# THe Search for Spock---Or more Spock Questions **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 10, 2000, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688 "2000-11-10T19:05:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![pezwookiee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@pezwookiee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pezwookiee)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2000, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/21 "2000-11-12T18:52:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lumpy \* > \*\*According to one of the ST movies, Spock had an older half-brother, but I think Trek fans have agreed to forget that entire movie ever happened. > \*\* Wait — WHAT?! Would anyone care to elaborate on this? ---
**Author:** ![pezwookiee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@pezwookiee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pezwookiee)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2000, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/22 "2000-11-12T18:54:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CalMeacham \* > \*\*The practical reason, of course, is that it gave them an excuse to show a character in the angst of “becoming human”. Every Star Trek franchise has a character struggling to “become human” – Data on STNG, The Doctor on Voyager. \*\* And I guess Odo on DS9, huh? ---
**Author:** ![bernse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@bernse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bernse)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2000, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/23 "2000-11-12T21:53:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by pezwookiee \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Lumpy \* > > \*\*According to one of the ST movies, Spock had an older half-brother, but I think Trek fans have agreed to forget that entire movie ever happened. > > \*\* > > Wait — WHAT?! > Would anyone care to elaborate on this? \*\* I think it was Star Trek 5, just after the Save The Whales one. It sucked, hard. 'Ol Billy Shatners turn to direct. Ugh, it was horrible. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2000, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/24 "2000-11-12T22:54:08Z")
> [@](#): > > I think it was Star Trek 5, just after the Save The Whales one. It sucked, hard. 'Ol Billy Shatners > turn to direct. Ugh, it was horrible. _sigh_ I’m reading this right before I go and watch it. ---
**Author:** ![pezwookiee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@pezwookiee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pezwookiee)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2000, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/25 "2000-11-12T23:58:47Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by bernse \* \*\* > [@](#): > > I think it was Star Trek 5, just after the Save The Whales one. It sucked, hard. 'Ol Billy Shatners turn to direct. Ugh, it was horrible. > > \*\* Oh – that’s the one I missed. Glad I did, I s’pose. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Zero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@Saint\_Zero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Zero)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/26 "2000-11-13T00:08:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by pepperlandgirl \* > \*\* > > > [@](#): > > > > I think it was Star Trek 5, just after the Save The Whales one. It sucked, hard. 'Ol Billy Shatners > > turn to direct. Ugh, it was horrible. > > _sigh_ > I’m reading this right before I go and watch it. > \*\* Well… Just realise that the movie you see and the script that originally left the writers typewriter or printer aren’t even close. Paramount buchered the movie inbetween badly. Nimoy in an interview in Salon awhile back mentions this. Movie still bites tho. Does have one of my favorite quotes, tho. “Why does God need a Starship?” - Dr. McCoy ---
**Author:** ![mipsman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mipsman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mipsman)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/27 "2000-11-13T00:35:49Z")
Regarding the occurence of pon far, in the movie after Spock died and was resurrected on the Genesis planet, the accelerated growing up Spock did “it” with Kirstie Alley’s female Vulcan character. It is not highlighted, but if you watch/listen closely, it is vaguely insinuated. It had to happen. I will now return to my regular science fiction universe, that of Star Wars. ---
**Author:** ![Fiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Fiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiver)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/28 "2000-11-13T13:59:03Z")
**mipsman** : > [@](#): > > Regarding the occurence of pon far, in the movie after Spock died and was resurrected on the Genesis planet, the accelerated growing up Spock did “it” with Kirstie Alley’s female Vulcan character. Minor point: In Star Trek III (the “movie after Spock died”) Kirstie Alley had been replaced by Robin Curtis in the role of Vulcan Lt. Saavik. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/29 "2000-11-13T14:34:37Z")
Sarek, Surak, Spock – is there a rule that Vulcan names have to start with S and end with k? ---
**Author:** ![Myron\_Van\_Horowitzski](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Myron\_Van\_Horowitzski](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myron_Van_Horowitzski)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/30 "2000-11-13T15:08:39Z")
Male Vulcans have names starting with “S”. Females start with “T’P”: T’Pring, T’Pau. The later series ditched these rules, I think. ---
**Author:** ![Arken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@Arken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arken)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/31 "2000-11-13T15:20:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Vulcans don’t like emotions because they’re so emotional. I remember Spock more than once saying things like ‘happiness is not logical’… And what about the episode where they had to confuse the robots and Spock said the supposedly illogical sentence, “logic is a little bird chirping in a tree.” Sounds perfectly logical to me, Mr. Pointy-Ears. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/32 "2000-11-13T16:45:20Z")
At one point they considered having all Vulcans having names that began with “sp” and eding with “k”. See “The World of Star Trek” a book that came out during the first season of Star Trek and has been reprinted many times since. There is a hilarious exchange of memos between Bob Justman and someone else (Gene L. Coon?) on exactly this issue. Obviously, they didn’t keep it up. Tuvok doesn’t fit. Heck, they dropped the “sp” in place of “s” early enough. ---
**Author:** ![Sister\_Vigilante](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@Sister\_Vigilante](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sister_Vigilante)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/33 "2000-11-13T20:29:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ishmintingas \* > \*\*Sarek, Surak, Spock – is there a rule that Vulcan names have to start with S and end with k? \*\* In the book previously mentioned, _Spock’s World_, the reason for this is to honor Surak, the founder of the logic movement. And I do recall that all Vulcan females didn’t have to have T’P; just the T’ was enough. I seem to recall a T’Mei somewhere along the line. Of course, just when they establish all the rules, they get rid of them for the Next Generation and the films (Tuvok? Valeris?) Except that Saavik is a Romulan name, meaning “Little Cat.” And pepperlandgirl, no one has mentioned yet that when this whole revolution of logic on Vulcan took place, there was a large group of people who didn’t like it very much. They left the planet and later became the Romulans. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/34 "2000-11-13T21:18:10Z")
That reference should be to Stephen E. Whitfield’s book “The Making of Star Trek”, not to David Gerrold’s much later “The World of Star Trek” ---
**Author:** ![pezwookiee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@pezwookiee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pezwookiee)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/35 "2000-11-13T21:30:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Myron Van Horowitzski \* > \*\*Male Vulcans have names starting with “S”. Females start with “T’P”: T’Pring, T’Pau. The later series ditched these rules, I think. \*\* Hold up… Why’d Kirk refer to Spock as Mr. Spock? Do Vulcans have last names? I seem to recall Spock telling Kirk his first name was unpronouncable, but they’ve used that old unpronouncable name excuse in a bunch of sci-fi series at this point, so I can’t recall. Anyone know? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/36 "2000-11-13T21:55:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Jean Grey \* > \*\* > And pepperlandgirl, no one has mentioned yet that when this whole revolution of logic on Vulcan took place, there was a large group of people who didn’t like it very much. They left the planet and later became the Romulans. \*\* HeHEM! > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Captain Amazing \* > \*\* > Those rejecting the philosophy of Surak fled off planet, eventually becoming the Romulans._\* ---
**Author:** ![vix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a88e4f/32.png) [@vix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vix)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/37 "2000-11-13T22:05:29Z")
> [@](#): > > Unfortunately, the novels aren’t canon, so any explanation in them may not be correct from the producers’ POV. If you’re interested in more non-canonical Spock insights, check out A.C. Crispin’s _Yesterday’s Son_ and its sequel, which I believe is called _Time for Yesterday_. Since you seem sort of interested in the ST novels: some of them are interesting and readable. Others, not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Fiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Fiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiver)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2000, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/38 "2000-11-13T22:09:32Z")
**pezwookiee** : > [@](#): > > Hold up… Why’d Kirk refer to Spock as Mr. Spock? Do Vulcans have last names? I seem to recall Spock telling Kirk his first name was unpronouncable, You’re close. Spock never said that to Kirk, but in the episode “This Side of Paradise” Spock fell under the influence of spores that made him express his emotions, and he fell in love with a character played by Jill Ireland. After he came to his senses, and was about to beam back up to the Enterprise, they had a goodbye scene wherein she asked: “Don’t you have another name?” Spock smiled wryly and answered: “You couldn’t pronounce it.” The underlining is mine. The implication of this scene is that Spock is not his entire name, but whether that “other name” is a first or a last name, we don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![DRY](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a87d85/32.png) [@DRY](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DRY)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2000, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/39 "2000-11-14T04:48:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Arken \* > \*\*And what about the episode where they had to confuse the robots and Spock said the supposedly illogical sentence, “logic is a little bird chirping in a tree.” Sounds perfectly logical to me, Mr. Pointy-Ears. \*\* “I, Mudd” **Five** , I thought that Jill Ireland’s character said “You never told me your first name.” I suppose I could be mistaken on that, though. ---
**Author:** ![McKenna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/db5fbb/32.png) [@McKenna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/McKenna)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2000, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688/40 "2000-11-14T05:24:43Z")
Kirk: (something like) Let’s continue the tour, Mrs…? Amanda: Amanda, Captain. You couldn’t pronounce the Vulcan family name. Kirk: (charmingly) Can you? Amanda: (amused) After a fashion, and many years of practice! Shall we continue the tour Captain, my husband did request it. - from “Journey to Babel”, introductory episode for Sarek and Amanda, which the OP definitely should rent at the video store for starters to understand Spock [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-search-for-spock-or-more-spock-questions/40688.md?page=3)