# The society with the longest history of a middle class

**URL:** <https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-society-with-the-longest-history-of-a-middle-class/668432>\
**Category:** Factual Questions\
**Created:** [September 9, 2013, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-society-with-the-longest-history-of-a-middle-class/668432 "2013-09-09T20:13:08Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 4\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![IMfez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f07891/32.png) [@IMfez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IMfez)\
**Post date:** [September 9, 2013, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-society-with-the-longest-history-of-a-middle-class/668432/1 "2013-09-09T20:13:08Z")

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Hi, I’m curious what society has had the longest history of a substantial middle class. I’m guessing the UK?

Thanks

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**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\
**Post date:** [September 9, 2013, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-society-with-the-longest-history-of-a-middle-class/668432/2 "2013-09-09T20:25:16Z")

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I’d be more inclined to guess Scandinavia. They never had a real peasant class (bad climate for it) and the aristocracy never grew too powerful.

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**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\
**Post date:** [September 9, 2013, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-society-with-the-longest-history-of-a-middle-class/668432/3 "2013-09-09T20:37:08Z")

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I think you have to define what you mean by “middle class” before the question can make sense.

(Yes, yes, I know everyone thinks they know what the term means, but it’s one of those slippery phrases that can mean a dozen different things,and more when you are talking historically.)

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**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\
**Post date:** [September 9, 2013, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-society-with-the-longest-history-of-a-middle-class/668432/4 "2013-09-09T21:46:24Z")

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Right. Under some definitions all civilized societies have had substantial middle classes. Traders, merchants, artificers, shopkeepers, and others were needed to keep the population fed and clothed. Under some definitions a substantial middle class doesn’t exist until the 20th century. The farm population of the U.S. didn’t fall under 50% until 1880, and the majority of people in cities at that time were working class.

Unless you define both terms, no answer is possible.