# The perverse motivation of back-in parkers? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 4, 2015, 10:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793 "2015-04-04T10:52:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/41 "2015-04-04T14:58:05Z")
> [@Alley\_Dweller](#): > > If you’ve ever tried to back out onto a street when two monster SUVs have parked on either side of you, you would appreciate it. You have a fighting chance of seeing whether the road is clear to pull out into. > > If you think waiting for someone to back into a parking space takes time, what about the dance you do when you pull out and can’t see the road? You slowly back up inch by inch hoping nobody slams into you and if you’re lucky enough to have traffic stop for you while you back out, the first guy waiting gets tired of the inch-by-inch bit and then decides to just pass you and you slam on the brakes and wait again hoping the traffic is clear and pull out inch-by-inch. this. I used to have a small-ish car, and lost track of how many times I parked in an open space with little around me, only to come back out and find a Toyota Landmass and Mercury Mountain on either side of me. which means I’d basically have to back out of the spot at a rate of 0.01in./hr just to be safe, yet cross traffic would still honk or zip past angrily as though I was supposed to be able to see them. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/42 "2015-04-04T15:21:34Z")
There are many instances where it is mandatory to back into a parking space in order to safely exit. For example, many construction sites make this mandatory. For me, it’s just habit at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/43 "2015-04-04T15:32:24Z")
If only all parking was so enlightened. Some cities have begun restriping diagonal parking on streets so that backing in is possible or mandatory – progress. There are a lot of private parking facilities that mandate head-in parking. The only reason is that they are run by morons and morons love imposing their strongly held wrong beliefs on others. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/44 "2015-04-04T15:35:45Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > If only all parking was so enlightened. Some cities have begun restriping diagonal parking on streets so that backing in is possible or mandatory – progress. > > **There are a lot of private parking facilities that mandate head-in parking.** The only reason is that they are run by morons and morons love imposing their strongly held wrong beliefs on others. There are cases where reading license plates is required. Not all vehicles have front plates. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/45 "2015-04-04T15:41:57Z")
> [@kaltkalt](#): > > That’s crap. So far, all I’ve seen from your replies is essentially, “nuh-uh!” But this is GQ and no one has given cites to back up\* their (correct) position that back-in parking is safer. So here you go: - [You’re Parking Wrong: Why it’s almost always better to back into a space than pull into it head-on.](http://www.slate.com/articles/life/transport/2011/02/youre_parking_wrong.html) - [The ins and outs of back-in angled parking.](http://sacramentopress.com/2012/02/27/the-ins-and-outs-of-back-in-angled-parking/) - [What’s up with the back-in parking spaces in courthouse?](http://www.arlnow.com/2011/01/12/whats-up-with-the-back-in-parking-spaces-in-courthouse/) - [Reverse parking into a parking stall can be mastered by using reference points.](http://drivingtips.org/reverseparking.html) - [Reverse logic – back-in parking really is safer choice.](http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2006-12-14/news/CLICK14_1_diesel-parking-space-willie-nelson) I’ll be blunt, here: Back-in parking is supported by driving/auto experts, research and studies, and other authorities. Dissenters tend to be Joe Randoms who can’t wrap their heads around this (admittedly counter-intuitive) fact and simply argue that it doesn’t make sense to them, therefore it’s obviously wrong. - HAWHAW! I kill me! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/46 "2015-04-04T15:45:13Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > No one cares what you do in your own home, where the points about traffic flow and the safety of pedestrians don’t apply (I’m picturing a garage facing a back driveway a la the suburbs – if you’re in a city and pulling across a pedestrian sidewalk to get in to a garage then you better back in for all the same reasons). The point about the garage was that geometry/visibility factors make nose-in the logical option. As I said, the exhaust is another factor, and probably for that reason I’ve never seen anyone around here ever back into a garage. But this doesn’t detract from your other arguments about other circumstances, which I agree with. Not sure that I get the pedestrian sidewalk argument. You’re going to be backing across that sidewalk either coming or going. You have to be appropriately cautious either way. Personally I’m in the habit, when backing, of coming to a complete full stop at the sidewalk and looking both ways. Sounds unremarkable but so many people just do a superficial check while they’re moving. I’ve never had an accident in many decades of driving, but the older you get, the more aware you are that it’s always the totally unexpected that gets you. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/47 "2015-04-04T15:45:28Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > There are cases where reading license plates is required. Not all vehicles have front plates. Front-in parking zealotry long predates police auto-scanners. It isn’t the reason. If the parking facility is making people less safe because their only way of tracking who is parking is to read front plates, then they should either mandate front plates as condition of using the structure, or get a better system. ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/48 "2015-04-04T15:50:47Z")
**Moderator Action** While the OP may have intended this as a factual question, it certainly isn’t phrased as one. Moving thread from General Questions to The BBQ Pit. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/49 "2015-04-04T15:51:54Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Not sure that I get the pedestrian sidewalk argument Backing in across the sidewalk – you approach driving down the street parallel to the sidewalk. You can see who is using the sidewalk in both directions, because you’ve drived past one and are looking down the other. You carefully execute a one-point turn into the garage, using all of your side windows and mirrors to continue to monitor the sidewalk for unexpected pedestrians etc. Anyone speeding down the sidewalk, e.g. a bicyclist or skateboarder, not only has a much greater chance of being seen by you, but also will see you themselves since you are coming from an expected source of traffic, the street. Other cars in the street are a total nonissue since they can clearly see your signals and movement. Backing out across the sidewalk – you are coming from inside your garage where you can’t see anything except that which is directly across from the door. At best, you can walk outside and scan the sidewalk and street, then go back and get in the car and hope nothing has changed in the 5 to 30 seconds before you actually cross the sidewalk. You have to back out into traffic across the sidewalk and possibly between parked cars on either side of your garage entry. Sidewalk users have no reason to expect that a car will come from the non-street direction across the sidewalk. Other cars in the street also don’t see you until it’s too late. You are moving perpendicular to traffic for at least part of your time in the driving lane, especially if you have to thread between parked cars before turning. It’s basically the same issue as the parking space, but worse. Head-in parking is a “just don’t do it, ever” in all circumstances except the suburban garage where you can almost guarantee that there will be nothing coming outside of the garage (and if your neighbors’ kids or dogs don’t know to respect property lines yet, you should keep that in mind and consider backing in even in this situation). Personally, I also find it virtuous to not put off until later what I can do now – why not get the driving-in-reverse stuff out of the way ahead of time so you can depart with ease? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/50 "2015-04-04T15:52:35Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Not sure that I get the pedestrian sidewalk argument. You’re going to be backing across that sidewalk either coming or going. When you back in, you can see the current traffic condition and control for it. When backing out, you don’t always have full view of all possible conflicts. Plus being partly turned around to look does not give you as clear a view as looking straight out. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/51 "2015-04-04T15:53:25Z")
I sometimes go in forwards, and i sometimes back in. In generally depends on the level of traffic in the carpark, and on the location and geometry of my car and the parking spot. If both methods seem equally easy, and i can back in without getting in anyone’s way, then i’ll generally back in. > [@kaltkalt](#): > > There’s no way the most skilled driver in the world can back in faster than someone can park straight in. It takes one whole extra move. Maybe it won’t take them 30 seconds, but it takes longer no question about it. Not opinion. Even this part of your claim is not always true. The other day, i was in a parking lot looking for a space, and just as i passed a parked car i saw its reverse lights come on in my rear-view mirror. It pulled out, and after it left, all i had to do was go into reveres and swing backwards into the space. Also, in parking lots with narrow aisles, it can often be difficult, if the spot is on the right-hand side of the aisle, to go in head-first without swinging all the way across to the left, or backing up when you’re halfway into the spot. If you have to make an extra move anyway due to the confined space, it can be just as quick to make that move first, and then back in. I would estimate that backing into a spot probably takes me, on average, maybe an extra five seconds. That five seconds is generally more than compensated for by the fact that i can leave the parking spot without painstakingly inching out blind to make sure that i don’t get hit. The problem isn’t backing in. The problem is that too many people are fucking terrible parkers, whether they’re going forwards or backwards. I live in the city, and in my neighborhood most of the parking is street parking, parallel to the curb. But i also live in Southern California, where most of the population is in the suburbs, and where most people park in parking lots. Watching some people from the 'burbs trying to parallel park in my neighborhood can, at times, be an awesome spectator sport. Weekends, when folks come into town to go to restaurants and bars, are probably the best. I’ve stood on my balcony and watched a car take about ten minutes and seven tries to reverse into a massive parallel spot. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/52 "2015-04-04T16:02:12Z")
In fact, given that 99% of vehicles on the road turn by turning the front wheels only, it’s inarguably more “efficient” to perform turns in reverse in every case. The real-world confounding factor is that shitty drivers have insufficient experience and skill at at driving reverse – but that’s why I want those shitty drivers to _pull forward out of the space_ rather than do a terrible job at reversing into traffic. Back-in, 100% of the time, for good drivers and bad. It’s just better. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/53 "2015-04-04T16:20:44Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > … Backing out across the sidewalk – you are coming from inside your garage where you can’t see anything except that which is directly across from the door. OK, I get the point that you and **running coach** are making. But the above comment seems to assume that my garage practically opens out onto the sidewalk or road. It doesn’t – there’s quite a long driveway, and there is clear visibility on both sides as one approaches the sidewalk and the street, and this is by design. I’m sure it’s even a municipal requirement. So I can see clearly a fair way up and down the sidewalk even when I’m backing. It just underscores the fact that every situation is different and while generalities may be statistically true, one needs to look at the specifics of each situation. If I was constantly backing into my garage I’m sure I would have dinged something by now – and it’s not because I’m not a skilled driver, I’ve been driving accident-free since probably before some of these statistics-gatherers were born, it’s because when you’re backing certain types of vehicles **you can’t freaking see** – specifically, there are lots of low-level blind spots! In fact I think I heard somewhere that some or all vehicles will soon have to be equipped with back-facing TV cameras for just that reason. ---
**Author:** ![Haberdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Haberdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Haberdash)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/54 "2015-04-04T16:25:23Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > because when you’re backing certain types of vehicles **you can’t freaking see** Why do you think it’s acceptable to reverse into the street where you “can’t freaking see” children, dogs, bicycles, other cars, and more, then? This is the whole point. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/55 "2015-04-04T16:27:01Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > **backing in makes it HARDER for thieves to access the trunk.** Since it’s a **zero sum gain** then it doesn’t matter whether it takes longer to enter or longer to exit the the spot. **This** observation is why I’m confused by the assertion that it makes cargo unloading easier. Although I rarely find myself in a position where I might think I’d benefit from the ability to leave my parking spot without any backing up, it occurs to me that if I _would_, AND I have the time to devote to backing in RIGHT NOW, the time I could save by launching my vehicle forward could be worth the effort. And it’s **“zero sum GAME,”** JFTR. ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/56 "2015-04-04T16:32:36Z")
[QUOTE=kaltkalt;18263305Any comparison to parallel parking is comparing rotten apples to fresh oranges. Completely 100% irrelevant. Yes, you back in when you parallel park. Because the front wheels turn and the rear wheels do not - you even pointed out the reason it’s irrelevant.[/QUOTE] You are an incredibly stupid, ignorant person. You even state the reason why we back up when we parallel park, and yet you deny the logic of it. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/57 "2015-04-04T16:34:19Z")
> [@kaltkalt](#): > > I just don’t get it. Who are these people and what motivates them to act in such a jackass way? > > In my apartment’s parking garage, over 90% of people pull in to their parking spots front first, like the quick, easy, normal, rational way to do it. But around 10% of people feel the urge to stop in the middle of the parking garage, hold up everyone driving behind them, as they try to back in to their parking spot. So the front of their car faces outwards. It takes 20-30 seconds longer, as everyone behind them is held up… waiting for them to sloooowly back in. There are no advantages to parking in reverse. You don’t get out faster or easier (and if you think you do, then you shouldn’t be driving in the first place). Even if you did get out faster, who would trade 20-30 seconds of slowing yourself down while simultaneously being rude to other people for saving a few seconds at some unspecified time in the future? > > I do not get it. Even if nobody were driving behind me, I wouldn’t feel the ridiculous urge to park my car in its spot rear-end first. If doing so meant I’d be inconveniencing one or more other people (holding them up behind me as I back in) I wouldn’t do it even if there were a tangible advantage. Most people just pull in to their spot as quickly as possible if someone is behind them. > > So who are these back-in parkers? About 1 in 10 people are such ridiculous assholes they slow themselves down just to screw with and annoy other people. > > The only theory I have is that this is some sort of animalistic dominance display. I.e. “You will stay there and wait for ME to park before you drive past ME to your own spot. You will not go past ME until I slowly back MY car into MY spot and park it in a regal, kingly manner, facing outward so I can watch you be inconvenienced from my actions.” Dominance plus narcissism. > > So, screwing with other people and giving yourself a good view of it. That’s the only explanation I can come up with. Am I right? The only other possible theory I can come up with is that there’s some urban legend upon which these people are relying. Like they heard somewhere that backing in to your parking spot will save you 30% on gas. Or your car can’t/won’t be stolen if it’s parked backwards. Something ridiculous like that. Well, you took the long way around to get there, but I guess I don’t blame you for not wanting to start a Pit thread entitled “I am stupid and an asshole”. Good luck with that. ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/58 "2015-04-04T16:36:50Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > **This** observation is why I’m confused by the assertion that it makes cargo unloading easier. Because it depends on the situation. In a parking lot, backing in will typically put the trunk very close to a vehicle or wall. In a cargo-unloading situation, backing in will simply put the trunk/bed closer to the garage/warehouse/whatever. A good driver will leave ample room for people to maneuver the cargo. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/59 "2015-04-04T17:28:59Z")
If there’s another driver that would be inconvenienced by my backing into a space, I’ll often pull in to the parking spot so as to get out of their way. You have to drive backwards one of the ways, either backing in, or backing out, right? It is safer to approach the parking space and see it is clear and then back into it, than it is when leaving the parking space, to back out of the space and into an unknown situation - the traffic (vehicles and pedestrian and small objects like dogs, kids on tricycles, etc.). No matter how carefully you look while backing out, you have a huge blind spot. Huge. For back-in parkers, that blind spot is mitigated by examining the space on approach before backing in. Overall, taking into account both parking and leaving the parking space, backing in is faster overall and safer overall. And you are able to maneuver your car better into a tight space by backing in - similar to the forklift, as another poster mentioned. People think it’s faster overall to pull in, but if done correctly they are wrong. But they still mistakenly think it’s faster overall. It takes less skill to be a pull-in parker than to be a back-in parker. Those are the reasons why more people pull in than back in. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793/60 "2015-04-04T17:32:22Z")
> [@Haberdash](#): > > Why do you think it’s acceptable to reverse into the street where you “can’t freaking see” children, dogs, bicycles, other cars, and more, then? This is the whole point. No, that is NOT the point. We’re talking about the sidewalk here. And unless you live in a mansion with a vast circular driveway, you’re going to be backing across the sidewalk in one direction or the other. And as I just finished explaining, it makes little difference which direction I choose because I can see the sidewalk either way. In fact backing up from the driveway side in my case is safer because the car on the driveway is lined up perpendicular to the sidewalk and I can see clearly in both directions; if backing up from the street, it might still be at an angle when approaching the sidewalk. And don’t half-quote what I said about seeing when backing up. I said there are low-level blind spots, meaning that when backing in you can’t see random crap that might be lying around in the garage, and it’s hard to gauge clearances to the garage doorway or random crap hanging from the walls. I clearly said that when backing up to the sidewalk I have a clear line of sight up and down the sidewalk. Look, I’m basically agreeing with you except for the garage situation. I’ve never, ever seen anyone routinely backing into a garage, for obvious reasons. The fumes alone would probably get them to reconsider even if they did. But I agree with you about most of the other stuff. Why are you still arguing? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-perverse-motivation-of-back-in-parkers/716793.md?page=4)