# The Simpsons poke the Politically Incorrect Bear - The Problem with Apu **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 9, 2018, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091 "2018-04-09T17:17:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![neofishboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/neofishboy/32/444_2.png) [@neofishboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neofishboy)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/41 "2018-04-10T00:25:47Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > I thought they had. Not commenting on whether he is or is not offensive, but Apu is one of the more rounded out minor characters. We know way more about him than Lenny or Carl, for example. He’s more than an Indian stereotype\*. Others may treat him as a stereotype, but there is more to him than that. He is a proud man. And intelligent. > > At least he was prior to 2002, when I quit watching. > > \ ***even if he played on the bowling team named “The Stereotypes”**. 🙂 [Comic Book Guy] Um, _excuse_ me but I _believe_ (by which I mean I _know_) that Apu was never a _member_ of that particular\* team\*. He merely lamented that they had “begged” him to join after his own team, the Pin Pals, had\* lost\* to them. And by the way … for that\* blunder\*, you are now _fired_. Good _day_. [/CBG] ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/42 "2018-04-10T02:15:00Z")
> [@DavidwithanR](#): > > The show is about a “bad”, rebellious, immature boy… This reads as if you stopped watching the show after the 1st or 2nd season when it stopped being the Bart show and became the Homer show. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/43 "2018-04-10T03:15:06Z")
Why does no one lament the stereotype about adults who are into comics? Even casual viewers like me have seen enough to appreciate that Apu started out as a stereotype joke and quickly became a complex character. What they _could_ do would be to have some other Indian characters who go against stereotype. If they did it funny. If not then no. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/44 "2018-04-10T04:19:27Z")
From the NYT "At the end of 2017, Hank Azaria, the voice behind Apu Nahasapeemapetilon, a convenience-store owner on “The Simpsons” with a thick Indian accent, responded to a recent groundswell of criticism that the character was racist. " Cite one thing he’s said that’s racist. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/45 "2018-04-10T05:33:25Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …don’t tell me what to do. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/46 "2018-04-10T06:25:38Z")
At this point I think we can all agree that tv shows should only have all white members lest non-white people are shown incorrectly. This way white people can not offend non-white people. And all tv shows that have a non-white member should have that member white-washed from the shows history so that only white members are only shown from the very past and into the future. Then everyone will be happy. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 6:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/47 "2018-04-10T06:38:10Z")
When the episode set in Australia came out, way back when, I was somewhat annoyed at how they made fun of the Australian stereotypes and got basically everything wrong, making them the butt of jokes. I was about 20 years old at the time. Then as I rewatched the series repeatedly I realised they make fun of everybody, poke fun at all stereotypes, across the world, and most specifically in America. Nothing gets in the show without being skewered by a joke. I’ve never felt Apu has been treated poorly as a character. The stereotype is harmless and accurate, and though exaggerated and the role played by a non-Asian actor, it’s not inherently offensive just for that reason. I don’t want to belittle anybody’s issue with it, I am not Indian and have no real insight into this specific character’s portrayal really, but I can’t see that it’s worth getting upset about either. Do the Scots get upset about Groundskeeper Willy? Is anyone upset by Lou the cop? ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/48 "2018-04-10T06:50:21Z")
IIRC didn’t Apu buy the Kwik-E-Mart? He’s steadily moving up and becoming more successful. He’s respectful to his customers but he’s not subservient to anybody. Many immigrants retain strong accents. I would find it dishonest for Apu to talk like Mo or Homer. Apu is an immigrant from India. He has an accent. Deal with it. They could introduce a child character that is a 2nd generation immigrant. He or she wouldn’t have the accent the parent use. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/49 "2018-04-10T06:57:22Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > IIRC didn’t Apu buy the Kwik-E-Mart? > > He’s steadily moving up and becoming more successful. He’s respectful to his customers but he’s not subservient to anybody. > > Many immigrants retain strong accents. I would find it dishonest for Apu to talk like Mo or Homer. Apu is an immigrant from India. He has an accent. > > Deal with it. > > They could introduce a child character that is a 2nd generation immigrant. He or she wouldn’t have the accent the parent use. Um…he famously has octuplets. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/50 "2018-04-10T07:01:51Z")
Well, they should be typical American kids. It’s been my experience. I went to school with kids that had immigrant parents. I can recall being surprised when I finally met them. A good friend of mine was called Jimmy at school. His parents used his Filipino name at home. ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/51 "2018-04-10T07:10:13Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > Don’t make fucking jokes about it. Its the Simpsons, they stopped doing jokes 20 years ago. > [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > Hari started a conversation. The Simpsons creators response was essentially “fuck you.” Why do the offended always feel like they are entitled to a response? “Fuck you” should be the default answer to every crank with an axe to grind. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/52 "2018-04-10T08:27:22Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > Why do the offended always feel like they are entitled to a response? …why are you characterizing Hari’s thoughtful, well reasoned critique as being “offended?” > [@](#): > > “Fuck you” should be the default answer to every crank with an axe to grind. Hari isn’t a crank. ISiddiqui, who posted earlier in the thread > [@](#): > > I am a South Asian man who was born in 1980. I was mocked with an Apu voice and “do you want a slushy /go to the Quik-e-mart” CONSTANTLY in middle school. Yes, Apu was definitely used as a slur against South Asian people since he was introduced is not a crank. The Simpson’s creators are entitled to say “fuck you” to anyone they like. But if they are saying “fuck you” then they most certainly aren’t going to be admitting “Apu was and is problematic”, which was the entire point of the snippet you quoted of me. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/53 "2018-04-10T12:01:53Z")
Kondabolu did point out that if Apu had been just one of many Indian characters on television it wouldn’t have been an issue and he would have found it funny. But having Apu the caricature as the pre-eminent Indian character - and thus the one being seen to represent a billion people - is entirely the problem. So perhaps we just need more well-rounded South Asians as regular characters on television and in films, and Apu will fade away. (And Koothrapali doesn’t really count as a “well-rounded character”.) ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/54 "2018-04-10T12:15:49Z")
Like any art, if the Simpsons can’t stay relevant in changing times, it will fade and become irrelevant. The times they are a-becoming quite different. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/55 "2018-04-10T13:03:15Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > So perhaps we just need more well-rounded South Asians as regular characters on television and in films, and Apu will fade away. (And Koothrapali doesn’t really count as a “well-rounded character”.) How about Kelly Kapoor on _The Office_? She wasn’t defined by her ethnicity, but it was used as a plot point from time to time. ---
**Author:** ![greenmario](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/97f17d/32.png) [@greenmario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/greenmario)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/56 "2018-04-10T15:11:55Z")
I can empathize with Hari’s frustration over the lack of indian characters on TV, but the Simpsons arent under any special obligation for creating the “first”. ---
**Author:** ![Wolf333](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf333/32/3460_2.png) [@Wolf333](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolf333)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/57 "2018-04-10T15:13:42Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > How about Kelly Kapoor on _The Office_? She wasn’t defined by her ethnicity, but it was used as a plot point from time to time. Tom, from “Parks and Rec.” His ethnicity is never even mentioned. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/58 "2018-04-10T15:21:14Z")
My issue with the Simpsons response was not that they are saying “Apu isn’t problematic.” The problem is they are saying “20 years ago we didn’t think Apu was problematic so it’s not our fault if people are taking offense now.” > [@Wolf333](#): > > Tom, from “Parks and Rec.” His ethnicity is never even mentioned. > [@](#): > > Leslie Knope: You’re not from here, right? > > Tom Haverford: No, I’m from South Carolina. > > Leslie Knope: But you moved to South Carolina from where? > > Tom Haverford: My mother’s uterus. > > Leslie Knope: But you were conceived in Libya, right? > > Tom Haverford: Wow. No. I was conceived in America. My parents are Indian. > > Leslie Knope: Where did the name Haverford come from? > > Tom Haverford: My birth name is Darwish Zubair Ismail Gani. Then I changed it to Tom Haverford, because you know, brown guys with funny-sounding Muslim names don’t make it far into politics. > > Leslie Knope: What about Barack Obama? > > Tom Haverford: Okay, yeah, fine, Barack Obama. If I knew a guy named Barack Obama was gonna be elected president, yeah, maybe I wouldn’t have changed it. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/59 "2018-04-10T15:23:50Z")
> [@neofishboy](#): > > [Comic Book Guy] Um, _excuse_ me but I _believe_ (by which I mean I _know_) that Apu was never a _member_ of that particular\* team\*. He merely lamented that they had “begged” him to join after his own team, the Pin Pals, had\* lost\* to them. And by the way … for that\* blunder\*, you are now _fired_. Good _day_. [/CBG] …but…but…you can’t… ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2018, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091/60 "2018-04-10T15:35:24Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > But what could _The Simpsons_ do _now_ that would change that? IIRC, Hari Kondabolu’s main goal was that wanted to start a conversation about the use of South Asian stereotypes in media. Aziz Ansari does that in a fantastic Master of None episode as well. It wasn’t necessarily about what the Simpsons in general could do - however, he does mention that they could introduce additional South Asian people who didn’t correspond to the stereotype (probably like a relative of Apu who can show up time to time). What the Simpsons did instead was just dumb. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-simpsons-poke-the-politically-incorrect-bear-the-problem-with-apu/812091.md?page=4)