# The Top 25 Pop Icons **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 23, 2003, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463 "2003-07-23T19:12:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Isabelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b5a626/32.png) [@Isabelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isabelle)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2003, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/1 "2003-07-23T19:12:10Z")
Who do you think should make the list of Pop Icons? Lucille Ball Madonna Princess Diana Elton John Prince William who else? ---
**Author:** ![Wolverine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ba9def/32.png) [@Wolverine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolverine)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2003, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/2 "2003-07-23T19:37:45Z")
Is it considered spoilers if you go to VH1’s website and see who number one is? If so then I hid the top 3 in the spoiler box. [spoiler]3. Elvis Presley 2.Superman 1. Oprah Winfrey[/spoiler] My top 3 is Elvis, The Beatles, and Steven Spielberg ---
**Author:** ![Isabelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b5a626/32.png) [@Isabelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isabelle)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2003, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/3 "2003-07-23T19:44:08Z")
I didn’t know VH1 had a Pop Icon website. WOW great minds think alike. I liked the spoilers. I would have never thought of them. I think Pope John Paul should be one too ---
**Author:** ![Wolverine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ba9def/32.png) [@Wolverine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolverine)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2003, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/4 "2003-07-23T19:53:12Z")
Yeah, VH1 is in the middle of airing a ten part look at the 200 greatest pop cultural icons. I don’t think they’ve aired the bottom 100 (or top 100 considering your point of view) yet, so I don’t want to spoil it. Though they are already posted on their website, so it really isn’t spoiler material. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2003, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/5 "2003-07-24T02:23:48Z")
[trekker] James Kirk and maybe Spock should be on there. Darth Vader too. [/trekker] ---
**Author:** ![HelloKitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecccb3/32.png) [@HelloKitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HelloKitty)\ **Post date:** [July 24, 2003, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/6 "2003-07-24T02:54:20Z")
Elvis Marilyn Monroe The Beatles ---
**Author:** ![wolf\_meister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolf_meister/32/15202_2.png) [@wolf\_meister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolf_meister)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/7 "2003-07-25T00:44:51Z")
**Frank Sinatra** should be there too. Otherwise I totally agree with Marilyn, Elvis and the Beatles. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/8 "2003-07-25T00:57:17Z")
Top icons of what? Current? 20th century? The millennium? I’d say any list of 20th-century pop icons would have to include Mary Pickford, Charlie Chaplin, Betty Boop, Kilroy, the Gibson Girl, Rosie the Riveter, Garbo, Clark Gable, Krazy Kat, the Ziegfeld and/or Florodora Girls . . . were _any_ of them mentioned by VH1? ---
**Author:** ![Bugnorton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bugnorton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bugnorton)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/9 "2003-07-25T01:10:35Z")
Eve, so far, I’ve only noticed Clark Gable on the list (and that was with Vivien Leigh as part of a super couple)…um, anybody remember a couple of folks named Carole Lombard and Laurence Olivier who just might have been a better pairing for those two, respectively, as the other half of their super coupledom? Sorry, but IMO, #1 & #2 are just plain _ **wrong** _. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/10 "2003-07-25T01:46:25Z")
Prince William? You mean that kid in England? Hey, **Eve**! Don’t forget Al Jolson…and Bing Crosby. ---
**Author:** ![capacitor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e47774/32.png) [@capacitor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capacitor)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2003, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/11 "2003-07-25T07:38:40Z")
First woman self-made billionaire…I see no problem. ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/12 "2003-07-26T02:54:20Z")
I agree with the Beatles, Elvis, and Marilyn Monroe (in that order) as top 3. But I take serious issue with much of [VH1’s Top 200 Pop Culture Icons.](http://www.vh1.com/shows/dyn/the_greatest/68029/episode_wildcard.jhtml?wildcard=/shows/dynamic/includes/wildcards/the_greatest/200_greatest_icons/ranked_list/181_200_aux.jhtml&event_id=865274rl) Don’t get me started as to who _shouldn’t_ be on the list (or who should have been ranked higher or lower), but here’s who I think should have been on but were left out: Humphrey Bogart Milton Berle Charles Lindberg Shirley Temple Bela Lugosi (as Dracula) Boris Karloff (as Frankenstein) Marlon Brando Lenny Bruce George Carlin The Marx Brothers Monty Python Peter Sellers Chuck Berry The Who Donny Osmond Howdy Doody Dr. Suess Walt Disney Snoopy (along with Charlie Brown who was #104) Timothy Leary Carl Sagan Ann Landers and Dear Abby Fred Astaire Cary Grant Walter Cronkite Raquel Welch Rocky & Bullwinkle Mind you, I’m still only in my 30’s, so I’m not some cranky old geezer pining for the lame old days, but you get impression the VH1 polled hight schools or something. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/13 "2003-07-26T03:06:59Z")
Oh, _well_, after linking to the VH1 site, I can see how Justin Timberlake is a much more important 20th-century figure then, say, Rudolph Valentino, and Mariah Carey is _leagues_ ahead of Mary Pickford . . . [**Eve** rolls her eyes so violently that they fall out and the cats bat them around on the floor] ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/14 "2003-07-26T04:10:05Z")
I don’t know who’s #2, but #1 is Elvis Presley and it’s not even a close call. Citing a Top Three is silly; there’s Elvis, and then there’s a cluster of people below him. Marilyn, Oprah, Madonna et al. aren’t even in his zip code. Presley was THE first superstar. “Superstar” begins with him, and he’s as dead as a doornail and he’s still a superstar. Does anyone here think that hundreds of thousands of people will be visiting Oprah Winfrey’s home every single year 25 years after she croaks? Neither do I. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/15 "2003-07-26T04:49:29Z")
Humphrey freakin’ _Bogart_ isn’t on that list? :eek: Neither is Bing Crosby? Fah! :waves hand dismissively: ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/16 "2003-07-26T16:07:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RickJay \* > \*\*Presley was THE first superstar. “Superstar” begins with him, and he’s as dead as a doornail and he’s still a superstar. Does anyone here think that hundreds of thousands of people will be visiting Oprah Winfrey’s home every single year 25 years after she croaks? Neither do I. \*\* Ummm, Mary Pickford? Charles Dickens? Charlie Chaplin? Lillian Russell? Jenny Lind? These people were _world_-famous before there was TV. There were “superstars” before Elvis. ---
**Author:** ![Wumpus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8c91f0/32.png) [@Wumpus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wumpus)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/17 "2003-07-26T17:39:17Z")
Any list that has Monica Lewinsky on it is well worth ignoring. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/18 "2003-07-26T17:59:09Z")
To back **Eve** up (even though I know she hates him), I’ve read that Chaplin was the first human being in history who would have been recognized nearly anywhere on the globe. (Assuming he showed up in costume, of course.) There were African tribal villages, Tibetan monasteries, Amazonian rain forests, etc., where his comedies were shipped during the teens and twenties, and projected onto strung-up bedsheets for the amusement of the locals. ---
**Author:** ![TeaElle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8491ac/32.png) [@TeaElle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TeaElle)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/19 "2003-07-26T18:07:32Z")
**Wumpus** took the words right out of my mouth. The presence of Lewinsky invalidates the entire list for me. Of course, these lists went right out the window for me with the 100 Greatest Women of Rock. Seminal artists were subjugated for people like Beyonce and Alanis Morissette and the agenda was so overwhelming that it was painful to watch. Why is VH1 attempting to define our culture for us, anyway? It seems like they’re doing a Top 100 Whatever list every month. We’re going to love who we love, remember who we remember, enjoy the songs we enjoy. Why can’t Viacom trust its viewers to know their own minds instead of force-feeding their opinion so blatantly? Eventually this cancer is going to spread to CBS and there’ll be a 60 Minutes branded countdown of the “most important events in history” with a top 10 that’s nothing but contemporary events which have had far less impact on the world as a whole as countless others, but come on, how could the signing of the Magna Carte be more important than the OKC bombing? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2003, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463/20 "2003-07-26T18:08:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eve \* > \*\*Ummm, Mary Pickford? Charles Dickens? Charlie Chaplin? Lillian Russell? Jenny Lind? These people were _world_-famous before there was TV. There were “superstars” before Elvis. \*\* No, Eve, I simply do not agree. Elvis Presley became a superstar at a level way, way above those people; his stardom redefined the term, even more so than Charlie Chaplin (and I sincerely doubt that 90% of the population even remembers who Jenny Lind or Lillian Russell were - but I assure you most will know who Elvis is in 50-100 years.) Presley is the absolute, no-questions asked #1 pop star of all time. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-top-25-pop-icons/190463.md?page=2)