# The social phenomenon of giving girls male-associated names **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 3, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803 "2014-01-03T16:02:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/21 "2014-01-03T17:57:07Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Evelyn was a ‘male’ name? I’m not going to say how recently I discovered that [Evelyn Waugh](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evelyn_Waugh) was a dude, because the shame might be too much to bear. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/22 "2014-01-03T18:03:42Z")
I think you are going to find a number of factors. One is family names, or in some cases wanna-be family names. I think the practice of giving a baby a family name goes way back, and has always been practiced on occasion-- especially among the upper class whose names carried some weight. At some point this spread to the aspirational middle class, and began to encompass surnames outside of the family. Another is going to be people naming their kids after historical figures or other celebrities. Right now, there are more prominent men in history than women. A small percentage is going to be families who wanted a boy or only picked out a boys name for whatever reason. I know some of those. Then you get those who just like the sound or feeling of a name. Name trends change according to fashion, just like we once decorated our homes in avocado green and bright orange, or we once wore bell bottoms and leisure suits. Finally, there are those who want to evoke certain qualities not found in girl’s names. Many girls names seem ornate or cute or just super-feminine. Lots of modern women don’t particularly identify with these qualities. They are looking for names that feel bold, or professional, or whatever, and find more boy’s names that have that feeling. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/23 "2014-01-03T18:07:01Z")
Just for the record, [fucking](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leone_Sextus_Tollemache) stupid names are not a new phenomenon. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/24 "2014-01-03T18:09:50Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Personally, I like unisexual names. I don’t like any trendy names, so that means I reflexively despise “Madison”. But in a world where there are a kabillion “Mikes”, “Jasons”, “Jennifers”, and “Elizabeths”, any “different” kind of name–even a crazy one–is refeshing. IMHO. A thousand times this. When I thought I’d have children, we were planning on naming any girls either surnames as first names or boys names. Why? Well, we both typically thought that most girls names didn’t fit with our personalities. We love sports and being outdoors, are very much into horseplay and various tomfoolery, and are pretty laid back. Anything that smacked of encouraging high maintenance or extremely girlie-ness wouldn’t have worked well in our household. Also, we liked how they sounded more often than compared to their female counterparts, and the unique aspect we felt was a plus. As to our demographics… we were planning on starting a family when I was around thirty and my husband roughly five years older than me. Both college educated and, at the time, middle class. For what it’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/25 "2014-01-03T18:26:38Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > Evelyn was a ‘male’ name? [Evelyn Waugh](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evelyn_Waugh), for example. Pronounced EEV-lin, I believe. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/26 "2014-01-03T18:49:04Z")
Don’t forget that Obama’s mother was named Stanley. Her father wanted a boy. But this certainly is a tendency for a name to start out as a male name and be used occasionally for females and then more and more until parents hesitate to use it for boys. The names Leslie and Randy have made this transition in my lifetime. FWIW, I prefer to use the old-fashioned traditional names. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/27 "2014-01-03T19:50:45Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I’m not going to say how recently I discovered that [Evelyn Waugh](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evelyn_Waugh) was a dude, because the shame might be too much to bear. I’ve always been amused by the fact his first wife was also named Evelyn. Their friends apparently used to call them He-Evelyn and She-Evelyn. I don’t understand how they could resist the urge to make it He-velyn and She-velyn. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/28 "2014-01-03T20:25:52Z")
Is it similar to the phenomenon of shortening female names into male names like Sam(antha), Chris(tine), Nic(ole) and so on? Just don’t name your daughter after a US state or a car, unless you want them to be a slut. ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/29 "2014-01-03T20:44:48Z")
> [@Blackberry](#): > > It’s really not that uncommon for boys to have names that are more commonly associated with girls though. I know/knew guys named Diamond, Ivy, Shannon, and Whitney (I know the last two started out as boy names but usually not anymore). Oh, and I knew of a Maylin and a Gaylin (I don’t know the spellings). GAYLIN. In some Scottish communities it is (was?) common for boys to be named Kelly, Laurie, Sandy, etc. There’s also a male Mexican (?) name “Susano” ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/30 "2014-01-03T22:08:12Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > But in a world where there are a kabillion “Mikes”, “Jasons”, “Jennifers”, and “Elizabeths”, any “different” kind of name–even a crazy one–is refeshing. IMHO. I’m named Elizabeth (shocker.) and I have never in my life met another Elizabeth. I’ve known a few people who have it as a middle name, and I’ve known a few Beths and Lizes (some who had the name Elizabeth and shortened it, but most didn’t). It’s almost never a character name on TV either. Have you met a lot of Elizabeths? Maybe it just isn’t common around here or something. Anyway, I’ve always liked it for that reason. It’s commonplace enough that people know what the name is and how to spell it, but not so common I ever had a classmate with the same name. ---
**Author:** ![gallows\_fodder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8c91f0/32.png) [@gallows\_fodder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gallows_fodder)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/31 "2014-01-03T22:09:30Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Just for the record, [fucking](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leone_Sextus_Tollemache) stupid names are not a new phenomenon. Same with [this guy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/States_Rights_Gist). ---
**Author:** ![tellyworth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@tellyworth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tellyworth)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/32 "2014-01-03T22:34:49Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Just for the record, [fucking](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leone_Sextus_Tollemache) stupid names are not a new phenomenon. The best part about that name is that “Tollemache” and “Tollemache” are pronounced differently. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/33 "2014-01-03T23:00:21Z")
> [@gracer](#): > > In Brazil, for an added example, you can almost divide names into two categories: 1) Biblical 2) Pretend English sounding. The pretend English sounding names are, I think, also a sort of way to increase social status. I suppose they’re considered cool. You get names like: Cleberson, Uderson, Everton, Werrington (this gets bonus points, Portuguese doesn’t have the letter W). > > I might be wrong about why those names are popular, it’s hard to say. There are lots of these in MMA. The Gracies have quite a few pseudo-English names. > [@msmith537](#): > > Just don’t name your daughter after a US state or a car, unless you want them to be a slut. Dakota Fanning turned out okay, but I get your point. But really, as alluded above, it’s also cause vs. effect: many people who will raise smart, non-trashy children think names of this type are retarded. > [@LC\_Strawhouse](#): > > In some Scottish communities it is (was?) common for boys to be named Kelly, Laurie, Sandy, etc. There’s also a male Mexican (?) name “Susano” [Susanoo](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susanoo) is a male Japanese god. And that’s roughly “susan-o” not “susan-ooh.” I made a thread awhile back asking if any female names ever became male. The consensus was, nobody knew of any examples. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/34 "2014-01-03T23:05:12Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > I made a thread awhile back asking if any female names ever became male. The consensus was, nobody knew of any examples. Douglas is the only example I know of (I read this in a thread here years ago). According to [Wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_(given_name)), it’s yet another surname-to-given name incident, but was initially more commonly a girls’ name. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2014, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/35 "2014-01-03T23:50:19Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > Douglas is the only example I know of (I read this in a thread here years ago). According to [Wiki](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_(given_name)), it’s yet another surname-to-given name incident, but was initially more commonly a girls’ name. Ah should’ve checked again, you’re right. Although that was a surname/clan name first as well. Anything with the dubh root sounds masculine, however/ ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2014, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/36 "2014-01-04T00:23:08Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > [Susanoo](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susanoo) is a male Japanese god. And that’s roughly “susan-o” not “susan-ooh.” > > I made a thread awhile back asking if any female names ever became male. The consensus was, nobody knew of any examples. Nope, there is definitely a Mexican male name “Susano”. [Here’s an example](https://www.greatgreenapple.com/garden_pond/ceramics/susano/index.shtml). “Above, Susano Lopez shows us a finished little pig, while his wife presses clay into the wooden molds that form the body.” ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2014, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/37 "2014-01-04T00:25:21Z")
> [@LC\_Strawhouse](#): > > Nope, there is definitely a Mexican male name “Susano”. [Here’s an example](https://www.greatgreenapple.com/garden_pond/ceramics/susano/index.shtml). “Above, Susano Lopez shows us a finished little pig, while his wife presses clay into the wooden molds that form the body.” Read again. I didn’t say there wasn’t. ---
**Author:** ![LC\_Strawhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@LC\_Strawhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LC_Strawhouse)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2014, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/38 "2014-01-04T00:29:13Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > Read again. I didn’t say there wasn’t. Not my area of expertise, but you’re confident it’s derived from a Japanese god instead of the common name Susanna? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2014, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/39 "2014-01-04T00:33:13Z")
> [@miss\_elizabeth](#): > > I’m named Elizabeth (shocker.) and I have never in my life met another Elizabeth. I’ve known a few people who have it as a middle name, and I’ve known a few Beths and Lizes (some who had the name Elizabeth and shortened it, but most didn’t). It’s almost never a character name on TV either. Have you met a lot of Elizabeths? Maybe it just isn’t common around here or something. > > Anyway, I’ve always liked it for that reason. It’s commonplace enough that people know what the name is and how to spell it, but not so common I ever had a classmate with the same name. Really? Off the top of my head I can name three Elizabeths, but I know there are a slew more in my history. According to this [site](http://www.babynames.com/name/Elizabeth), it’s currently ranked #10 for girl’s names. It highest prevalence appears to be in 1982, when it was #8. So if you were a kid of the 80s (like I was) or 90s, it would be quite probable you’d have multiple Elizabeths in your class. (One good thing about Elizabeth is that it is more conducive for shortening than either Jennifer or Jessica. Liz. Lizzy. Beth. Eliza. Versality in a name is good.) ---
**Author:** ![jabiru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bbce88/32.png) [@jabiru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jabiru)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2014, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803/40 "2014-01-04T00:45:02Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > Supposedly, the actress Michael Learned’s father was so sure he’d have a son that he named her before she was born. Hers was the first male-\>female name which made me go, what the?? Then Darryl Hannah came along and that kind of weirded me out as well. When we were in LA, over 30 years ago, there was a woman on the desk of the hotel where we stayed. Her name was the same as my baby son: Patrick. I’ve never met another female Patrick before or since. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-social-phenomenon-of-giving-girls-male-associated-names/677803.md?page=3)