# The stupid: Aus local council fines 'rough sleepers' **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 13, 2025, 7:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319 "2025-05-13T07:49:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/21 "2025-05-13T21:34:44Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Disagree, the punishment part is the ignored consequence of their goal of making the homeless leave. They just want them to be someone else’s problem. That is a pretty common view for home/property owners vs. the homeless. As is malice. In this sort of class war hurting people is typically one of the central _goals,_ not just a tactic. That’s why there’s not even at attempt to actually fix the problem, they don’t _want_ to fix the problem; they want to _hurt_ poor people as much as they think they can get away with. Punching down is fun and validating for a lot of people. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/22 "2025-05-13T21:36:43Z")
**Bullshit**. Most people don’t want to hurt others, they just don’t want to deal with it. More apathy then animosity. But you always take the worse view of people on everything anyway. So no surprise. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/23 "2025-05-13T21:42:09Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Most people don’t want to hurt others, they just don’t want to deal with it. “Most people” don’t need to in order to cause plenty of suffering. And a large percentage of the population _does_ want that and that’s more than enough. I’d say “most”, but even a minority would be enough. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/24 "2025-05-13T21:55:30Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Most people don’t want to hurt others, they just don’t want to deal with it. More apathy then animosity. This Australian council chose punishment to induce homeless to go away. They could have chosen a carrot, but they chose a stick. It’s that choice that indicates that punishment is one of their goals. Maybe the voters (still not clear if an Australian council is elected or appointed) are apathetic, but the council is can’t claim apathy when they instituted fines. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/25 "2025-05-13T21:58:52Z")
I never said the council did, I was following a different thread in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2025, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/26 "2025-05-13T22:00:40Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > That’s why there’s not even at attempt to actually fix the problem, they don’t _want_ to fix the problem; … Tell it. The same thing happens here when the owners of factories that employ migrants are _never_ prosecuted for breaking the law, even as migrant employees are being dragged out in handcuffs. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/27 "2025-05-14T04:55:34Z")
Local councils are elected, and same as Federal and State elections, voting is compulsory. Once upon a time local councillors were not party affiliated (as such) but were instead business-people or folks involved in the local community as advocates for various causes. Nowadays though, they tend to be aligned with either the major parties (Labor, Liberal, Greens) or with some of the more fringe parties. ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/28 "2025-05-14T10:17:57Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > I’m reminded of how San Fransisco tried to drive out the homeless by making public restrooms inaccessible, which just resulted in human waste all over since surprise; biology is biology and people don’t stop producing waste just because you ban them from the proper disposal facilities. I’m reminded of how, in the 1970s, after several years of crying Indians and Woodsy Owl doing softshoe in PSAs, the US discovered that the solution to the littering problem was (_OMG_!) public trashcans! People _wanted_ to throw away their trash, and were perfectly willing not to litter, they just needed somewhere to put the trash. I also remember those few intermediate years that only people who lived them in a city seem to know about, when merchants put up signs in the windows that their trashcans were for customers only, because people kept stopping in asking to use the trashcan. They were trying not to litter, but could not find places for their trash other than their pockets-- OK if you had Jelly beans-- not so great if you had a ice cream sandwich, and impossible if you had a Coke. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/29 "2025-05-14T12:20:28Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Most people don’t want to hurt others, they just don’t want to deal with it. The right wing these days sees the desperately poor as freeloaders, and thieves, choosing to take from people who work hard rather than support themselves. I don’t doubt for a second that at least some members of the Council who voted for this see the homeless as bad actors, people who are, by their own laziness, making the city of Gold Coast a worse place to live. In that light, the homeless deserve punishment for the bad things they’re doing to the productive residents of the city. If someone made the city worse by throwing their trash on the street, we wouldn’t be buying up carrots to encourage them to be tidy, you pick up a stick and hit them with it. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/30 "2025-05-14T15:04:21Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > It sounds like the standard idea that “if we punish homeless people they will no longer exist”. Sounds like a good plan. Make it so people stop choosing to be homeless 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/31 "2025-05-14T15:07:03Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Make it so people stop choosing to be homeless 🙄 [![](https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2014-05/enhanced/webdr07/21/19/anigif_original-grid-image-25630-1400714096-13.gif) ](https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2014-05/enhanced/webdr07/21/19/anigif_original-grid-image-25630-1400714096-13.gif) To be fair, some people _do_ say when asked that they choose to be homeless, but that’s a statistically insignificant amount. And honestly, when people say they want to be homeless, I don’t think they mean it literally. I believe that it’s because they’ve had bad experiences with shelters, or there are other problems that are associated with the struggle to maintain housing that they stop trying. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/32 "2025-05-14T16:28:42Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > To be fair, some people _do_ say when asked that they choose to be homeless, but that’s a statistically insignificant amount. I was being sarcastic. In my experience some people do want to be homeless but they are usually dealing with mental illness so how much of a free choice is it really? ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/33 "2025-05-14T16:52:32Z")
I always feel sorry for their dogs. (I know the adults and kid humans need help too. As pet owners ourselves it _can_ be tricky to keep a dog healthy in a homed and safe place, well fed and vetted. The amimals have no choice or voice) ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2025, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/34 "2025-05-14T17:09:20Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > In my experience some people do want to be homeless but they are usually dealing with mental illness so how much of a free choice is it really? I’m sure that happens. Or someone with an addiction who won’t stay at a shelter or low income housing because they will get kicked out if they’re caught using drugs. They “choose” to be homeless because their addiction is making those choices for them. > [@Beckdawrek](#): > > I always feel sorry for their dogs. That always reminds me of this bit from the late Norm Macdonald. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/i4gUe6sgP2I/maxresdefault.jpg "Homeless Bum") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i4gUe6sgP2I) (Just the opening part of that clip, it goes on to other jokes Norm made about homeless people. But I’m just referring to the first bit.) ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2025, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319/35 "2025-06-11T20:51:25Z")
There’s an old saying: Everybody’s got to be someplace. If your answer to where should they go is “Anywhere but here.” you’re not trying to solve the problem. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-stupid-aus-local-council-fines-rough-sleepers/1018319.md?page=1)