# The Rapture **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 3, 2008, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710 "2008-08-03T16:57:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/41 "2008-08-04T16:59:29Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] This was a new theory, as formulated by Darby (based partially on the visions of a schzophrenic teenage girl), and was really never really a part of any Christian doctrine before him. It is still not accepted by most Christian churches. It’s really sort of peculiar to American fundamentalists. [/QUOTE] Wasn’t it the [Scofield Reference Bible](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scofield_Reference_Bible) that made such ideas popular among Fundamentalists? Ah. On preview, I see that **Captain Amazing** has addressed this. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/42 "2008-08-04T17:29:26Z")
While the rapture idea may not be mainstream with theologians, and not part of the doctrine of any mainstream version of Christianity, in my experience, most rank-and-file Christians are not aware of this, and think the rapture is described in the Bible no questions asked. Which brings up one of my favorite bumper stickers: IN CASE OF RAPTURE _Can I have your car?_ ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/43 "2008-08-04T17:35:02Z")
[QUOTE=CurtC] While the rapture idea may not be mainstream with theologians, and not part of the doctrine of any mainstream version of Christianity, in my experience, most rank-and-file Christians are not aware of this, and think the rapture is described in the Bible no questions asked. [/QUOTE] How can something “not be part of the doctrine of any mainstream version of Christianity” and at the same time be believed by “most rank-and-file Christians”? If, in reality, “most” Christians believe it, the idea is mainstream. ---
**Author:** ![hotflungwok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/edb3f5/32.png) [@hotflungwok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hotflungwok)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/44 "2008-08-04T17:44:01Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] How can something “not be part of the doctrine of any mainstream version of Christianity” and at the same time be believed by “most rank-and-file Christians”? If, in reality, “most” Christians believe it, the idea is mainstream. [/QUOTE] What percentage of Christians think that St Peter will meet them at the pearly gates to discuss thier permanent living arrangements? That’s not exactly official doctrine but I’m guessing that’s going to be a fairly high percentage. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/45 "2008-08-04T17:46:31Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] How can something “not be part of the doctrine of any mainstream version of Christianity” and at the same time be believed by “most rank-and-file Christians”? If, in reality, “most” Christians believe it, the idea is mainstream. [/QUOTE] It’s not part of of the official doctrine of most mainstream denominations. A lot of rank and file Christians have little education about their own official doctrines, though. This kind of conflict between populist conceptions and official doctrines is not unique to Christianity. You might call it a kind of populist, doctrinal “drift.” ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/46 "2008-08-04T17:49:17Z")
[QUOTE=CurtC] Which brings up one of my favorite bumper stickers: IN CASE OF RAPTURE _Can I have your car?_ [/QUOTE] I always thought that was a response to the bumper sticker that said, “In case of rapture, this car will be driverless.” ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/47 "2008-08-04T18:03:54Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] It’s not part of of the official doctrine of most mainstream denominations. A lot of rank and file Christians have little education about their own official doctrines, though. This kind of conflict between populist conceptions and official doctrines is not unique to Christianity. You might call it a kind of populist, doctrinal “drift.” [/QUOTE] It might not be part of the official doctrine of most mainstream denominations (although most mainstream denominations don’t rule it out…the SBC for instance just says: > [@](#): > > God, in His own time and in His own way, will bring the world to its appropriate end. According to His promise, Jesus Christ will return personally and visibly in glory to the earth; the dead will be raised; and Christ will judge all men in righteousness. The unrighteous will be consigned to Hell, the place of everlasting punishment. The righteous in their resurrected and glorified bodies will receive their reward and will dwell forever in Heaven with the Lord. without going into detail about how that will occur). But it’s still a mainstream belief within Christianity. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/48 "2008-08-04T18:11:36Z")
If we really want to advance the cause of secularism, we should insist on Bible study. The number of agnostics graduating from high school will skyrocket. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/49 "2008-08-04T18:25:15Z")
[QUOTE=Captain Amazing] It might not be part of the official doctrine of most mainstream denominations (although most mainstream denominations don’t rule it out…the SBC for instance just says: without going into detail about how that will occur). But it’s still a mainstream belief within Christianity. [/QUOTE] That statement is about the second Coming, not a preliminary “Rapture,” which most mainstream denominations do explicitly reject as un-Biblical. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/50 "2008-08-04T18:29:43Z")
[QUOTE=SuntanTigerTamer] 1. What is the scriptural basis for the Rapture [/QUOTE] Specifically, where in the Bible does it say anything about men from Mars eating cars and guitars? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/51 "2008-08-04T18:47:16Z")
[QUOTE=smiling bandit] I was told that by someone who did study (AFAIK) the original, in ancient Hebrew. I cannot confirm or deny it, having no ability to read _any_ version of Hebrew. [/QUOTE] I learned the harden their heart thing in Hebrew School, taught by people who did read Hebrew, and it is in the Haggadah, used for Pesach services, which I doubt would get it wrong. I’ve heard various justifications for this, including the need to make the break difficult enough so that the Israelites would really appreciate their freedom. This is the first time God appeared to a lot of people at once, and he seemed very into convincing them - see Mose, the rock, and the water. He might have wanted a good excuse to punish the Egyptians, who were still enemies when the Bible was written. Though the Passover service includes bitter herbs to show that we shouldn’t gloat over the misfortunes of the Egyptians, the killing of the first born and lots of the plagues wouldn’t have happened if the heart hardening didn’t get done. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2008, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/52 "2008-08-04T22:33:18Z")
[QUOTE=SuntanTigerTamer] Wow, I had never heard any of this before. My family (father, uncles) are all very firm believers in the Rapture, and I always wondered where they got this from. They were, of course, unable to suitably answer my question (“just cuz” stopped cutting it when i was about twelve years old). Thanks Dio. [/QUOTE] Kid, here’s some quick advice: **don’t tell your family about this!** People don’t love the Facts…they love “The Truth”…as long as it’s their “Truth”. Facts are cold, hard, & well…_real!_ “Truths” are warm & fuzzy. And nobody will thank you for mentioning Facts that contradict “Truth”. Get yer old Uncle **Bosda**? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/53 "2008-08-05T01:03:54Z")
[QUOTE=Voyager] I learned the harden their heart thing in Hebrew School, taught by people who did read Hebrew, and it is in the Haggadah, used for Pesach services, which I doubt would get it wrong. [/QUOTE] My WAG is that in the original it said “…then the Gods of the Pharoah hardened his heart…” but around the time it was set to writing the Bible became pretty nigh monotheistic, with only a few possible mentions of the old days still around. ---
**Author:** ![SuntanTigerTamer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e5b9ba/32.png) [@SuntanTigerTamer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuntanTigerTamer)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/54 "2008-08-05T02:58:43Z")
[QUOTE=Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor] Kid, here’s some quick advice: **don’t tell your family about this!** People don’t love the Facts…they love “The Truth”…as long as it’s their “Truth”. Facts are cold, hard, & well…_real!_ “Truths” are warm & fuzzy. And nobody will thank you for mentioning Facts that contradict “Truth”. Get yer old Uncle **Bosda**? [/QUOTE] I stopped fighting them long ago. Unless they start it… ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/55 "2008-08-05T14:02:40Z")
[QUOTE=SuntanTigerTamer] I stopped fighting them long ago. Unless they start it… [/QUOTE] Smart boy. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Lanzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/74df32/32.png) [@Lanzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lanzy)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/56 "2008-08-05T14:39:55Z")
If I were Satan, I would start sending things flying all over earth and take people out in the sticks captive. I would start a world wide conspiracy UFO movement and get a lot of folks believing that anyone could be ufonapped at any time. On the day of the rapture I would make sure thousands of witnesses saw them and blame the whole missing people thing on the space aliens. ---
**Author:** ![smurfslappa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5f9b8f/32.png) [@smurfslappa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smurfslappa)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2008, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/57 "2008-08-07T23:25:48Z")
There’s always the whole “I’m bitter that I wasn’t chosen…” path they can take. Or maybe the “I was a good person who wasn’t Christian, who fed the homeless and treated my family well. Why was I not taken? This is no God I would want to worship…” option. Just a guess. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2008, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/58 "2008-08-07T23:40:58Z")
Three words: Spontaneous Human Combustion. Sure it ain’t real, but convince the guy next to you of that. And if you can toss around a little fire in the environs, even better. Heck, maybe you can convince everyone that the missing elect were actually taken down to _hell_! ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2008, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/59 "2008-08-08T02:46:38Z")
[QUOTE=Lanzy] If I were Satan, I would start sending things flying all over earth and take people out in the sticks captive. [/QUOTE] You’re half right. See, Satan is going to convince the Space Aliens to give me a giant Space Ark and permission to scoop up as many Humans as I want to take along with me. While I’m doing that, God will rapture the believers. That way, everyone left will simply assume that I took a lot more people than I actually did, and that I concentrated on Christians. I figure it will take me 3.5 years to sort out the people I want. Along the way, I will blast the fuck out of nations that annoy me. _“Who is like the Beast, and who is able to wage war on him?”_ No one, bitches, because I’m the giant motherfucking Space Ark! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2008, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710/60 "2008-08-08T05:28:57Z")
I keep seeing pairs of sneakers wrapped around power lines so the rapture may already have happened. Maybe it was a typo but it appears that people wearing sneaks inherited the earth. I’m so going to hell for that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rapture/458710.md?page=4)