# The poker world is engulfed with the Postle poker scandal **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [October 6, 2019, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338 "2019-10-06T01:38:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2019, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/81 "2019-10-09T22:03:59Z")
The casino that hosted these events already has its reputation destroyed-- To get it back, they need to bust both of the cheaters. Just busting Postle won’t do any good, because everyone will assume that the guy who was feeding him inside info will now just find someone else to feed inside info to. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2019, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/82 "2019-10-10T01:33:25Z")
Speculation is on a producer named Taylor Smith. > **[Two Plus Two Poker Forums - View Single Post - Mike Postle cheating...](https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showpost.php?p=55493932&postcount=6114)** > > Post 55493932 -Poker discussion forum with over 500,000 members and 100 different poker forums. Learn poker strategy & sharpen your poker skills for tournament poker, texas hold 'em, five card draw, omaha hi lo, seven card stud and more plus talk... “Exactly, only when Taylor is in the producer’s booth, Mike cheats. If Taylor is doing commentary or being the floorman or something else, Mike magically stops cheating.” There are a lot of coincidences mentioned in that discussion. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/83 "2019-10-11T02:34:21Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The casino that hosted these events already has its reputation destroyed-- To get it back, they need to bust both of the cheaters. Just busting Postle won’t do any good, because everyone will assume that the guy who was feeding him inside info will now just find someone else to feed inside info to. Yeah, that was my thought, too. He’s the guy with the value, he’ll find someone to sell it to, but it looks like that trail is being followed up. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/84 "2019-10-11T03:23:23Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > Yes, thanks **GrayGhost** , I now know more but at the same time I’ve been introduced to even more areas of ignorance. 'Twas ever thus. Because it is such an alien world to me I can’t intuitively get a feel for the ebb and flow like I can for other sports and pastimes. > > Also, yes I accept that the stats make the case for cheating pretty soundly. The null hypothesis can reasonably be rejected here. I guess my quibble was with the “caught” terminology. That implies a scooby-doo style ripping off of the overcoat to reveal the cheating mechanism beneath or a spy camera that catches a dodgy deal. That doesn’t seem to have happened in this case…yet…and that makes it all the more fascinating I guess. > [@DragonAsh](#): > > He’s been caught with evidence that is as strong - if not stronger - than DNA evidence. I think it’s unlikely he’ll ever see the inside of a prison cell, and I don’t know how other players would ever get any money back. > > But I think it’s quite likely the casino is going to be in for a world of hurt, and Postle and others involved or viewed as likely involved could face civil suits and such. It’s about as certain he cheated as you can ever be certain about anything. There’s arguably more uncertainty about Trump’s ‘no quid pro quo claim’ re: Ukraine than there is about Postle’s cheating. He cheated. We don’t know the mechanism just yet - and maybe never will given that the Casino has basically hired its own lawyer to ‘investigate’. State regulators would need to really get involved for actual info to come to light, so I’m not holding my breath. > > But he’s been caught cheating. That much is not in doubt. > > No card room or casino I’ve ever been in - literally _none_ - would let you sit at the table while involved in a hand, on your phone entering data. There’s no way you could do that on your phone, entering all the data required to find out your equity in a hand - cards, board, stack sizes, opponents - no way. And even if they _did_ let you sit there with a solver on your phone - it’d be essentially useless since you’d need to enter reasonably accurate hand ranges for your opponent(s) on the fly - and if you’re able to do that on the fly anyway, rough math in your head is going to be sufficiently accurate to guide you in any decision. I’d happily let someone sit there with a phone and a solver, because if that’s how he thinks he’s ‘gaining an advantage’ I know there’s no way he’s remotely accurate with his hand ranges and he’s probably only playing his two cards. > You can be on your phone when you are not involved in a hand - which is when people make notes about hands for review later and such. Could you ‘collude’ by telling another player still in the hand what cards you folded pre-flop etc? I suppose. Would that be a minor edge? Sure - but very very minor. > > Knowing \*all \*the cards - including cards that were folded preflop? That could be / would be very profitable. [This hand](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yK4aWk93ug4&feature=youtu.be&t=11205) is amazeballs. Nobody that’s ever played any amount of poker can watch this and not conclude with 100% certainty that he’s cheating. > > It’s a 5/5 game but appears to be a $50 straddle in this hand. > Cut-off calls with 96o (lolwut), Button calls with T8s (I might raise here), SB raises to $245 with AK, WSOP champ Moneymaker 3! to $705 also with AK. > UTG folds KQ. > Postle is UTG+1 with 54o. He _calls_ $660. SB ships for $2700, Moneymaker ships for $4100, and Postle - with 54o - calls off. > > The only reason he can call pre-flop is because he knows that nobody else behind him can call, and because he knows that 54o is a huge favorite against AK/AK when KQ has folded, his opponents share each others’ outs, so only three cards for his opponents and he has six outs. > > There’s simply no way any winning player ever does this. “Oh, he’s just a gambler” - if that was the case, there’s no way Postle would ever fold KK pre-flop…which he did [here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XJ0mSsjYIg&feature=youtu.be&t=8306), when it just so happened that his opponents had Aces. > He’d never fold to a small raise with AA, on a board with a crap-ton of straight and flush draws, when his opponent just happens to have a straight, like he did [here](https://youtu.be/Eg34YTF-meA?t=795). OK, that hand is just ridiculous. After watching that, all I can think is he’s laughing up his sleeve and showboating…other than drunks at the table, I’ve never seen anyone make a play like that. Is he banned from the tables at this point? And who on earth would play with him? ---
**Author:** ![Bootis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e8c25b/32.png) [@Bootis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootis)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2019, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/85 "2019-10-11T04:17:42Z")
> [@Patch](#): > > If he’s getting the RFID info, maybe he’s not seeing their cards, but is simply being told to bet or fold by a confederate who’s doing the analysis? He’s probably getting more than that- one particularly damning hand Doug Polk featured recently, was an Omaha hand, but the RFID system didn’t get reset to look for 4 cards, so only registered 2 cards for each player. Postale is visibly agitated throughout the hand, and can be seen numerous times after the flop diligently trying to get the rfid reader to register his 4 cards, no doubt trying to make it realize the game is Omaha and not holdem. He somehow knew only 2 cards were being read for each player. No player would have any reason to be so concerned with their cards being all registered properly after the flop unless they knew there was some sort of read error happening ---
**Author:** ![Ponderoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponderoid/32/19221_2.png) [@Ponderoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponderoid)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2019, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/86 "2019-10-12T15:57:41Z")
The casino and the cheater are being sued by a group of players for $10 million. > **[Mike Postle, Stones Parties Hit With $10M Lawsuit](https://www.pokernews.com/news/2019/10/mike-postle-stones-parties-hit-with-10m-lawsuit-35621.htm)** > > Postle, TD Justin Kuraitis and the Stones venue have all been singled out in the suit. Fair warning, my ad-blocker was working overtime on that site and it still didn’t manage to stop everything. That’s the most aggressive advertising I’ve seen on a site in years. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2019, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/87 "2019-10-12T18:16:28Z")
The thing is, he likely could have made a decent [if still totally dickish] living gambling by ignoring his electronic reads say 50% of the time or so. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2019, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/88 "2019-10-12T18:48:33Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > The thing is, he likely could have made a decent [if still totally dickish] living gambling by ignoring his electronic reads say 50% of the time or so. But the people he collaborated with may not have thought it was worth it for such compartively little payoff. They’d still be looking at the same time in jail/fines and for half the profit. I agree though and I assume that stuff like this goes on all the time in the ftf poker world but obviously not on all hands and at all rooms. ---
**Author:** ![DragonAsh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/db5fbb/32.png) [@DragonAsh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DragonAsh)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2019, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/89 "2019-10-12T22:14:44Z")
I’ve folded KK pre-flop only a few of times ever - like, less than 5 - and it’s always been player-specific - mainly players that I know 100% of the time have AA when they pull the ol’ ‘limp/re-raise shove’ move pre-flop, or an OMC type that waits for AA (like, will only limp/call with KK) then will shove his entire stack pre-flop into a pot of $3, then will slam down his Aces like he made this amazing move and cackle at ‘that’s how you win with AA’. He had the phone stuck between his legs, which is why he is actually staring at his crotch when he pretends to be looking at his cards. As was pointed out in the thread, the obvious alternative answer to ‘he was cheating’ is ‘he has a magic penis telling him what to do’. ---
**Author:** ![dba\_Fred](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c37758/32.png) [@dba\_Fred](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dba_Fred)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2019, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/90 "2019-10-13T15:16:55Z")
My magic penis has only two setting: all in or hold em’, depending on whom I’m playing with and the game. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2019, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/91 "2019-10-13T20:16:49Z")
> [@dba\_Fred](#): > > My magic penis has only two setting: all in or hold em’, depending on whom I’m playing with and the game. Mine keeps folding ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2019, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/92 "2019-10-13T20:46:58Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Mine keeps folding ☹ Erectile dysfunction is a very common problem, with over 3 million reported cases a year in the US alone. It is treatable with medical help. Talk with your physician about options and treatment. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2019, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/93 "2019-10-13T21:26:30Z")
Are you sure he’s talking about ED, and not penile origami? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2019, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/94 "2019-10-13T22:44:41Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Are you sure he’s talking about ED, and not penile origami? “It’s a crane!” ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2019, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/95 "2019-10-15T16:24:03Z")
> [@dba\_Fred](#): > > My magic penis has only two setting: all in or hold em’, depending on whom I’m playing with and the game. I’m always playing solitaire. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2019, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/96 "2019-10-15T17:17:01Z")
If your Royal Flush lasts for more than 4 hours, please contact a doctor. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/97 "2019-10-15T17:38:33Z")
If only this thread were about chess I could tell you about ‘mating positions’. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Tatterdemalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/43a26b/32.png) [@Tatterdemalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tatterdemalion)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2019, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/98 "2019-10-15T18:38:59Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I’m always playing solitaire. ☹ You mean Texas Hold’em? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2019, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/99 "2019-10-15T18:57:08Z")
Give it time and you might be playing Old Maid. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2019, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338/100 "2019-10-15T19:43:06Z")
> [@Tatterdemalion](#): > > You mean Texas Hold’em? Sure as hell isn’t Stud. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-poker-world-is-engulfed-with-the-postle-poker-scandal/841338.md?page=6)