# The Rod of Authority **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 27, 2022, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530 "2022-01-27T21:15:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2022, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/1 "2022-01-27T21:15:19Z")
In medieval and renaissance portraits, important men are often depicted holding a plain rod as a symbol of their authority. Now I know that the rod as a symbol of legitimate authority goes back to Aaron in the bible, where it comes from a shepherds crook guiding the flock. And I know the Romans used a bundle of rods as a symbol of authority in that they represented the legal power to administer a beating as a punishment. But I wonder how this translated into later noblemen wielding them in portraits. Did the rod come automatically with certain noble ranks? Or was it something bestowed separately by a king to a nobleman? It seems like the power symbolized by the rod was an innate power of nobility, so why have it displayed as a discrete power? Was the rod a symbol of civil authority or military authority? And in the portraits I see displaying a rod, it seems like it’s displayed by someone who worked their way up from lower stations rather than a natural-born noble. Almost like it’s a status-conscious nouveau-noble conspicuously displaying his powers. What is the strait dope on Rods of Authority? ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2022, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/2 "2022-01-27T21:35:38Z")
I have no answers other than to point out that the US House of Representatives still uses a “ceremonial mace”: > **[Mace of the United States House of Representatives](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mace_of_the_United_States_House_of_Representatives)** > > Pages for logged out editors learn more > > > The Mace of the United States House of Representatives, also called the Mace of the Republic, is a ceremonial mace and one of the oldest symbols of the United States government. It symbolizes the governmental authority of the United States, and more specifically, the legislative authority of the House of Representatives. > In one of its first resolutions, the U.S. House of Representatives of the 1st Federal Congress (April 14, 1789) established t... It’s derived from the Roman bundle of rods (fasces) you mentioned. ---
**Author:** ![Francis\_Vaughan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/francis_vaughan/32/3093_2.png) [@Francis\_Vaughan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francis_Vaughan)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2022, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/3 "2022-01-27T23:39:26Z")
The paintings may not depict an actual extant rod. Paintings of that era were usually filled with symbols, every pose, location, and item in view will be placed to indicate the hierarchy of power in all its forms. So adding a rod of power is going to be a given when the subject desires. It is there so the viewer of the painting is under no illusions about the power wielded by the subject of the portrait, as desired by the subject. These portraits were commissioned for just this purpose. So you may read as much into the personalities and hangups of the subjects as you desire. It is quite fun to dissect the symbols present. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/4 "2022-01-28T00:06:58Z")
I don’t know anything about the history and symbolism of the rod as a sign of power, but I think that such a basic weapon always implied a brutal symbol of power and submission, maybe much better than a more modern weapon could. I seem to remember that the Egyptian pharaohs carried a simple club long after their soldiers had swords, that may be the same symbolism. And from where did the scepter derive, if not from a stick to wield power with? Or officers still carrying sabers long after firearms had been introduced? It seems like a pattern. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/5 "2022-01-28T00:11:02Z")
The idea that the rod as a symbol of power has a Biblical origin doesn’t feel right to me. Not being an Egyptologist I can’t say exactly when or what dynasty the sarophagi and images of pharoahs with rods are from, but I know I’ve seen them. This suggests a pre Biblical origin to me. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/6 "2022-01-28T05:25:27Z")
An argument could also perhaps be made that it’s a phallic symbol. ---
**Author:** ![UDS1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e47774/32.png) [@UDS1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS1)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/7 "2022-01-28T05:33:59Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > In medieval and renaissance portraits, important men are often depicted holding a plain rod as a symbol of their authority. Now I know that the rod as a symbol of legitimate authority goes back to Aaron in the bible, where it comes from a shepherds crook guiding the flock. And I know the Romans used a bundle of rods as a symbol of authority in that they represented the legal power to administer a beating as a punishment. But I wonder how this translated into later noblemen wielding them in portraits. Did the rod come automatically with certain noble ranks? Or was it something bestowed separately by a king to a nobleman? It seems like the power symbolized by the rod was an innate power of nobility, so why have it displayed as a discrete power? Was the rod a symbol of civil authority or military authority? And in the portraits I see displaying a rod, it seems like it’s displayed by someone who worked their way up from lower stations rather than a natural-born noble. Almost like it’s a status-conscious nouveau-noble conspicuously displaying his powers. Actual rods may occasionally be symbolically conferred on people to symbolise investment with authority - e.g. a monarch might be handed a sceptre as part of a coronation/investment ceremony. But ninety-nine times out of a hundred it’s just an iconographic convention - the guy in the painting is given a rod so that we know he’s a guy with authority. He may not have an actual rod any more than St. Peter has actual keys or any saint has an actual halo of light around his head. I agree with others that the idea of the rod as a symbol of authority probably does not originate in the Jewish scriptures; it turns up in other cultures also. The use of a stick either to guide (like a shepherd) or to simply to hit (like lots of people) is a pretty basic skill which I would imagine dates from prehistory, and its associated symbolic significance will be equally old. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/8 "2022-01-28T06:51:06Z")
The symbol of the crook and flail (the flail symbolising providing grain) goes back to the Egyptian pharaohs. [![](https://i.ibb.co/4Mr5KDV/Ancient-Egyptian-Crook-and-Flail-281-29.jpg) ](https://i.ibb.co/4Mr5KDV/Ancient-Egyptian-Crook-and-Flail-281-29.jpg) Babylonian kings had a sceptre. [![](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b4/Codice_di_hammurabi_03.JPG/360px-Codice_di_hammurabi_03.JPG) ](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b4/Codice_di_hammurabi_03.JPG/360px-Codice_di_hammurabi_03.JPG) The sceptre as a symbol of royalty is standard throughout European history. Usually an orb and sceptre for European royalty. [![](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/Elizabeth_I_in_coronation_robes.jpg/357px-Elizabeth_I_in_coronation_robes.jpg) ](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/eb/Elizabeth_I_in_coronation_robes.jpg/357px-Elizabeth_I_in_coronation_robes.jpg) Crosiers (crooks) as a symbol of bishops go back the beginnings of Christianity. [![](https://i.ibb.co/tXvgRpM/bishop.jpg) ](https://i.ibb.co/tXvgRpM/bishop.jpg) Not to be confused with a military swagger stick, as a symbol of an officer, though it’s also a symbol of authority. [![](https://i.ibb.co/VqZzk6v/post-599-1208967663.jpg) ](https://i.ibb.co/VqZzk6v/post-599-1208967663.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/9 "2022-01-28T07:42:20Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > I have no answers other than to point out that the US House of Representatives still uses a “ceremonial mace”: No doubt the idea was a copycat of the mace of the House of Commons. There’s quite a few ceremonial maces in Britain: > **[Ceremonial maces in the United Kingdom](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceremonial_maces_in_the_United_Kingdom)** > > Ceremonial maces in the United Kingdom began as lethal weapons of medieval knights in England, Scotland, and Wales, evolving into ceremonial objects carried by sergeants-at-arms. > In the United Kingdom, they now represent the monarch's authority in parliaments and councils, and royal maces are borne in procession at the State Opening of Parliament and British coronations. > Some British universities also have their own maces for ceremonial purposes. > In the late 17th century, there were 16 royal m... ---
**Author:** ![APB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@APB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/APB)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/10 "2022-01-28T11:58:24Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > Did the rod come automatically with certain noble ranks? Or was it something bestowed separately by a king to a nobleman? It seems like the power symbolized by the rod was an innate power of nobility, so why have it displayed as a discrete power? Was the rod a symbol of civil authority or military authority? And in the portraits I see displaying a rod, it seems like it’s displayed by someone who worked their way up from lower stations rather than a natural-born noble. Almost like it’s a status-conscious nouveau-noble conspicuously displaying his powers. Rods/sceptres/staffs/batons have been such a common symbol of status and office in so many different countries over so many centuries that any generalisations are impossible. So, just in Britain, the monarch has a sceptre, the Prince of Wales is invested with [a rod](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-42340770), there was a time when dukes were also invested with rods, the Lord Mayor of London has [a sceptre](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crystal_Sceptre), some senior members of the Royal Household carry white staffs, the Earl Marshal has [a baton](https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Player%27s_cigarettes_Earl_Marshal.jpeg), Black Rod has an actual [black rod](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Rod)… Then there were [military batons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baton_(military)), which were sometimes actual objects but which were also often used in portraits just as generic symbols of military authority. Sticks to be presented and to be displayed were such a simple way of creating meaning that they never did have a single significance. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/11 "2022-01-28T12:27:27Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > I don’t know anything about the history and symbolism of the rod as a sign of power, but I think that such a basic weapon always implied a brutal symbol of power and submission, maybe much better than a more modern weapon could. Hell yeah, take a look at this brutal dictator and their rod of power ![A portrait of Queen Elizabeth II at her Coronation wearing the Imperial State Crown and holding the Sceptre, both of which are set with diamonds cut from the famous Cullinan Diamond.](https://www.thejewelleryeditor.com/media/images_thumbnails/filer_public_thumbnails/old/56386/Royal%20Asscher%20Cut_Queen%20Elizabeth%20II%20and%20Crown%20Jewels.jpg__760x0_q75_crop-scale_subsampling-2_upscale-false.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Bonum\_Legatum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bonum_legatum/32/6183_2.png) [@Bonum\_Legatum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bonum_Legatum)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/12 "2022-01-28T12:47:32Z")
In terms of the officer’s “swagger stick”: See Wikipedia for “singlestick”, a form of fighting that used a rod instead of a sword. As a “gentleman’s accessory” a singlestick would have been made as an object d’art and likely included in a portrait - to show that the person was of a certain class. Similarly, in the time when watches first appeared, portraits often had the person holding a watch to show their wealth or their interest in the latest technology. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/13 "2022-01-28T13:48:53Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > But I wonder how this translated into later noblemen wielding them in portraits In medieval and Renaissance times, few people were literate. So their art used symbols to portray stuff that we’d likely put in the little plaque right below the painting. My guess is the stick (and possibly it’s color, size, the way the subject held it) conveyed the subject’s exact rank. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [January 28, 2022, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-rod-of-authority/958530/14 "2022-01-28T18:01:14Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > Hell yeah, take a look at this brutal dictator and their rod of power 😂 I was thinking more of guys like Hamurabi or old Egyptian pharaohs…