# The second presidential debate: 10/16/2012 **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 16, 2012, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847 "2012-10-16T04:35:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 48
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/941 "2012-10-17T19:22:59Z")
> [@Anduril](#): > > But Romney didn’t claim that. What he claimed was that Obama didn’t identify the attack on Benghazi as a terrorist act even though they already know that it was. Obama’s speech in the Rose Garden the day after did mention “terror acts” but did not specifically identify the attack in Benghazi as a terror act. It was more of a general statement about terror acts. Obama’s preceding statement prior to his mentioning “terror acts” in the Rose garden was a statement about the original 9/11 attacks - at no point in the speech did he identify the Benghazi attack as a terrorist act. > > So, when Crowley “corrected” Romney by saying that Obama did call Benghazi an “act of terror”, she was actually simply lying for Obama. She should resign. She has no credibility as a journalist. Read the fucking transcript. Here, I’ll repost it for you since you seem bound and determined to misrepresent it. His preceeding statment mentions BOTH 9/11/01 and the Benghazi attacks, he refers to “those who represent us overseas” in the next part of his speech, and finally, he again mentions the four casualties in Benghazi immediately after mentioning “acts of terror.” \*Of course, yesterday was already a painful day for our nation as we marked the solemn memory of the 9/11 attacks. We mourned with the families who were lost on that day. I visited the graves of troops who made the ultimate sacrifice in Iraq and Afghanistan at the hallowed grounds of Arlington Cemetery, and had the opportunity to say thank you and visit some of our wounded warriors at Walter Reed. **And then last night, we learned the news of this attack in Benghazi.** As Americans, let us never, ever forget that our freedom is only sustained because there are people who are willing to fight for it, to stand up for it, and in some cases, lay down their lives for it. **Our country is only as strong as the character of our people and the service of those both civilian and military who represent us around the globe.** \* _No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for. Today we mourn four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America. We will not waver in our commitment to see that justice is done for this terrible act. And make no mistake, justice will be done._ LOL, on preview I see you’ve posted it as some sort of twisted way to support your rediculous interpretation. You are wrong. No, Obama did specifically say “this was an act of terrorism,” but he CLEARLY included the Benghazi attack in what he was referring to as “acts of terror.” (Hint: notice that little _ **s** _ after act. That means plural, as in, more than one act of terror.) ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/942 "2012-10-17T19:23:20Z")
And here we go with the “idolatry” and Messiah stuff again. Nobody actually thinks that way, you know? If we were all walking around with stars in our eyes, we wouldn’t have admitted he lost the first debate. “Acts of terror” is plural for a reason in that speech. He could have easily said “act of terror,” at which point we could determine that he is speaking of only one act of terror. By saying “acts of terror,” however, it is CLEAR that he is speaking about multiple acts of terror, of which Benghazi was one. But even IF he didn’t call it a terrorist act for two weeks, I still haven’t heard anyone give a plausible reason for why I should give half a fuck. Why do I care who did it? I want the perpetrators brought to justice in whatever way possible, no matter who they are. And given that Obama did to OBL what Bush couldn’t pull off in 7 years, I have high hopes that they will. I see no need to rush to conclusions–in fact, I think that’s dangerous. Also, most of the board’s conservatives don’t seem to be sports fans. Only losers blame the refs. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/943 "2012-10-17T19:24:14Z")
> [@Anduril](#): > > You are absolutely wrong. Full stop. > > Did you even bother to check the full transcript of Obama’s speech in the rose garden? > > You’re quote make it seem as if Obama is identifying Benghazi as an act of terror. Here’s the preceding paragraphs for your benefit: > > \*Of course, yesterday was already a painful day for our nation as we marked the solemn memory of the 9/11 attacks. We mourned with the families who were lost on that day. I visited the graves of troops who made the ultimate sacrifice in Iraq and Afghanistan at the hallowed grounds of Arlington Cemetery, and had the opportunity to say thank you and visit some of our wounded warriors at Walter Reed. And then last night, we learned the news of this attack in Benghazi. > > As Americans, let us never, ever forget that our freedom is only sustained because there are people who are willing to fight for it, to stand up for it, and in some cases, lay down their lives for it. Our country is only as strong as the character of our people and the service of those both civilian and military who represent us around the globe. > > No **acts of terror** will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for. Today we mourn four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America. We will not waver in our commitment to see that justice is done for this terrible act. And make no mistake, justice will be done.\* > > As is clear to everyone with the reading comprehension of a grade schooler, Obama was making a general statement when he mentioned “acts of terror”. Lemme take you in the wayback machine to third grade, where you learn about paragraphs. A paragraph is a group of sentences about a topic. The first sentence in a paragraph is often called the “topic sentence,” because it tells you what the topic of the sentence will be. The remaining sentences in the paragraph elaborate on that topic. The topic sentence of the last paragraph you quoted is, “No **acts of terror** will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for.” All the remaining sentences in that paragraph elaborate on whether acts of terror will shake the nation’s resolve etc. The next sentence talks about mourning the people who died yesterday. **Unless that sentence is about them dying in an act of terror, it does not belong in that paragraph**. The next sentence is about seeking justice for “this terrible act.” The quoted phrase refers to the death of four people. **Unless this terrible act is an act of terror, it does not belong in that paragraph**. The final sentence re-emphasizes our commitment. Now let’s zoom back to the present. Hopefully you understand now how paragraphs work, and you can see that “act of terror” refers unambiguously to “this terrible act,” i.e., the act that killed “four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America.” And hopefully you’ll apologize for this ridiculous lapse in your reading comprehension. And hopefully I’ll get a magic pony for Christmas. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/944 "2012-10-17T19:26:48Z")
> [@Anduril](#): > > You are absolutely wrong. Full stop. > > Did you even bother to check the full transcript of Obama’s speech in the rose garden? > > You’re quote make it seem as if Obama is identifying Benghazi as an act of terror. Here’s the preceding paragraphs for your benefit: > > \*Of course, yesterday was already a painful day for our nation as we marked the solemn memory of the 9/11 attacks. We mourned with the families who were lost on that day. I visited the graves of troops who made the ultimate sacrifice in Iraq and Afghanistan at the hallowed grounds of Arlington Cemetery, and had the opportunity to say thank you and visit some of our wounded warriors at Walter Reed. And then last night, we learned the news of this attack in Benghazi. > > As Americans, let us never, ever forget that our freedom is only sustained because there are people who are willing to fight for it, to stand up for it, and in some cases, lay down their lives for it. Our country is only as strong as the character of our people and the service of those both civilian and military who represent us around the globe. > > No **acts of terror** will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for. Today we mourn four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America. We will not waver in our commitment to see that justice is done for this terrible act. And make no mistake, justice will be done.\* > > As is clear to everyone with the reading comprehension of a grade schooler, Obama was making a general statement when he mentioned “acts of terror”. No one with even half a brain would say that Obama specifically identified the Benghazi attack as a terrorist attack. Proof of this is the fact that on September 28, even Candy Crowley herself was asking why the White House is still not saying that it was a terrorist attack. And yet she had the temerity to correct Romney and say that Obama did label it a terror act. Really? Then what’s with your statements on September 28? > > You are 100% completely wrong. I know you love your idol so much that it pains you that he’s being attacked. But you have to let go of your idolatry of Obama before it’s too late. Of course he was referring to Benghazi. As noted above, he considered Benghazi one of a number of acts of terror. Reading it any other way is insane or desperate or both. Like Bill Clinton debating the meaning of “is”. Oh, Anduril. Do they have a PUMA chapter in the Phillipines, or are you all by your lonesome self? ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/945 "2012-10-17T19:27:28Z")
I would just like to point out that I have a reasonably good mix of liberals and conservatives on my Facebook list, and nobody on there is talking about this whole “acts of terror” vs. “terrorism” thing at all. Not even a little bit. Seriously, nobody cares. Romney looked like a tool on this topic during the debate. No amount of semantic nitpicking after the fact is going to change that. That’s how these things go. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/946 "2012-10-17T19:32:04Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Now let’s zoom back to the present. Hopefully you understand now how paragraphs work, and you can see that “act of terror” refers unambiguously to “this terrible act,” i.e., the act that killed “four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America.” A very minor correction here: I technically should have said: > [@](#): > > “this terrible act,” i.e., the act that killed “four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America,” refers unambiguously to “acts of terror.” I got the pointer and the referent reversed, but the essential point is the same: Obama’s phrases clearly and unambiguously intends that the “terrible act” is an example of an “act of terror,” and the “terrible act” refers to the previous day’s events. ---
**Author:** ![standingwave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@standingwave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/standingwave)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/947 "2012-10-17T19:34:04Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > This was a trap. Romney jumped on it because clearly that isn’t what the message was of the campaign for the first ten days after the attack. But Obama’s people found that one line and used it well. They basically caught him in a definition of the word “is” snare. Also, the day after the speech in the Rose Garden, Obama was speaking in Colorado: “So what I want all of you to know is that we are going to bring those who killed our fellow Americans to justice. I want people around the world to hear me: To all those who would do us harm, _no act of terror will go unpunished_.” ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/948 "2012-10-17T19:38:39Z")
> [@Anduril](#): > > As is clear to everyone with the reading comprehension of a grade schooler, Obama was making a general statement when he mentioned “acts of terror”. No one with even half a brain would say that Obama specifically identified the Benghazi attack as a terrorist attack. I was going to point out that the paragraph beginning with the “acts of terror” sentence goes on to reference the 4 fallen Americans, and concludes with a promise of justice for them. But I see that \*\*Left Hand of Dorkness \*\*already did so in Post 558. So I’ll just note that I take no personal affront at your “half a brain” epithet. You, like Romney, have every right to splutter foolishly over this non-issue. ETA - Ninja’d by several more 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/949 "2012-10-17T19:40:13Z")
> [@standingwave](#): > > Also, the day after the speech in the Rose Garden, Obama was speaking in Colorado: “So what I want all of you to know is that we are going to bring those who killed our fellow Americans to justice. I want people around the world to hear me: To all those who would do us harm, _no act of terror will go unpunished_.” See! That’s _twice_ he didn’t say it right! ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/950 "2012-10-17T19:41:11Z")
> [@Anduril](#): > > I know you love your idol so much that it pains you that he’s being attacked. But you have to let go of your idolatry of Obama before it’s too late. No no, he’s the messiah. Get your memes straight. And yes I get it. You honestly believe that when Obama gave a speech about the situation in Libya, and he used the actual phrase “No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation,” … You really, really believe that he was not referring to the events in Libya. During his speech about the events in Libya. You’re very much like a guy running down the street convinced that everyone is crazy because they don’t see the ants crawling all over him. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/951 "2012-10-17T19:41:17Z")
[QUOTE=Anduril] As is clear to everyone with the reading comprehension of a grade schooler, Obama was making a general statement when he mentioned “acts of terror”. No one with even half a brain would say that Obama specifically identified the Benghazi attack as a terrorist attack. Proof of this is the fact that on September 28, even Candy Crowley herself was asking why the White House is still not saying that it was a terrorist attack. And yet she had the temerity to correct Romney and say that Obama did label it a terror act. Really? Then what’s with your statements on September 28? You are 100% completely wrong. I know you love your idol so much that it pains you that he’s being attacked. But you have to let go of your idolatry of Obama before it’s too late. [/QUOTE] Your interpretation is strained beyond belief. Nobody outside of the right wing rumpus room is buying it. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/952 "2012-10-17T19:46:50Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Stolen from Daily Kos: Mitt Romney says that instead of equal pay, women should be allowed to go home so that they can make dinner. This was another thing that stuck out at me. Romney kept emphasizing the need for employers to be ultra-flexible when it comes to hiring women. Why? Because women need to go home at 5 pm to take care of their kids, he said. What seems lost on him is that this is a _parent_ issue. Last time I checked, both men and women can be parents, so flexibility in work times shouldn’t be made out to be a women’s issue. And not all women are mothers. We’re too far into the 21st century to be conflating the female gender with motherhood. Also, he naively seemed to think getting businesses to hire women is what is at issue. > [@](#): > > ROMNEY: We’re going to have to have employers in the new economy, in the economy I’m going to bring to play, that are going to be so anxious to get good workers they’re going to be anxious to hire women. [http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/transcript-second-presidential-debate/](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/transcript-second-presidential-debate/) You hear that ladies? Companies are going to be _so_ anxious to hire, so desperate in fact, that they’ll even hire YOU! ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/953 "2012-10-17T19:51:42Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > This was another thing that stuck out at me. Romney kept emphasizing the need for employers to be ultra-flexible when it comes to hiring women. Why? Because women need to go home at 5 pm to take care of their kids, he said. What seems lost on him is that this is a _parent_ issue. Last time I checked, both men and women can be parents, so flexibility in work times shouldn’t be made out to be a women’s issue. And not all women are mothers. We’re too far into the 21st century to be conflating the female gender with motherhood. Seriously. I’m the dad, and I pick my kid up from daycare, because my work schedule allows me to. It sometimes means I require flexibility and need to leave meetings a little earlier than everyone else. It’s not a mom issue, it’s a parent issue. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/954 "2012-10-17T19:51:51Z")
Can i just say this is a stupid thing to even be debating. There are real issues that can be brought up. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/955 "2012-10-17T19:53:17Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Okay, what the hell, man? Maybe I’m the only one who’s bothered by this, but they found the liliest white crowd of whites in the world, then they let this shiny negro\* in to ask “What have you done for me?” The hell was that? > > While we’re all here, can I say there are no words for how much I love assigning Mr. Romney the moniker “Mittens.” Kills me every single time. > \*It’s okay, I’m one of them. I get to say that. > [@Smapti](#): > > Romney just blamed his investments on his “blind trust”. > > Obama: “I don’t look at my pension often, it’s not as big as yours.” Its called Pension Envy. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/956 "2012-10-17T19:53:42Z")
> [@Jas09](#): > > I just hope we spend the next two weeks parsing “acts of terror” vs. “terrorist attacks”, and that some time in the interim Obama orders the killing of those responsible so we can go over once again just how weak his is on terrorists. > > Much better that than discussing the unemployment rate or gas prices or Obamacare, right Gov Romney? Now you’re getting it. The whole debate is going to be reduced by the Romney camp to this one thing. And for precisely the reason you name. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/957 "2012-10-17T19:56:30Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Seriously. I’m the dad, and I pick my kid up from daycare, because my work schedule allows me to. It sometimes means I require flexibility and need to leave meetings a little earlier than everyone else. It’s not a mom issue, it’s a parent issue. I’m sorry, but this is completely un-American and especially un-Republican. Stop this and either get your wife to stay home or get married if you’re not, and make your wife stay home. If you can’t comply, may I suggest you self-deport to a country that respects traditional values. If you won’t do that, we will confiscate your passport and you will become illegal. > [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > Can i just say this is a stupid thing to even be debating. There are real issues that can be brought up. Real issues are so… what… oh yeah, revealing of Romney’s weaknesses. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/958 "2012-10-17T20:00:31Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > I would just like to point out that I have a reasonably good mix of liberals and conservatives on my Facebook list, and nobody on there is talking about this whole “acts of terror” vs. “terrorism” thing at all. Not even a little bit. Seriously, nobody cares. Romney looked like a tool on this topic during the debate. No amount of semantic nitpicking after the fact is going to change that. That’s how these things go. If Romney’s campaign people want to hang their hats on that argument, I have two words for them: PLEASE CONTINUE 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/959 "2012-10-17T20:03:19Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > This was another thing that stuck out at me. Romney kept emphasizing the need for employers to be ultra-flexible when it comes to hiring women. Why? Because women need to go home at 5 pm to take care of their kids, he said. What seems lost on him is that this is a _parent_ issue. Last time I checked, both men and women can be parents, so flexibility in work times shouldn’t be made out to be a women’s issue. And not all women are mothers. We’re too far into the 21st century to be conflating the female gender with motherhood. > > Also, he naively seemed to think getting businesses to hire women is what is at issue. > [http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/transcript-second-presidential-debate/](http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/16/transcript-second-presidential-debate/) > > You hear that ladies? Companies are going to be _so_ anxious to hire, so desperate in fact, that they’ll even hire YOU! Did he just get thawed out after being preserved in a glacier since the middle of last century, surviving the freezing process as a result of the Super-Stupor Serum and/or the effects of Vapid-Rays? ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/960 "2012-10-17T20:03:21Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > This was another thing that stuck out at me. Romney kept emphasizing the need for employers to be ultra-flexible when it comes to hiring women. Why? Because women need to go home at 5 pm to take care of their kids, he said. What seems lost on him is that this is a _parent_ issue. Last time I checked, both men and women can be parents, so flexibility in work times shouldn’t be made out to be a women’s issue. I don’t know why it even needs to be a parent issue. I’m a male non-parent and I very much appreciate having a job that offers flexible hours, just because I like to do things that aren’t work. Also, making this a parent issue is saying that the parents should have flexible hours and the non-parents can fill in the holes. We should encourage employers to offer more flexible hours, but they should offer them to everybody. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847.md?page=47) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847.md?page=49)