# The specific clusterfuck of discussing war plans over Signal, a consumer cellphone app **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [March 26, 2025, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157 "2025-03-26T21:01:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2025, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/281 "2025-05-01T17:26:04Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Yeah, I immediately assumed this was a direct result of the Signal issues. I saw some comments online that the real issue wasn’t compromising national security on Signal, but the fact that Waltz had _The Atlantic_ editor’s contact info on his phone in the first place. The commenter thought Trump didn’t care about the security leak, which has been hand-waved away. It was the potential “collaboration with the enemy” that was unforgivable–the media being the enemy. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2025, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/282 "2025-05-01T17:34:45Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > I saw some comments online that the real issue wasn’t compromising national security on Signal, but the fact that Waltz had _The Atlantic_ editor’s contact info on his phone in the first place. To me it’s all part of the same scandal. Trump may feel differently, but I’m sure Trump and I disagree on a great many things. ---
**Author:** ![Pardel-Lux](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pardel-lux/32/20182_2.png) [@Pardel-Lux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pardel-Lux)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2025, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/283 "2025-05-01T17:38:01Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > Signalgate only blew up on March 24th, so there were only 38 days since then, and even fewer since we found out who it was who really screwed it up. You’re right, I counted too generously. So 3.8 Scaramacchiatos is a loooong time. It gets weirder and funnier the more you think about it. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2025, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/284 "2025-05-01T18:12:11Z")
It’s more than 1 news cycle, which is more or less the attention span in the White House these days, and therefore the only attention span that exists in their minds ---
**Author:** ![Frazzled](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frazzled/32/3368_2.png) [@Frazzled](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frazzled)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2025, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/285 "2025-05-01T19:18:41Z")
3.8 Scaramacchiatos. Not Great, Not Terrible. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2025, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/286 "2025-05-02T18:10:18Z")
Another followup-apparently Walz also looked at Signal during Cabinet meetings. I guess that’s better than cuddling up to Trump during that time. > **[Trump Official Caught Using App Even Less Secure Than Signal](https://newrepublic.com/post/194767/trump-official-mike-waltz-app-less-secure-signal)** > > Mike Waltz just keeps making things worse for himself. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2025, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/287 "2025-05-02T18:15:11Z")
How does Putin find the time to look over all the [SIGINT](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signals_intelligence) they’re sending him? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2025, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/288 "2025-05-02T18:47:46Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Walz Mike Wal **t** z. If Tim Walz was in Trump’s cabinet meetings, I’m sure we’d know about it. 😆 ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2025, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/289 "2025-05-02T18:53:06Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > If Tim Walz was in Trump’s cabinet meetings, I’m sure we’d know about it. I’m picturing a new political cartoon. Tim Walz sitting in one of Trump’s cabinet meetings, wondering “How did I get invited to this?” ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2025, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/290 "2025-05-02T18:53:59Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > Tim Walz sitting in one of Trump’s cabinet meetings, wondering “How did I get invited to this?” Trump: “Get out!!!” “…Leave the hot dish though.” ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2025, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/291 "2025-05-02T18:55:32Z")
What would be funnier, his name on the place card being “Tim Waltz” or “Mike Walz”? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2025, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/292 "2025-05-06T12:33:33Z")
Tangentially related, but equally bad: > **[Messaging app used by Trump official suspends operations after reported hack](https://www.cnbc.com/2025/05/05/signal-telemessage-hack-trump-waltz.html)** > > Trump previously discouraged his officials from using Signal following "Signalgate," when Mike Waltz added a journalist to a private chat of pending war plans. > [@](#): > > **KEY POINTS:** > > - The messaging app seen being used by President Donald Trump’s former national security advisor, Michael Waltz, is temporarily suspending services following a reported hack. > - “Out of an abundance of caution, all TeleMessage services have been temporarily suspended,” a spokesperson for TeleMessage’s parent company, Smarsh, said. > - A recent photo of Waltz indicated he was communicating on TeleMessage with Vice President JD Vance, Secretary of State Marco Rubio, director of national intelligence Tulsi Gabbard and special envoy Steve Witkoff. Might be time to resurrect the OG secure communications method: > **[Tin can telephone](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tin_can_telephone)** > > A tin can phone is a type of acoustic (non-electrical) speech-transmitting device made up of two tin cans, paper cups or similarly shaped items attached to either end of a taut string or wire. > It is a particular case of mechanical telephony, where sound (i.e., vibrations in the air) is converted into vibrations along a liquid or solid medium. These vibrations are transmitted through the medium (string) and then converted back to sound. > Before the invention of the electromagnetic telephone, ther... ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2025, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/293 "2025-05-06T12:54:42Z")
This post confused me, as i am a regular Signal user (since the first Trump presidency, maybe longer) and it’s still working fine. So, apparently, they aren’t actually using Signal, but an Israeli-branded reskin of Signal?? I can’t imagine any problems with that. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2025, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/294 "2025-05-06T12:57:21Z")
I think this article sheds more light on the specifics: > **[Phone app Mike Waltz was photographed using is investigating a hack | CNN...](https://www.cnn.com/2025/05/05/politics/telemessage-hack-mike-waltz-signal)** > > A phone app that Mike Waltz, President Donald Trump’s former national security adviser, apparently used to save his text messages has temporarily suspended its services as it investigates a cybersecurity incident, a spokesperson for the app’s parent... > [@](#): > > A phone app that Mike Waltz, President Donald Trump’s former national security adviser, apparently used to save his text messages has temporarily suspended its services as it investigates a cybersecurity incident, a spokesperson for the app’s parent company told CNN on Monday. > > TeleMessage, which makes software for preserving and organizing messages sent via Signal and other mobile apps, is responding to a “recent security incident” and has hired an external cybersecurity firm to help investigate, a spokesperson for Oregon-based digital communications firm Smarsh told CNN. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2025, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/295 "2025-05-06T13:56:32Z")
Makes me wonder if Waltz was using TeleMessage to somehow comply with the Federal Records Act to preserve government records or not. I thought the appeal of Signal was that it would delete the texts sent on it so there wouldn’t be a record of what the Trumpsters were up to. Maybe some of them want a record of the texts, but not an official one. Leverage for later use, maybe? I don’t know that much about Waltz. Is he a “relatively normal” Republican in the administration or more of an incompetent MAGA ball-nuzzler like Hegseth or Lutnick? I don’t think he’s in the Stephen Miller category of an evil éminence grise. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2025, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/296 "2025-05-06T20:14:22Z")
It’s possible that Signal is blocked on the official phones (because you can delete history), but TeleMessage is allowed, because it preserves history? So, they use Signal inside TM. Just guessing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157.md?page=14)