# The tree of liberty needs to be watered with the blood of school children **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 15, 2018, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854 "2018-02-15T02:32:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/201 "2018-02-16T22:37:14Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > We must repeal it because we cannot have reasonable regulation with it. The gun-lovers have removed the middle ground and given us the choice: “all or nothing”. So I choose “nothing”: **Repeal the Second Amendment**. > > We already have guns for everyone–that’s the status quo. > > Yes, the goal is to change the mind of Americans who don’t want to see it repealed. I was one of them until yesterday. The gun-lovers have given us their ultimatum: any gun regulation is a slippery slope to a complete gun ban. Okay then: let’s slide. **Repeal the Second Amendment.** There it is. The middle ground is already gone. It’s one hell of a note. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/202 "2018-02-16T22:38:34Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > [Moderating] > Don’t call other posters “mother fuckers.” > > No warning issued. > [/Moderating] Sorry. Is “fucktard” permitted? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/203 "2018-02-16T22:41:34Z")
How in the world does anyone expect to repeal the 2nd Amendment when the very reason gun control efforts fail to begin with is that so much of the populace is opposed to it? ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/204 "2018-02-16T22:46:50Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > How in the world does anyone expect to repeal the 2nd Amendment when the very reason gun control efforts fail to begin with is that so much of the populace is opposed to it? Fucking bullets man. The right bullet in the right place and even a cow plays chess. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/205 "2018-02-16T22:49:54Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Fucking bullets man. The right bullet in the right place and even a cow plays chess. I was always pro-gun, pro 2nd Amendment, blah blah rights blah blah. I think my posting history will bear that out. I’ve owned guns. But Christ On A Cracker. **Enough is enough.** ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/206 "2018-02-16T23:07:46Z")
My semi-facetious idea to guarantee that gun control is established in the US; every Muslim in America should run out and get heavily armed, especially with sem-automatic weapons. In states where it’s legal, they should add shooting ranges to the mosques and Islamic Centers. And Muslim women in America should carry AR-15 weapons below their hijabs, again where this is legal. The idea is to see if people’s irrational fear of Muslims will overcome their irrational fear of gun control. And there’s precedent; after the Black Panthers in California exercised their second amendment rights in 1967 or so, the state of California (with Ronald Reagan as governor) passed gun control legislation. I think the NRA was even on board. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/207 "2018-02-16T23:09:12Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Sorry. Is “fucktard” permitted? Not just permitted, required. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/208 "2018-02-16T23:37:59Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Wow, that’s an old board reference. What name were you using back then? Ah the Grapeist? I don’t know how I stumbled on a post that had been Graped. I just thought it was funny how serious the board took his/her transgressions. It was like how dare someone bring levity to these sacred halls. Anyways, I wasn’t using any name in that era since I wasn’t posting on these boards then. It’s amazing what’s saved on the internet though. Can you imagine with how nasty and deranged the current pit people are how actually posting your real photo would go in today’s environment? It would be legitimately dangerous. I try not to post too much information that a diabolically clever person could use. Especially since it isn’t beyond some of these people’s sense of morality to dox or swat. It’s a shame actually. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/209 "2018-02-16T23:49:45Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > [Moderating] > Don’t call other posters “mother fuckers.” > > No warning issued. > [/Moderating] Pardon me if I’m overstepping my bounds here, commenting on a moderation, but I think it’s awesome that you included a space in there just like SteveG1 did. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2018, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/210 "2018-02-16T23:57:09Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Ah the Grapeist? I don’t know how I stumbled on a post that had been Graped. I just thought it was funny how serious the board took his/her transgressions. It was like how dare someone bring levity to these sacred halls. > > Anyways, I wasn’t using any name in that era since I wasn’t posting on these boards then. It’s amazing what’s saved on the internet though. Can you imagine with how nasty and deranged the current pit people are how actually posting your real photo would go in today’s environment? It would be legitimately dangerous. I try not to post too much information that a diabolically clever person could use. Especially since it isn’t beyond some of these people’s sense of morality to dox or swat. It’s a shame actually. The Grapist lasted less than a day and posted probably only a dozen times. I, too, find it odd that you stumbled on his posts despite (you claim) not being a member of the board back then. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/211 "2018-02-17T00:00:17Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > How in the world does anyone expect to repeal the 2nd Amendment when the very reason gun control efforts fail to begin with is that so much of the populace is opposed to it? “So much” meaning “less than half”? I don’t expect anyone to repeal the second amendment. That would be _way_ too reasonable and rational a thing to do, and the NRA and its foreign backers would never allow it. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/212 "2018-02-17T00:01:57Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > The Grapist lasted less than a day and posted probably only a dozen times. I, too, find it odd that you stumbled on his posts despite (you claim) not being a member of the board back then. I don’t care what you think is odd. I also read some words such as agricola, pulchritudo, and et. But guess what? I wasn’t chilling with Hannibal or Caesar. Funny what things called “books” and Google let you read from a time called the “past.” :eek::eek::eek::eek: Googling grapist and straight dope you see his/her posts from 2003. You know more about the Grapist than I, yet you came 6 years later? By your own logic you are a sock. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/213 "2018-02-17T00:12:02Z")
> [@B-Rad](#): > > But since it’s not the guns that are the problem nearly as much as what comes out of them, I think it’d be a good step to treat them like cars. Need a license to operate one and to buy ammunition, and that license requires periodic inspections of the storage site (gun safe or equivalent, to ensure only authorized users have access). And just as a traffic cop can initiate a license suspension if you appear to require a retest (because you’ve become blind or senile since the your license was last issued), the gun police can likewise have you reevaluated for licensure if they think you, or something in your recent past, is suggestive of your being muy loco. Who pays for it? I dunno, who pays for the emergency calls, building repair, and medical/funeral costs associated with massacres? And besides, the DMV gets funding somehow, just repurpose the argument for its existence to this model. And (strawman coming up!) since when does improved quality of life have to be offset financially? This. And licensure to own should include competency testing, the way getting a license to drive requires a road test. Paying for enforcement could come from a surcharge on the insurance gun owners would be required to have, just like car insurance. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/214 "2018-02-17T00:15:06Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > How in the world does anyone expect to repeal the 2nd Amendment when the very reason gun control efforts fail to begin with is that so much of the populace is opposed to it? In 1860, we might have been having this same conversation about slavery. Having something enshrined in the Constitution makes it the law, it does not make it right. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/215 "2018-02-17T00:30:14Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Ah the Grapeist? I don’t know how I stumbled on a post that had been Graped. I just thought it was funny how serious the board took his/her transgressions. It was like how dare someone bring levity to these sacred halls. > > Anyways, I wasn’t using any name in that era since I wasn’t posting on these boards then. It’s amazing what’s saved on the internet though. Can you imagine with how nasty and deranged the current pit people are how actually posting your real photo would go in today’s environment? It would be legitimately dangerous. I try not to post too much information that a diabolically clever person could use. Especially since it isn’t beyond some of these people’s sense of morality to dox or swat. It’s a shame actually. You have to be way more careful if you’re going to pull this sock trick off dude. Don’t make mistakes like that. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/216 "2018-02-17T00:30:40Z")
We don’t need to repeal the amendment to make a start. The most basic regulation of a Militia is to exclude the incapable, the incompetent, the criminal and the insane from membership. We already do so in some cases (felons, for example). We just need to recognise this idea and do a better job of it. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/217 "2018-02-17T00:47:05Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Googling grapist and straight dope you see his/her posts from 2003. You know more about the Grapist than I, yet you came 6 years later? By your own logic you are a sock. Yeah, if you know what to look for you can find the posts, but how do you find them if you don’t know what to look for? I’ve been lurking here since 1999, that’s how I know the history. In fact I was reading the boards that day. You say you didn’t lurk, joined only in 2015, yet you know such a minor event in SDMB history? In fact, you know it well enough to off-hand reference it while assuming your reference would be understood? ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/218 "2018-02-17T00:51:49Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > The Grapist lasted less than a day and posted probably only a dozen times. I, too, find it odd that you stumbled on his posts despite (you claim) not being a member of the board back then. Fairly certain, or as much as I can be going on faulty memory alone, that nobody took his transgressions serious[sic] either. Unsurprising, however, that **octopus** would smear the past with the same taint that he applies to the present. So to speak. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/219 "2018-02-17T01:32:44Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > The most basic regulation of a Militia is to exclude the incapable, the incompetent, the criminal and the insane from membership. Spoken like someone who hasn’t even heard of the Marines 😃 ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2018, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/220 "2018-02-17T02:28:06Z")
> [@Evil\_Economist](#): > > Yeah, if you know what to look for you can find the posts, but how do you find them if you don’t know what to look for? > > I’ve been lurking here since 1999, that’s how I know the history. In fact I was reading the boards that day. You say you didn’t lurk, joined only in 2015, yet you know such a minor event in SDMB history? In fact, you know it well enough to off-hand reference it while assuming your reference would be understood? So you claim. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854.md?page=12)