# The SDMB is switching to paid subscriptions **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [March 18, 2004, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724 "2004-03-18T18:26:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![lachesis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@lachesis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lachesis)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/281 "2004-03-19T18:37:52Z")
grrrrr. since the hamsters ate the original version of this reply, i hope the fees will provide enough good-quality Hamster Chow to stop this in the future. to recap: charge for the Dope? bummer. i’ll sign up as quickly as possible. confused yet? 😉 while i’m another one who thinks avatars are cool, i add to the “NO” vote for including them on the SDMB. given the membership size, adding all that drag onto page loading could kill things. regarding editing: i’ve been a long-time member of another site that allows editing, with an honor-system “No Unauthorized Time Travel” policy (meaning no changing the overall slant or intent of past posts). it’s been pretty successful there, and i love being able to go back whenever i want to fix typos or grammar goofs. however, the overall focus over there is more towards roleplaying. the effect could be vastly different over here, where we’re more concerned about facts and standpoints. so unless some improbable coding restriction could be joined to the Edit feature, like only allowing changes within 30 min-1hr after the post is submitted (hey, sometimes i don’t see dumb things even when i re-read), i’d have to side with all the others on the No Edits position. i’d probably jump at the chance for a Life Membership. one of the best deals i ever got was taking out a similar Life Membership for a specialized riding group. at my then-tender age, i realized that i’d easily belong long enough to recoup the investment, then “ride” (heh) free for decades after that. and so it has been… think they finally upped the Life Membership fee several years ago. and probably curse my name whenever they go over the roster listing. 😃 oh yes-- add me to the list of “Willing to forward payments for the PayPal/credit-card disaffected”. i should have an e-mail out there with my profile (and if not, there will be one shortly). probably most helpful for those located around the DC metro area and environs. ---
**Author:** ![davos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ed655f/32.png) [@davos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davos)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/282 "2004-03-19T18:46:30Z")
> [@Left Hand of Dorkness](#): > > Honestly, I’m still not sure I follow this. An edited post would clearly be labeled as such. The only real danger I can see is someone posting something in Great Debates something like, “ **Dorkness** , you’re a screaming ninny, and I just wanted you to know that, but this message will self-destruct in three minutes,” and then coming back and editing their post to read, “ **Dorkness** , I respectfully disagree with your conclusions.” > > I don’t see the great danger that this would cause. Especially when compared to how nice it would be to be able to edit coding errors in posts. > > But I very well may be missing a place for real mischief. > Daniel From experience on other boards the problem with being able to edit posts is not so much what you mentioned above (not saying that doesn’t happen) but that it can make subsequent posts confusing and even nonsensical. It doesn’t even need to be flame type material or otherwise sensative material that is changed. Lets say I would present something as factual in a post or made an arguement in regards to the topic. Lets say after I post I realize that I maybe was hasty in posting that as a fact or that there maybe problems with my arguement that I didn’t initially see. To prevent myself from looking stupid I go back and remove or correct that fact or remove or modify that arguement. Well, while i was doing that 30 people posted in response to my post and a heated debate started focused around the substance of my original post as it exsisted pre-edit. Now that I’ve edited the original post the discussion that ensued would be confusing, if not impossible to really follow. ---
**Author:** ![haardvark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@haardvark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/haardvark)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/283 "2004-03-19T18:48:12Z")
No complaints here. As I’ve said elsewhere: I figure even if I throw up my US$5 on Monday a.m. and Never Come Back, I’ve derived at least that much enjoyment from this board over the last couple of years. Had there been a tip jar system, I would already easily be into it for more than $5, so… ya got me. I’m in. \Oh, and add me to the list of those baffled by the sense of entitlement dictating that such things must always remain free…\ ---
**Author:** ![GawnFishin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9bcb4/32.png) [@GawnFishin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GawnFishin)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/284 "2004-03-19T18:48:59Z")
I mean what does charging subscription do that merchandising can’t. To quote Ed once again… > [@](#): > > (1) Will the SDMB draw a smart, lively crowd who will **dedicate** themselves to the struggle against ignorance and **be a credit to The Master**? ANSWER: **With one or two exceptions, yes**. These forums are just a small part of a bigger business and so now I have to pay to be a credit to the master… Sorry no thanks… Oh I get it I’m one of the exception in that case I’ll keep my five bucks. Maybe I’ll put that five bucks towards a new web site and call it “Errors of the Elite Dopes”…err “Dopers”… Sorry if this sounds snarky I believe there are much nicer ways of doing business… ---
**Author:** ![Jman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jman/32/4416_2.png) [@Jman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jman)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/285 "2004-03-19T19:14:23Z")
Well, first things first: I’ll be subscribing within the first few hours it’s available. Second, I’m worried about one thing: The OP mentions that all accounts will go to guest accounts on the 22nd…I assume that we get to keep our username and post count, etc, etc, when we subscribe, right? We’re not all going to have a free for all on usernames with us all losing our preferences and post counts, are we? Because, if that happens, that will truly suck. Jman (I’m addicted to this place!!!) ---
**Author:** ![fluiddruid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fluiddruid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fluiddruid)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/286 "2004-03-19T19:19:04Z")
I am concerned that the fee will have us lose good posters and good content, but I figure $5 is small enough of a gamble to find out. I was really concerned that it was $4.95 a month, but $4.95 a year? I can pull out a $5 donation to the SDMB! I mean, if it doesn’t work out, I’ll leave and I’ll take lunch one day to work instead of eating out, no big loss. ---
**Author:** ![ChuckForbin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecb155/32.png) [@ChuckForbin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChuckForbin)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/287 "2004-03-19T19:40:17Z")
I’m in. Keeps the riff raff out. /apologies to any doper named Riff Raff ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/288 "2004-03-19T19:54:53Z")
> [@12 parsecs from home](#): > > I also run web services but I don’t not charge the people who make my service what it is. Without the users the system is nothing it’s just a computer with software. And without your voluntarily funding, those who contribute to it have nothing. They don’t benefit from it. Sure, they contribute to it and help make it possible, but they very likely benefit from it too. And who pays cold hard cash to make this all possible (the contributions and the benefits)? Yeah. That’s right. You. It ain’t free. The information on the Internet isn’t free either. None of it. Someone’s footing the bill. > [@](#): > > Take away the users and it’s nothing. Take away people who are willing to foot the bill and it’s also nothing. This thing works both ways. Do you feel _obligated_ to keep paying for these web services you provide? I mean, really? If you had some severe financial hit and could no longer afford to pay (or decided that you didn’t feel like paying anymore) would your site’s users’ reasoning that “information on the Internet should be _free_” make any difference? Would that reasoning automatically pay your bills for you? ---
**Author:** ![SwingWing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a3d4f5/32.png) [@SwingWing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SwingWing)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/289 "2004-03-19T19:55:40Z")
> [@ChuckForbin](#): > > I’m in. Keeps the riff raff out. What a blow hole! Do you really think that you and 400 dopy Dopers have or will have any impact what so ever on this earth or the 6 billion people living here? You are either completely delusional or on medication … ---
**Author:** ![htns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ba8739/32.png) [@htns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/htns)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/290 "2004-03-19T20:07:52Z")
Count me in as one of those who’d mail in a cheque - I have no credit card and don’t trust online ordering. If you don’t trust me to have the cash in my account, at least let me send a money order. EZBoard takes money orders, after all. Not trying to be an ass, it’s either mail in a cheque/MO or not be a member at all. If that’s accepted, where do I send the check/MO? ---
**Author:** ![ChuckForbin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecb155/32.png) [@ChuckForbin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChuckForbin)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/291 "2004-03-19T20:08:51Z")
> [@SwingWing](#): > > What a blow hole! Do you really think that you and 400 dopy Dopers have or will have any impact what so ever on this earth or the 6 billion people living here? You are either completely delusional or on medication … Huh ? No, I don’t think 400 dopy dopers, or 4000 dopy dopers, will have any impact on the earth. I don’t care. I come here for entertainment and occasional enlightenment. I think a subscription fee will increase both, and I’m betting five bucks on it. Delusional ? Perhaps, but that’s irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![Ed\_Zotti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/fbc32d/32.png) [@Ed\_Zotti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ed_Zotti)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/292 "2004-03-19T20:11:48Z")
Answers to some of your questions: **How secure is your credit card acceptance process?** Pretty secure. We use standard industry practices - separate secure server, 128-bit encryption, certification from VeriSign. (For more about the certificate, click on the padlock icon at lower right when you’re on one of our credit card pages, indicated by “[securesite.chireader.com](http://securesite.chireader.com)” in the URL.) You can view the Chicago Reader’s privacy policy at [http://www.chicagoreader.com/readerinc/privacy.html](http://www.chicagoreader.com/readerinc/privacy.html) . **I want to subscribe now, but I also want to get the full benefit of my 30-day free trial period. What should I do?** Subscribe now (well, on March 22). On April 21, Jerry will globally change the expiration date on all subscriptions to 4-21-05 (or corresponding date in the future if you subscribe for multiple years). In other words, if you subscribe on March 22, you’ll effectively be getting a 13-month subscription. NOTE: Jerry won’t change the expiration dates till April 21, so don’t beef if your subscription info shows an earlier date before then. **I want/don’t want avatars, custom sigs, custom titles, etc.** The list of member privileges given in the OP is subject to revision depending on server load, user feedback, whether they make the pages look icky (we’re leaning against avatars - personalized thumbnail graphics - for that reason), and generally how much of a pain they are. We may offer custom titles later on a premium basis, although the thought of titles such as “Mary Smith, F\*ckwit” gives us pause. Possible perks include who’s-online list (with opt-out feature), private messaging, and SDMB calendar. **Why can’t I mail a check to the Reader?** We really don’t want to hire clerical staff to process payments - we’ve sunk enough money into this project already. Manual payments are a headache - bounced checks, wrong amount, no signature, can’t match check to screen name, lost in the mail, foreign currency, etc. If you honest to God can’t figure out any other way to pay, such as snail-mailing the money to one of the many Dopers who have volunteered to pay electronically on your behalf, you can send me a money order and I will do it myself. However, please exhaust your other options first. **Can you tell me what exactly constitutes a bannable offense?** No, and we don’t think we need to. Except in extreme cases, e.g., threats, members will get a warning before being banned. Heed the warning and you won’t get banned. We plan to tighten up our internal procedures so that nobody gets banned solely because a mod is having a bad day, not that we ever do. **Can a previously banned user pay the $4.95 and become a member?** No. Previously banned users who are discovered will have their membership revoked and forfeit the fee. ---
**Author:** ![Sofa\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/58956e/32.png) [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/293 "2004-03-19T20:12:48Z")
> [@UncleBeer](#): > > Tell me. How’s that attitude work out for ya when you try to get a pork chop at a vegetarian restaurant? What’s that, you **can’t** get a pork chop there - no matter how loud you shout about it? Or a Volkswagen at the Caddy dealer? Weird, ain’t it, how everything you want isn’t available everywhere? > > The simple fact is, organizations offer a selection of services/products which they think they can make a profit. You, as the consumer are free to choose among the offerings. Sure you can _ask_ for that pork chop, but the seller isn’t obligated to provide it. Your choice then, is to have a damn salad, or go elsewhere. You seem to not have even the most basic understanding of a market economy. Look, man. As I already told you and everyone else _years_ ago, all you have to do is wander over to [www.arstechnica.com](http://www.arstechnica.com) to see what a successful business model looks like. If you have a hardware or software question you can go over there, ask it, and have it answered for free. If you want to sit around and talk smack or debate, you pay for it. They use UBB as well, so don’t bullshit me and tell me you can’t do it. Hell, Ars would probably lend you some of their geeks and maybe even their code. As **Shodan** pointed out, a person can still ask questions by creating a guest membership. And 91 days later, when that same person has another question, he’s going to spawn a sock puppet and ask it–assuming your brilliant business model works for 91 days. I think that people who feel forced to rip you off will be far less willing to go legit than if you offer them the opportunity to be non-paying permanent members with limited and strictly moderated posting privileges. And you’re absolutely right. If I can’t get my pork chop I’ll by God go somewhere where I can. I’m willing to let the name change slide, but I won’t back off of an open GQ. I’ve helped this message board far more than I’ve hurt it. You’ll lose me if you want to turn this place into a damned country club, and I’ll bet I’m not the only one by a long shot. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/294 "2004-03-19T20:46:05Z")
> [@Ed Zotti](#): > > We really don’t want to hire clerical staff to process payments…you can send me a money order and I will do it myself. That’s the ticket. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Doomtrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Doomtrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doomtrain)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/295 "2004-03-19T20:56:26Z")
Put me down against avatars. They’re great on small boards, but they’d be irritating on something this huge. But I’d be in favor of a 5 minute Edit Post option to correct spelling/coding. ---
**Author:** ![Algernon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a183cd/32.png) [@Algernon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algernon)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/296 "2004-03-19T20:58:02Z")
> [@Ed Zotti](#): > > …if you subscribe for multiple years… Hmmm. I wonder if we sign up for multiple years right now if all the years will be at the initial introductory price of $4.95. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Berkut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a88e57/32.png) [@Berkut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Berkut)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/297 "2004-03-19T21:04:08Z")
> [@Sofa King](#): > > They use UBB as well, so don’t bullshit me and tell me you can’t do it. The SDMB doesn’t use UBB. ---
**Author:** ![aus55](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb8c5e/32.png) [@aus55](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aus55)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/298 "2004-03-19T21:04:58Z")
I’ve been a member for over a year, with a total number of posts around 20. I’m sure my absence won’t be missed, I’m not paying for something I’d rarely use. I’d be willing to bet new memberships drop dramatically. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/299 "2004-03-19T21:12:10Z")
> [@](#): > > Look, man. As I already told you and everyone else years ago, all you have to do is wander over to [www.arstechnica.com](http://www.arstechnica.com) to see what a successful business model looks like. If you have a hardware or software question you can go over there, ask it, and have it answered for free. If you want to sit around and talk smack or debate, you pay for it. They use UBB as well, so don’t bullshit me and tell me you can’t do it. Hell, Ars would probably lend you some of their geeks and maybe even their code. Snort. In case you haven’t noticed, the SDMB doesn’t use UBB any longer - and hasn’t for more than three years. But on the larger issue, your complaint is basically that the SD chooses to not use a model identical to one that some other site on the net has? Whaddaya you think - there’s only one possible successful model? You’ve put yourself in the position of predicting something you cannot possibly know. You’ve confused your own overblown opinion of your expertise with fact. And done it in a rather rude manner. > [@](#): > > And you’re absolutely right. If I can’t get my pork chop I’ll by God go somewhere where I can. I’m willing to let the name change slide, but I won’t back off of an open GQ. I’ve helped this message board far more than I’ve hurt it. You’ll lose me if you want to turn this place into a damned country club, and I’ll bet I’m not the only one by a long shot. Get that chop with the applesauce and the mashed potatoes. I hear they make fine mashed potatoes just down the street. ---
**Author:** ![Sofa\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/58956e/32.png) [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2004, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724/300 "2004-03-19T21:19:07Z")
Yep. I hear the same thing. See ya there, bub. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-sdmb-is-switching-to-paid-subscriptions/257724.md?page=16)