# The Solyndra Scandal:Does It Have the Potential to Hurt Obama? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 15, 2011, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401 "2011-09-15T16:04:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2011, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/81 "2011-09-21T06:34:00Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > It will have staying power for those who are anti Obama types. The rest will shrug it off. It is background noise. Not much of a story. But you people desperately dredge up a non story and pretend it a big crisis. It is a familiar pattern that results in rightys talking to each other and congratulating themselves on some deluded victory where none exists. You might want to read the link in Post 62 and reevaluate, as some of your thinking around this issue is wrong. Not that I expect you will. ---
**Author:** ![obbn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d6d6ee/32.png) [@obbn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obbn)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2011, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/82 "2011-09-21T17:46:11Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > Sort of like Bush and Enron? And how exactly does this address the problem? Look, I get it, you hate Conservatives and you hate Bush. Does that have to make you blind to anything the current administration does? Are you so partisan that the current administration can do ANYTHING and you will find a way to defend it? Is it so hard to admit that Obama personally enodrsed this venture, it was the wrong thing to do and quite possibly was done as a political favor instead of a sound investment? Your views would carry a lot more weight if you actually called out your guy when he screws up. The whole “But Bush did it” is getting old. Either your Obama is Presidential material or he isn’t. If he is then he has to take the blame when he screws up. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/83 "2011-09-21T18:55:51Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#): > > Agreed. I don’t give a rat’s ass how we get the prices down on alternative power sources, so long as we do it quickly. The long term benefits of weaning ourselves off of petroleum far outweigh the cost. If we can do it here in America, great. If not, then it needs to happen anyway. It actually does make a pretty huge difference where solar technology is developed in determining where the solar industry will form and that will determine where all the dollars that used to go to oil will be diverted to. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2011, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/84 "2011-09-21T19:24:33Z")
> [@obbn](#): > > Your views would carry a lot more weight if you actually called out your guy when he screws up. The whole “But Bush did it” is getting old. Either your Obama is Presidential material or he isn’t. If he is then he has to take the blame when he screws up. This. When does the Statute of Limitations run on blaming former Presidents? I mean, in 2040 are we going to hear about how Democratic Presidents have ruled for the last 32 years of mayhem and runaway unemployment, but it was all Bush’s fault? Personally, I blame John Adams. This country hasn’t recovered from the Alien and Sedition Acts. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2011, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/85 "2011-09-21T19:42:55Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > This. When does the Statute of Limitations run on blaming former Presidents? It took Bush 8 years to make this mess, so Obama should get 8 years to blame things on him. Common sense. What **obbn** is complaining about is justifying things Obama does by pointing out that Bush did them, and the timer on that runs out the first day. However, calling people out for complaining about things Obama does despite not caring when Bush did them is perfectly kosher - for ever. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/86 "2011-09-22T18:20:33Z")
> [@obbn](#): > > And how exactly does this address the problem? Look, I get it, you hate Conservatives and you hate Bush. Does that have to make you blind to anything the current administration does? Are you so partisan that the current administration can do ANYTHING and you will find a way to defend it? Is it so hard to admit that Obama personally enodrsed this venture, it was the wrong thing to do and quite possibly was done as a political favor instead of a sound investment? > > Your views would carry a lot more weight if you actually called out your guy when he screws up. The whole “But Bush did it” is getting old. Either your Obama is Presidential material or he isn’t. If he is then he has to take the blame when he screws up. Because Bush wanted to make Ken Lay his fucking Treasury Secretary. Enron was a huge theft and everybody was being lied to by Lay and his staff. They had spent years creating a financial disaster. But he was deep inside the righties and the government. That was a disaster. Obama meant well. He actually tried to increase hiring and help develop a new industry. It was a half trillion. Sometimes businesses fail . But it was not a lying fiasco like Enron. The fund was set up to invest in green industries. Obama invested in it and it failed. I don’t see how that case is a determining factor in whether Obama is presidential or not I was unhappy with his reliance on Goldman people for government positions and for paying the thieving bankers 100 percent. I thought he handled the crisis with kid gloves instead of prosecuting the shit out of them. I was offended when he allowed the heads of the banks to get their usual bonuses from tax money after they failed miserably at their jobs. He was tough on the managers of the auto companies. But not the banking crooks. That has stuck with me ever since. Obama has been a disappointment in many ways. But Bush was a major league disaster. Not long after his election and his banking moves went on, I started a pitting against his policies. Most thought I was unfair and it was too soon. ---
**Author:** ![obbn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/d6d6ee/32.png) [@obbn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/obbn)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/87 "2011-09-22T19:19:37Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It took Bush 8 years to make this mess, so Obama should get 8 years to blame things on him. Common sense. > > What **obbn** is complaining about is justifying things Obama does by pointing out that Bush did them, and the timer on that runs out the first day. However, calling people out for complaining about things Obama does \*\*despite not caring when Bush did them is perfectly kosher \*\*- for ever. See, this is where you are 100% wrong. When Bush was in office there were plenty of things I took issue with. Unfortunately this was way before I found SD, so can’t give you an example. The point I am making is that it doesn’t matter what Bush, Carter, Lincoln or Washington did. They aren’t in office any longer and they aren’t controlling things. The only person who is responsible for the current decisions being made is the person who is currently in office. Blaming someone else shows a lack of maturity and an unwillingness to take responsibility. I sure wish I had someone to blame in life for all of my mistakes and failures. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/88 "2011-09-22T20:57:20Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It took Bush 8 years to make this mess, so Obama should get 8 years to blame things on him. Bush is not responsible for the Solyndra scandal. Obama is. The notion that "it’s Bush’s fault that we granted loans to a company that he turned down’ is more than mildly ridiculous. The companies in question were made a centerpiece of the _Obama_ approach to the economy. If Obama is going to point to the company and tell us how it is an example of how his approach is going to create lots of green jobs, and then the company goes under and we lose a thousand jobs, it is not legitimate to blame it on Bush. Bush did the opposite of what Obama did in this case - the Bush administration turned it down, the Obama administration granted it. See the difference? Certainly if TARP had turned out to be a huge loss for the country, instead of costing less than $25B, it would have been entirely appropriate to blame the failure on Bush. TARP was his baby. But TARP more or less succeeded, and Solyndra failed. So we hold the prime movers responsible, for failure or success, in each case. At least, I do. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/89 "2011-09-22T21:07:20Z")
Solyndra is not a big deal. Like I said earlier it will be jumped all over it by dead head rightys who are squirting in their jeans over a chance to scream at Obama. It is fading already and gets very little press. It is a lot of noise about nothing. (i don’t watch Fox, it may be a big deal there). The roughest treatment Obama received over it was by the Daly Show. A slightly left leaning show. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/90 "2011-09-22T22:06:47Z")
There, there, **gonzo** - I am sure if all the good little boys and girls who believe in fairies will clap their hands, all the mean ol’ facts will all go away. > [@](#): > > It is a lot of noise about nothing. Sure, sure - what’s a half a billion dollars and a thousand jobs, anyway? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/91 "2011-09-22T22:41:12Z")
Rep. Darrell Issa (R-CA) [seems to want to have it both ways](http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/182925-issa-saught-energy-department-loans-committee-now-investigating): > [@](#): > > “There’s been this attitude that somehow government can weigh in with loan guarantees and money and pick specific company winners and losers,” Issa said on C-SPAN earlier this week. “We see that as a back-door easy way to end up with corruption in government. But he didn’t feel that way in 2009: > [@](#): > > In a letter received by the department in January 2010, Issa asked Energy Secretary Steven Chu to grant a loan to Aptera Motors, a California-based electric car company. In November 2009, Donald R. Beall, who sits on the Aptera’s board of advisers and whose family’s foundation is one of the “angel investors” in the company, made a campaign donation to Issa of $250. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2011, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/92 "2011-09-22T23:59:06Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Funny how this tactic of inference and innuendo was invalid during the Bush years, but now it makes perfect sense to say that since we can’t prove it, Obama must be guilty. That made me laugh out loud. Shredding Bush was quite the sport when he was in office. > [@Bricker](#): > > I guess this will last (conditionally) until Jan 2013, and then once again it will be necessary to have rigorous proof before we say the President did something wrong. Is that about it? There’s no innuendo that Obama used this company as a backdrop for his pet projects nor is it innuendo that he wished to do so again or that it went down in flames soon after the loan was approved. He wanted to showcase the spending of $535 million dollars of tax money to prop up 1000 jobs. Since he wanted to showcase it, consider it showcased. People who’ve been unemployed for YEARS are tired of watching tax money thrown down a rat hole. $535,000 per job for a year is the legacy of what was suppose to be a win for President Obama. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/93 "2011-09-23T00:09:34Z")
> [@obbn](#): > > See, this is where you are 100% wrong. When Bush was in office there were plenty of things I took issue with. Unfortunately this was way before I found SD, so can’t give you an example. The point I am making is that it doesn’t matter what Bush, Carter, Lincoln or Washington did. They aren’t in office any longer and they aren’t controlling things. The only person who is responsible for the current decisions being made is the person who is currently in office. Blaming someone else shows a lack of maturity and an unwillingness to take responsibility. I sure wish I had someone to blame in life for all of my mistakes and failures. It doesn’t matter if you personally complained about Bush or not. The point is that the people now complaining about Obama generally didn’t. Arguing in terms of absolutes shows a lack of maturity and an unwillingness to accept reality. I’d like very much to hear how, say, the Iraq war is Obama’s fault. After all, we’re not allowed to blame Bush. That doesn’t mean everything can be blamed on Bush, of course, but lots of things can and should be. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/94 "2011-09-23T00:33:43Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > It doesn’t matter if you personally complained about Bush or not. The point is that the people now complaining about Obama generally didn’t. > > Arguing in terms of absolutes shows a lack of maturity and an unwillingness to accept reality. I’d like very much to hear how, say, the Iraq war is Obama’s fault. After all, we’re not allowed to blame Bush. > > That doesn’t mean everything can be blamed on Bush, of course, but lots of things can and should be. If only there was a giant database of information that we could search through and see what [Senator Obama said about troop withdrawal](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/30/AR2007013001586.html). “remove all combat brigades from Iraq by March 31, 2008”. And what did President Bush propose? “to deploy an additional 21,500 U.S. troops to curtail an increasingly virulent insurgency.” And what was President Obama’s plan after taking office? [“Send 30,000 new troops to Afghanistan.”](http://articles.latimes.com/2009/dec/01/world/la-fg-obama-afghanistan2-2009dec02) So either Senator Obama was a clueless git pulling promises out of his ass or he was lying to garner votes from his base. ---
**Author:** ![Algorithm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/algorithm/32/12204_2.png) [@Algorithm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algorithm)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/95 "2011-09-23T01:10:39Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > If only there was a giant database of information that we could search through and see what [Senator Obama said about troop withdrawal](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/30/AR2007013001586.html). “remove all combat brigades from Iraq by March 31, 2008”. > > And what did President Bush propose? “to deploy an additional 21,500 U.S. troops to curtail an increasingly virulent insurgency.” > > And what was President Obama’s plan after taking office? [“Send 30,000 new troops to Afghanistan.”](http://articles.latimes.com/2009/dec/01/world/la-fg-obama-afghanistan2-2009dec02) > > So either Senator Obama was a clueless git pulling promises out of his ass or he was lying to garner votes from his base. How is offering legislation to withdrawal from Iraq, then deploying troops to Afghanistan, a “lie”? ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/96 "2011-09-23T01:40:04Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > If only there was a giant database of information that we could search through and see what [Senator Obama said about troop withdrawal](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/01/30/AR2007013001586.html). “remove all combat brigades from Iraq by March 31, 2008”. > > And what did President Bush propose? “to deploy an additional 21,500 U.S. troops to curtail an increasingly virulent insurgency.” > > And what was President Obama’s plan after taking office? [“Send 30,000 new troops to Afghanistan.”](http://articles.latimes.com/2009/dec/01/world/la-fg-obama-afghanistan2-2009dec02) > > So either Senator Obama was a clueless git pulling promises out of his ass or he was lying to garner votes from his base. Obama the candidate explicitly said he would increase troops in Afghanistan. [Link (pdf)](http://obama.3cdn.net/36877a0c2d3f775f68_hauvmv61o.pdf) > [@](#): > > Redeploy American Troops to Afghanistan: Barack Obama will deploy at least an additional two brigades (7,000 personnel) of rested, trained American troops to Afghanistan to reinforce our counter-terrorism operations and support NATO’s efforts to fight the Taliban. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/97 "2011-09-23T01:55:46Z")
> [@Algorithm](#): > > How is offering legislation to withdrawal from Iraq, then deploying troops to Afghanistan, a “lie”? because they are the opposite of each other. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/98 "2011-09-23T02:30:23Z")
> [@obbn](#): > > The point I am making is that it doesn’t matter what Bush, Carter, Lincoln or Washington did. It doesn’t matter what WASHINGTON did? WTF? 😕 Washington defeated the British, and was present at the creation of the US Constitution. He’s practically Captain America (more like General America). Every president thereafter has been rather important in their own ways. One could say they mold reality itself, whether you like it or not! Subsequent Presidents always inhabit the milieux of their predecesors. ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/99 "2011-09-23T03:10:52Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > because they are the opposite of each other. Please explain further, because your comment seems moronic. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2011, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401/100 "2011-09-23T06:10:14Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > because they are the opposite of each other. Iraq and Afghanistan are _different countries_. We just happen[ed] to be dropping bombs on both. Weird, innit? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-solyndra-scandal-does-it-have-the-potential-to-hurt-obama/596401.md?page=6)