# The Signifying Douchebag? \[Henry Gates arrest - racism?\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 21, 2009, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703 "2009-07-21T01:37:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/81 "2009-07-21T16:50:53Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > So, my question is…under what authority did they arrest him for yelling at them? Is that a crime?! What charges? [Disorderly conduct.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disorderly_conduct) > [@Hampshire](#): > > Honestly, if I was breaking into my own home and the cops showed up and threw me to the ground and questioned me up and down to make sure I really was the homeowner I would give them no hassle and actually be thankful that they went through all that trouble to protect my home. If they threw me to the ground without provocation I’d be filing a complaint, but I do believe it’s entirely appropriate to ask whomever answers the door for positive ID, and maybe throw a few questions at them to determine that they’re not acting under duress (e.g. maybe the burglar/home invader is behind the door with a gun to the owner’s head). And like you, I’d be expressively grateful to them for taking such steps if it were me/my house in question. As I recall from the NY Times article though, there was no physical interaction until the officer cuffed/arrested Gates. ---
**Author:** ![jakesteele](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ed8c4c/32.png) [@jakesteele](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jakesteele)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/82 "2009-07-21T16:51:35Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > Police respond to investigate a possible robbery. Okay so far. They knock on the door and a man answers. That by itself should have been enough to conclude that the man who answered wasn’t a burglar. Outside of Hollywood, what rational burglar is going to answer the door of a house he’s burglarizing? > > > > I could see asking “We received a report of a possible burglary, are you okay?” To ask the man for proof that he lived in his own home was unacceptable. To arrest him for disorderly conduct after he chewed them out was complete B.S > > . For Christ’s sake, the cops don’t know for sure about anything except that there was a break in. They don’t know if the man there is the owner or the burglar. I’m white and I have had that exact thing happen to me. Also, 2 weeks ago I was sitting out on my front porch steps late at night and the cops came with lights falshing looking for a suspect on foot. They saw me sitting in front of my own house and respectfully asked me to provide proof of residense so they could rule me out. They said that that was a tactic that is sometimes used by a cornered suspect or a brazen, bold one. No harm, no foul. They were just doing their job. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/83 "2009-07-21T16:59:59Z")
> [@jakesteele](#): > > They saw me sitting in front of my own house and respectfully asked me to provide proof of residense so they could rule me out. They said that that was a tactic that is sometimes used by a cornered suspect or a brazen, bold one. I’m sure a fleeing criminal at some point has acted like a department store mannequin to try and escape. None of that matters. If you had told the cops that you weren’t the man they were looking for and to stop bothering you, they couldn’t detain you just to make absolutely sure. If they really had probable cause to believe that you were the suspect trying to pull a fast one on them, they could secure a warrant. If they harrassed you until you got pissed off enough to yell at them, they wouldn’t be justified in arresting you for disorderly conduct either. You may think “harrass” is a strong term to use in this instance, but I’m prepared to give someone lots of leeway in how they interpret police behavior when they’re in their own home. ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/84 "2009-07-21T17:02:01Z")
[They’ve dropped the charges](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/07/21/henry-louis-gates-jr-arre_n_242010.html) ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/85 "2009-07-21T17:05:29Z")
Good. The arrested shouldn’t have happened and the department is probably humiliated. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/86 "2009-07-21T17:14:12Z")
For me, the more disturbing issue is that we continually see incidents involving cops who are bigots and cowards. Sure, the job is dangerous (although not as dangerous as many others, or as dangerous as most people assume), but that doesn’t mean you don’t have to show a certain level of professionalism, common sense, and integrity. Even time I hear about cops arresting people in situations like this, [shooting](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BART_Police_shooting_of_Oscar_Grant) [unarmed](http://www.homelandstupidity.us/2006/02/02/police-officer-shoots-unarmed-man-for-no-reason/) [people](http://www.rawstory.com/news/2008/MI_cops_shoot_unarmed_20yearold_marijuana_0316.html), [arresting](http://www.examiner.com/x-1892-Phoenix-Progressive-Examiner~y2009m5d28-Police-arrest-paramedic-taking-woman-to-hospital) paramedics transporting patients, or [tasing](http://ndnforum.com/blogs//index.php/2009/06/10/deputy-tases-72-year-old-woman?blog=5) a 72-year old woman, I start to question why so many cops are disgraceful human beings. If you can’t deal with deal with someone yelling at you, “disrespecting” you, or giving you a hard time, you shouldn’t be a cop. You don’t get to end someone’s life, or waste time and resources arresting people to make a point. Particularly since those actions make it harder for the decent cops to perform their duties, and for citizens to trust the police. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/87 "2009-07-21T17:16:11Z")
If he was a plumber, there would have no such apology, no news stories, and nobody defending him. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/88 "2009-07-21T17:20:58Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > If he was a plumber, there would have no such apology, no news stories, and nobody defending him. Well thank God he was someone notable so we could all be reminded that the Constitution exists to protect every one of us. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/89 "2009-07-21T17:22:58Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > If he was a plumber, there would have no such apology Probably true. > [@](#): > > no news stories Unlikely. Racial profiling has been a big story for years. > [@](#): > > and nobody defending him. Dopers are willing to go to bat for kids accused of dine and dash at an IHOP, so I’m not surprised some of them defended a university professor who got arrested for giving the cops a hard time after being accused of breaking into his own home. ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/90 "2009-07-21T17:31:54Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > If he was a plumber, there would have no such apology, no news stories, and nobody defending him. You’re right. If the instead of a policeman, the officer was a plumber, he would not have had the power of arrest for being called a racist (again, note that in the officer’s report there was no mention of profanity, just politically protected speech). ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/91 "2009-07-21T17:33:39Z")
Well, hate and prejudice and profiling take several forms. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/92 "2009-07-21T17:36:13Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > I’m sure a fleeing criminal at some point has acted like a department store mannequin to try and escape. None of that matters. If you had told the cops that you weren’t the man they were looking for and to stop bothering you, they couldn’t detain you just to make absolutely sure. Yyyyyeah… I’m not a lawyer, but I’m pretty sure this is wrong. “It ain’t me, officer!” is not some magic phrase that renders the speaker immune from suspicion and impervious to further questioning or detainment. At least not from my many years of intensive COPS-based study. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/93 "2009-07-21T17:43:33Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Yyyyyeah… I’m not a lawyer, but You’re wrong. Just stop there. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/94 "2009-07-21T17:45:50Z")
For some reason I’m not taking Moid’s word for it. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/95 "2009-07-21T17:47:18Z")
I have a feeling you won’t take anyone’s word that disagrees with your viewpoint. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/96 "2009-07-21T17:58:13Z")
Interesting. I’ll mull that over. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/97 "2009-07-21T17:59:01Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > You’re wrong. Just stop there. I could well be wrong. Perhaps you could share your credentials, so that I may give your esteemed opinion all the weight it deserves. In the meantime, I will continue to find the notion that a suspect can simply tell law enforcement “you got the wrong guy, fuck off,” with the effect of a legal Jedi mind-trick, somewhat implausible. I feel strongly that such a tidbit of information would be quickly circulated throughout the criminal element of society, and that our jails and prisons would soon be empty. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/98 "2009-07-21T17:59:57Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Gates is a primary source. You’re ignoring him. > > What I’m saying is that we have no reason to automatically assume that the police report is more accurate than Gates’ account. The cops said it therefore it must be true is a very ovine approach to analyzing something like this. This is some of the dumbest stuff I’ve read all week. You’re allowed to pull 17 different kinds of speculation out of your ass, including the motivations of the cops, while at the same time questioning the validity of other people’s citations? Please tell me you’re joking. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/99 "2009-07-21T18:15:39Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > You know this how? Hey, you had your chance to speak with confident ignorance (i.e. post 4). Let someone else have a turn. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2009, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703/100 "2009-07-21T18:17:16Z")
I labeled everything I said as speculation and opinion, and I didn’t try to point to either side’s personal account as a “cite.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-signifying-douchebag-henry-gates-arrest-racism/503703.md?page=6)