# The problem the GOP has is not Trump, it's the Trump supporters. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 20, 2015, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683 "2015-07-20T11:18:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/21 "2015-07-20T14:11:05Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > Democrats did and still do precisely that, starting back with FDR and continuing with Kennedy and Johnson back in the 60s, and all the way to Obama today. If Nixon hadn’t used his Southern strategy, I doubt that the White supremacist racists would be solidly Republican today. So the Republican party as a whole will eventually have to make a decision. Do they want to continue to appeal to the racist elements in their party, or do they truly want a big tent? It may not happen in 2016, bit I think some time in the next 20 years or so, Republican candidates for president will have to explicitly repudiate that element of the party rather if they want to win a national election. FDR, Kennedy, and Johnson didn’t want southern votes? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/22 "2015-07-20T14:12:31Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > What did Carly Fiorina, Mike Huckabee, Bobby Jindal, Rand Paul, or Lindsey Graham have to say over the weekend? Or during the last week? > > The LSM (Lame Stream Media) has decided to focus their primary efforts (and your (aka the public’s) attention) on the words of Donald Trump. One of them is leading in the polls. The others are … not. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/23 "2015-07-20T14:14:56Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > They made their appeals on the downlow Meaning what? On channels you don’t watch? Somehow you know about them. > [@](#): > > because they knew their ads were racist. Repetition does not create truth. > [@](#): > > Saying that Ferguson happened because the police force is white is racist. The evidence does point to that conclusion. You have chosen to align yourself with a party that appeals to bigotry as a core belief. Either embrace it or reject it, but do not deny it. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/24 "2015-07-20T14:15:18Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > It’s a simple call to fight back on a race war that was declared on the black population. By who? And why not also involve white voters? Why try to keep those appeals low key, out of sight of white voters? Wouldn’t Democrats want to enlist the non-racist white voters, who presumably are the vast majority? Why do you think Democrats might not want white voters to be aware of those ads? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/25 "2015-07-20T14:16:32Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Why do you think Democrats might not want white voters to be aware of those ads? 1. How do \*you \*know about them? and 2. Do you understand what target marketing is? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/26 "2015-07-20T14:20:34Z")
Are you saying that if white voters had been widely exposed to such ads that it would have been fine? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/27 "2015-07-20T14:22:00Z")
Sure. A waste of money, though. Now you tell us why those ads were credible. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/28 "2015-07-20T14:26:11Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Meanwhile, Clinton is polling at [64% of the Latino vote](http://time.com/3960958/clinton-hispanic-univision-poll/). > > The GOP has made rabble-rousing, rather than responsible adult policymaking, its _core_ principle. This is the result. It is not good for the nation, not at all. As a friend of mine said when the Tea Party first showed up, “You can’t spend 30 years dry-humping the crazy and then act surprised when the crazy wants to fuck.” ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/29 "2015-07-20T14:27:26Z")
They weren’t. The GOP gained a few points among black voters between 2012 and 2014, and gained 10 among Latinos. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/30 "2015-07-20T14:30:01Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > By who? And why not also involve white voters? Why try to keep those appeals low key, out of sight of white voters? Wouldn’t Democrats want to enlist the non-racist white voters, who presumably are the vast majority? > > Why do you think Democrats might not want white voters to be aware of those ads? In case you hadn’t noticed, the GOP has been courting white racists since the Nixon Southern Strategy. By pressing voter ID laws, by reducing voting hours, by purging voter lists, by inequitable distribution of voting machines, the Republicans have instigated a race war. Nobody is trying to hide this from open-minded whites. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/31 "2015-07-20T14:31:03Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > FDR, Kennedy, and Johnson didn’t want southern votes? Yes, they wanted southern votes, but they were also willing to throw away those votes when it meant doing the right thing. Johnson himself famously said this when he said that Democrats would loose the South for a generation regarding his support for the Civil Rights Act of 1964. But he still supported it. Their was even a time when Republican presidents would do the right thing at the expense of votes. I could cite Eisenhower sending federal troops to Little Rock in 1957 to forcibly integrate their public schools. But now it seems Republican candidates are content to build on Nixon’s southern strategy, whether it be GHWB with the Willie Horton adds or Donald Trump today, they look for ways to appeal to the racist White vote. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/32 "2015-07-20T14:31:54Z")
WEll, like I said, if Democrats come out and say they don’t want the votes of people who support voter ID and voter purges, then this election won’t be very suspenseful. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/33 "2015-07-20T14:32:14Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > They weren’t. The GOP gained a few points among black voters between 2012 and 2014, and gained 10 among Latinos. Then what’s your complaint? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/34 "2015-07-20T14:34:33Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > Yes, they wanted southern votes, but they were also willing to throw away those votes when it meant doing the right thing. Johnson himself famously said this when he said that Democrats would loose the South for a generation regarding his support for the Civil Rights Act of 1964. But he still supported it. Their was even a time when Republican presidents would do the right thing at the expense of votes. I could cite Eisenhower sending federal troops to Little Rock in 1957 to forcibly integrate their public schools. But now it seems Republican candidates are content to build on Nixon’s southern strategy, whether it be GHWB with the Willie Horton adds or Donald Trump today, they look for ways to appeal to the racist White vote. That’s completely wrong, but I’ve had that argument too many times. So I’ll just point out that it’s not the same as telling racist voters that you don’t want their votes. It’s doing what I suggested, appealing to them on other issues. THat’s what FDR and Kennedy did, and it’s what Republicans have always done. Trump excepted, of course. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/35 "2015-07-20T14:46:10Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > That’s completely wrong, but I’ve had that argument too many times. Translation: “Yeah, I know, but I refuse to admit it to _you_.” ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Lowry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sam\_Lowry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Lowry)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/36 "2015-07-20T14:51:55Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > I’ve read the above theory advanced by several political commentators, although right now I don’t have a handy link. First, I don’t think Trump has a chance at the GOP nomination. His most recent attack against McCain, claiming that McCain is not a hero, appears to be the beginning of the end. I’m curious to see what the reaction is to Trumps comments about McCain. I believe all the candidates have denounced the comments, but poll numbers haven’t come in yet to see how the voters feel. Looking on Breitbart comments, opinion seems divided, but also there are plenty of non-conservative people commenting, and also trolls, so it’s hard to get a good read. If Trump can say those things about McCain and it doesn’t affect his popularity or poll numbers, I would think the other candidates definitely have cause to worry. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/37 "2015-07-20T14:53:28Z")
It’s a safe excuse to attack Trump, possibly forcing him out of the race and freeing his strong nativist support base, but without alienating them in the process - the rest of them would like to have those voters for themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/38 "2015-07-20T14:55:22Z")
Unfortunately for the GOP, they aren’t actually working for a sorcerer who knows how to make the brooms stop hauling water. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/39 "2015-07-20T14:56:43Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > That’s completely wrong, but I’ve had that argument too many times. So I’ll just point out that it’s not the same as telling racist voters that you don’t want their votes. It’s doing what I suggested, appealing to them on other issues. THat’s what FDR and Kennedy did, and it’s what Republicans have always done. Trump excepted, of course. It isn’t my argument. As I noted, it was Lyndon Johnson himself who realized what the results of his actions would be and predicted that the Democratic Party would no longer be relevant in the South. It’s taken some time, but with the losses of Mark Pryor and Mary Landrieu in the 2014 election, it looks like he was right, and the South is now solidly Republican. As for those “other issues”, Democrats do tend to support programs that help poor people, and it just so happens that a lot of the people who vote Republican due to racial prejudice are also poor. That doesn’t mean Democrats are trying to appeal to racist White people by some kind of back door, it means that they are trying to help poor people. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2015, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683/40 "2015-07-20T14:59:37Z")
I don’t think this will hurt T-Rump at all. Let’s face it, a significant part of the Republican base is racism and xenophobia. Trump has established serious bona fides with those voters due to his anti-Mexico ranting. Those voters don’t give two shits about McCain, they think he lost because he wasn’t conservative enough and if his image takes a pounding, well so what? What Republicans adore is cocksureness, the ability to be wrong at the top of your lungs. Trump has it in spades. I just can’t see the base deserting a True Believer for the sake of McCain. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-problem-the-gop-has-is-not-trump-its-the-trump-supporters/725683.md?page=3)