# The specific clusterfuck of discussing war plans over Signal, a consumer cellphone app **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [March 26, 2025, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157 "2025-03-26T21:01:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/161 "2025-03-31T15:59:48Z")
yeah … seems like the DEMs don’t want to hurt the GOP/trusk more than what is fair… we need to understand that. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/162 "2025-03-31T16:44:18Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > So, that’s it. This particular clusterfuck is off the front page and no one will be investigated Yup. > [@steronz](#): > > And second, they know that nobody has to take the fall. They can just lie and lie and in 2 days Trump will do something even more outrageous and we’ll have no choice but to move on. But in the process, even a lot of conflicted conservatives (based on reddit comments) eventually came to some level of “this isn’t as bad as it first looked.” Norms and standards continue to erode. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/163 "2025-03-31T16:48:51Z")
You’d think some generals or former generals would continue to make a fuss about the complete lack of operational security and putting soldiers or airmen or whatever in danger, but nope. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/164 "2025-03-31T17:13:14Z")
I guess I’m an optimist. I don’t think this is actually over. Even if it’s no longer on the front page. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/165 "2025-03-31T17:16:09Z")
I’d like to be an optimist, but after seeing AG, Pam Bondi – in response to a question about whether or not this incident will result in DoJ investigations – quite literally reply with “WHAT ABOUT HILLARY?? WHAT ABOUT BIDEN???” That stanched my optimism a bit 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/166 "2025-03-31T17:21:11Z")
At least _Saturday Night Live_ referenced it multiple times last weekend. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/167 "2025-03-31T17:30:05Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > I’d like to be an optimist, but after seeing AG, Pam Bondi – in response to a question about whether or not this incident will result in DoJ investigations – quite literally reply with “WHAT ABOUT HILLARY?? WHAT ABOUT BIDEN???” Some talking head pointed out that Bondi immediately referenced the Obama admin with Clinton’s emails/server and the Biden admin with the classified docs in his garage but, for some reason, skipped over the admin in-between those two that had reams of classified docs in a personal residence that is also accessible to certain segments of the public and was bragging about/showing them off. I’m sure it just slipped Bondi’s mind, right? ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/168 "2025-03-31T17:38:14Z")
Bondi – like all the others – is deeply committed to the administration’s ultimate philosophy of cynicism and knows what you and I know: with Trump supporters, it’s what they DON’T know that leads them to BE Trump supporters. We also know that the truth about Trump is worse than even their endless lies about the Democrats. But the information silos in which the Trump supporters largely exist are profound and quite impregnable. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/169 "2025-03-31T18:10:08Z")
Some Republicans are still calling it out as a huge mistake, but none of them are saying that Waltz or “Kegseth” should be fired or resign (unsurprisingly). ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/170 "2025-03-31T18:33:37Z")
It’s more than a mistake, though, of course. It’s a horrific breach of security, and it also makes it evident that the administration is routinely breaking the law when it comes to records retention. Has it been determined yet whether they were on their secure work phones or their (probably compromised) personal phones? I know that Gabbard refused to answer the question, making it seem to me that she was on her personal phone. If that’s the case, it makes it more likely that they all were, since I imagine they would have her work contact on their work phone. At least, that’s how it works for me. But, we’ll never know. There will never be Benghazi-style hearings, no DoJ investigation, absolutely nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Zoobi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/13edae/32.png) [@Zoobi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoobi)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2025, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/171 "2025-03-31T21:26:54Z")
Of course it’s over. This was the clear outcome within hours when the Republican response was released. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2025, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/172 "2025-04-01T07:55:40Z")
> [@Zoobi](#): > > This was the clear outcome within hours This was the clear outcome within minutes of the first article being published. Did anyone here seriously think these people would ever be held accountable? Our hope is that this might affect the overall support of the Trump Cult in the population at large. After January 6, it should be clear that Republican officials will never hold any of their own accountable. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/173 "2025-04-04T16:33:26Z")
I’d like to nominate my pick for the next acting Inspector General to be fired: > **[Pentagon watchdog launches probe of Hegseth Signal messages | CNN Politics](https://www.cnn.com/2025/04/03/politics/hegseth-pentagon-watchdog-signal-probe/index.html)** > > The acting Inspector General of the Defense Department will review Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth’s use of Signal in a group chat with other key national security officials to discuss military strikes against the Houthis in Yemen last month, the... > The acting Inspector General of the Defense Department will review Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth’s use of Signal in a group chat with other key national security officials to discuss military strikes against the Houthis in Yemen last month, the IG’s office announced on Thursday. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/174 "2025-04-04T16:35:16Z")
Well, unless it’s planned as a whitewash so Trump can crow about it. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/175 "2025-04-04T16:40:18Z")
That’s definitely a possibility. I’m trying to recall if he ever pulled a move like that. I can’t think of one. I think the factor that, IMHO, militates against that is that it would be tantamount to admitting _the possibility of_ wrongdoing. That, to me, seems very off-brand for Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/176 "2025-04-04T17:27:22Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > That’s definitely a possibility. I’m trying to recall if he ever pulled a move like that. I can’t think of one. Yeah; Trump ordered plenty of investigations, like an insane amount of them, but they were all against his perceived enemies or for grievances he had (like the idea that he lost the popular vote in 2016 due to illegal immigrant voting). Trump would never order an investigation to try to appear fair and impartial. He doesn’t give a shit about that. He thinks that doing something like that is to admit weakness. Like any bully, he has to keep up a brave and aggressive front without apologies at all times to cover up what a coward he is. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/177 "2025-04-04T18:23:37Z")
> [@DavidNRockies](#): > > I’m trying to recall if he ever pulled a move like that. I can’t think of one. I think it would be more akin to the example of the Mueller report where the results were publically spun by Barr to make Trump look good (or not so bad) before the report was available. I seem to recall polls showing a lot of voters believed the report exonerated Trump and probably reinforced his “Russia Russia Russia witchhunt” narrative in their minds. Sorta like how not many see the correction on page 25 of a blockbuster newspaper headline that’s published a week later. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/178 "2025-04-04T18:29:37Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > I think it would be more akin to the example of the Mueller report where the results were publically spun by Barr to make Trump look good (or not so bad) before the report was available. But that investigation wasn’t prompted by Trump. In fact, Trump griped about Mueller frequently, and tried to have the investigation stopped. > **[Trump tried to stop Mueller investigation, but staff wouldn't let him, says...](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/trump-tried-to-stop-mueller-investigation-but-staff-wouldnt-let-him-says-report)** > > With a redacted version of the special counsel’s report public, President Trump is again claiming vindication. In fact, Robert Mueller's findings document extensive contacts between the Trump campaign and Russian operatives, as well as attempts to... Yes, they tried to spin it as a win for Trump, making lemonade from lemons. But it wasn’t like Trump orchestrated it to clear his name. He hated it. Remember that for Trump, an investigation’s purpose is to punish the person being investigated. That’s what he uses investigations for. He never wants to be the target of one, and if he orders one it’s to punish someone. If Trump is behind the investigation of Hegseth, it would be because Pete pissed him off. (Not that it’s a stretch for such a thing to happen, but I don’t think Trump would do that while also publicly defending him; Trump isn’t nearly that sly or clever.) ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/179 "2025-04-04T18:33:29Z")
I get that, but it still seems _highly_ unlikely to me. Trump wanted nothing to do with the Mueller investigation, openly and brazenly fired Comey and McCabe, and decried this investigation at every opportunity. He further tried to have McGahn remove Mueller as Special Counsel. The Bill Barr “summary” struck me as a desperation ploy – a _reaction_ to something over which he couldn’t successfully exert control. He has control over whether or not this Signal chat is investigated – maybe not ‘properly,’ but … ETA: Crap. Ninja’d _only because_ I declined that second cup of coffee this morning. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2025, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157/180 "2025-04-04T19:22:54Z")
All I’m saying, as a response to “planned as a whitewash so Trump can crow about it”, is that even if an investigation isn’t planned as a whitewash and a DoD IG found something watchdogable, and it seems likely that an actual independent IG would, findings will be whitewashed like Barr did with the Mueller Report as an example. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-specific-clusterfuck-of-discussing-war-plans-over-signal-a-consumer-cellphone-app/1016157.md?page=10)