drop this, lest I run afoul of the SDMB’s rules. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/256 "2023-02-05T07:37:40Z")
Maybe because it wasn’t that big a deal? A balloon. Relaying data back to China in a way not dissimilar to data being collected and relayed by satellites right now. I aver that it was shot down in order to play well in Peoria as opposed to out of any real necessity. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 7:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/257 "2023-02-05T07:58:58Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > I aver that it was shot down in order to play well in Peoria as opposed to out of any real necessity. Well, showing that we can take out the balloon with one shot is good. Proving that the Chinese were lying is diplomatically useful. Looking at the tech is good. And sending the message that any more balloons “accidentally” sent over will be shot down will be useful also. Maybe we can send some balloons across China just to twit them. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/258 "2023-02-05T08:47:29Z")
Quite interesting that China found the engineering sweet spot. Too high to reach with gunfire. Too small a radar/IR signature to shoot down with a missile. Slow enough to troll and provoke for a week. ---
**Author:** ![eburacum45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eburacum45/32/8690_2.png) [@eburacum45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eburacum45)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/259 "2023-02-05T11:21:30Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > A weather balloon would fit in a small closet. This was said to be 3 school buses in size which would be 135 feet or the the size of a house. That would make the payload substantially larger than a weather balloon… Weather balloons are about 6 metres in diameter. Research balloons can be much larger and go higher. [![](https://threedollarkit.weebly.com/uploads/1/3/7/7/137771521/balloon-comparison_orig.jpg) ](https://threedollarkit.weebly.com/uploads/1/3/7/7/137771521/balloon-comparison_orig.jpg) Of course the actual nature of the research carried out by these Chinese balloons is unknown. Most commentators suspect they are actively researching Western capabilities, which I suppose is quite reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2023, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228/260 "2023-02-05T11:36:02Z")
I’ve read through some of the back and forth above, and am aware that some reactionary politicians were demanding that the balloon be shot down, which it most responsibly was. But are there politicians now complaining that it wasn’t shot down impatiently enough? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-pentagon-is-tracking-a-chinese-spy-balloon/979228.md?page=14)