# The tree of liberty needs to be watered with the blood of school children **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 15, 2018, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854 "2018-02-15T02:32:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/341 "2018-02-19T07:25:56Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > There is nothing inherently reflexive in seeing one’s schoolmates shot that results in a reaction of “Fuck your thoughts and prayers”. Mockery of thoughts and prayers is a recent tactic cooked up by the left to advance their agenda of gun control. We haven’t heard this after Columbine or any other mass shootings I’m aware of, and so for these students to suddenly be so outraged at the idea, it has obviously had to come from a source external to the students themselves. And given that today’s schools have essentially become SJWism factories, the school’s teachers are the most likely source of this manipulation, albeit boosted I’m sure by their local and national news media. It just couldn’t be because this youngest generation is becoming politically aware due to the utter shitshow of national politics at all, nope, gotta be those SJWs filling their heads with nonsense. > [@](#): > > Now, having said that, it so happens that ‘thoughts and prayers’ are often quite comforting to people in times of stress or loss. I have a friend who’s been battling cancer and she is most certainly comforted by the thoughts and prayers of her family and friends and is quite vocal in saying so. Probably because your friend knows there’s nothing else her friends and family can do to help her. I wager her tune would change should she know you have a relatively simple cure for her cancer, and simply won’t provide it because you receive donations from the cancer lobby. Those that CAN’T do anything else are perfectly fine in offering empathy. Those in power, who have watched almost a hundred schoolchildren murdered while taking thousands in donations from the NRA, don’t get that luxury. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/342 "2018-02-19T08:31:14Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > It just couldn’t be because this youngest generation is becoming politically aware due to the utter shitshow of national politics at all, nope, gotta be those SJWs filling their heads with nonsense. Yep. > [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Probably because your friend knows there’s nothing else her friends and family can do to help her. I wager her tune would change should she know you have a relatively simple cure for her cancer, and simply won’t provide it because you receive donations from the cancer lobby. > > Those that CAN’T do anything else are perfectly fine in offering empathy. Those in power, who have watched almost a hundred schoolchildren murdered while taking thousands in donations from the NRA, don’t get that luxury. Donations from the NRA is not what’s preventing gun control. The crime rate that exploded starting in the late sixties and which even now hasn’t returned to former levels, combined with the fact that crime is much more widespread now geographically than ever before is why people don’t want to give up their guns. Many, many more people than those killed in school shootings would be killed by intruders, carjackers, robbers, etc. if they knew their prey were unarmed. There is a huge criminal underclass in this country, made larger than it would be otherwise by relentless efforts by the left for acquittals on technicalities, early parole, and by glamorizing criminal and thug culture in movies and video games. The problem has become so great that many of our states have passed concealed and/or open carry legislation so law-abiding citizens can protect themselves from it. One can find stories in the news every day where people’s lives were saved because they guns with which to fight off criminals who’d accosted them or had broken into their homes. But, as we’ve seen by the many, many people over the years who’ve been raped, robbed and killed by people your side has put back on the street, your side has never cared about victims of street crime. And now, after you’ve done such a bang up job of exacerbating crime and making the streets unsafe for everyone, you want to take away our ability to defend ourselves from it. :rolleyes: These are the things that are preventing gun control, not the NRA. And, as with Trump’s election, you have only yourselves to blame. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/343 "2018-02-19T09:30:37Z")
LOL. In a country with the most guns, and highest incarceration, what is needed is \*\*more \*\*guns and to lock \*\*more \*\*people up. We just haven’t hit the sweet spot yet! > [@](#): > > One can find stories in the news every day where people’s lives were saved because they guns with which to fight off criminals who’d accosted them or had broken into their homes. Yes because part of the media selectively picks out such stories, while ignoring hundreds or thousands where a gun resulted in an accidental death of a family member, or a suicide, or was taken by a family member and used for crime. And why the excluded middle? Why not just limit what guns can be sold and implement licensing? Why is it so important to let a teenager buy an SMG? ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/344 "2018-02-19T09:52:19Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > There is nothing inherently reflexive in seeing one’s schoolmates shot that results in a reaction of “Fuck your thoughts and prayers”. Mockery of thoughts and prayers is a recent tactic cooked up by the left to advance their agenda of gun control. We haven’t heard this after Columbine or any other mass shootings I’m aware of, and so for these students to suddenly be so outraged at the idea, it has obviously had to come from a source external to the students themselves. And given that today’s schools have essentially become SJWism factories, the school’s teachers are the most likely source of this manipulation, albeit boosted I’m sure by their local and national news media. They live in the same world you and I do. Here’s a clue: maybe while you weren’t paying attention to anyone other than Sean Hannity and living in your conservative bubble, ordinary people were already getting fed up with seeing a nation murder itself. People were already getting tired of “thoughts and prayers” after Sutherland Springs, or after Las Vegas, or after Orlando, or after Virginia Tech. These kids get it and you don’t: words and thoughts do nothing; this stops only when people take collective action to solve it. You can continue to live in your bubble, cover your ears, close your eyes, say “I can’t hear you, blah blah!” and stamp your feet like a little child. But if yesterday’s rounds of interviews with these youngsters and their parents are any indication - and I happen to think they just might be - then we’re getting close to a tipping point when people are going to take action, with or without the input of people such as yourself. They’re going to protest. They’re going to demand change. They’re going to be impossible to ignore. They’ll shame politicians that accept NRA money and demand that those who wish to remain in office refuse to shrug and do nothing - and this is already having an impact as one major GOP donor has already said he will not fund any office holder who doesn’t support an assault weapons ban. People have had enough - not just enough of the carnage, but they’ve also had enough of indifference, and they’ve had enough of accepting that this is the best their society can do. So keep posting drivel, but while you’re doing that, others are going to take matters into their own hands, and I have the feeling that the number of people who are fed up with living in a war zone is greater than you imagine. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/345 "2018-02-19T10:38:46Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Donations from the NRA is not what’s preventing gun control. You’re correct in that statement, but it’s not what I said. It’s the NRA-funded politicians that regularly kill any hope of reform. > [@](#): > > The crime rate that exploded starting in the late sixties and which even now hasn’t returned to former levels, combined with the fact that crime is much more widespread now geographically than ever before is why people don’t want to give up their guns. Many, many more people than those killed in school shootings would be killed by intruders, carjackers, robbers, etc. if they knew their prey were unarmed. What WAS the violent crime rate in the Sixties, and how does it compare to today? Last I checked, the murder rate in 2016, even after a ~10% bump from 2015, is almost identical to 1960. > [@](#): > > There is a huge criminal underclass in this country, made larger than it would be otherwise by relentless efforts by the left for acquittals on technicalities, early parole, and by glamorizing criminal and thug culture in movies and video games. Just like the glorification of the mafia and Prohibition-era mobs in the Sixties? And there’s nothing like Johnny Cash writing a song about shooting someone in cold blood in 1955. > [@](#): > > The problem has become so great that many of our states have passed concealed and/or open carry legislation so law-abiding citizens can protect themselves from it. > > One can find stories in the news every day where people’s lives were saved because they guns with which to fight off criminals who’d accosted them or had broken into their homes. > > But, as we’ve seen by the many, many people over the years who’ve been raped, robbed and killed by people your side has put back on the street, your side has never cared about victims of street crime. And now, after you’ve done such a bang up job of exacerbating crime and making the streets unsafe for everyone, you want to take away our ability to defend ourselves from it. :rolleyes:. The problem is cowards that just NEED a gun to protect themselves, though we’ve seen time and time again that a good guy with a gun almost never stops a bad guy with a gun outside of home invasions. You’re not at any more danger now than you were in the wonderfully fantastic Sixties, even if you’re older and more scared of “thugs”. “Your side”? Fuck right off to your wife-beating, segregationist glory days. ---
**Author:** ![GreysonCarlisle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a87d85/32.png) [@GreysonCarlisle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreysonCarlisle)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/346 "2018-02-19T11:29:05Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > Well, I for one won’t be participating in the Starving Artist show, in which he hijacks another thread with asinine positions a normal human being would never have. Chastising the child victims of a massive school shooting for not being generous enough when offered platitudes. Jesus Christ. I offer my most humble thoughts and prayers that we can all move past this troubling time. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/347 "2018-02-19T12:29:31Z")
I find that the “Artist” with sub-human intelligence does have a useful role here at SDMB. Of course nobody would bother to refute vomitus like > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > These kids are merely parroting sentiments that have been fed to them by leftie educators. Further, the media, in its typical left-wing bias, is only reporting on them and not the ones who realize the problem in with people in today’s society and not guns. But we can compete for the best one-line riposte. Honorable mention to **wolfpup** for > [@wolfpup](#): > > Speaking of aging psychopaths … 😃 … but for the blue ribbon I nominate **Chisquirrel** : > [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Did you really drink an entire bottle of bleach or something? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/348 "2018-02-19T13:21:34Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Boy, did those kids give Trump what for over his [crap tweet storm blaming the FBI](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-florida-shooting-trump-students/student-survivors-of-florida-shooting-slam-trump-over-fbi-tweets-idUSKCN1G20VO). (Reuters) > > This old fogey will march with them on the 24th of March. So proud of them. I’ve already let my wife know I’m marching that day. I have to stand with those kids. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/349 "2018-02-19T13:28:38Z")
> [@GreysonCarlisle](#): > > I offer my most humble thoughts and prayers that we can all move past this troubling time. Got any ideas how to do that? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/350 "2018-02-19T13:45:16Z")
What kind of deranged monster thinks it’s okay to discredit the agency of survivors, in demanding change/action, because it conflicts with their own entirely partisan political beliefs? What kind of human thinks it’s okay to discredit the words and actions of these young survivors, as they express their pain and demand action? (If he counts himself a Christian, of any stripe, he should be drummed from his church in my opinion.) I’ve never agreed with his politics, and often found him a foolish debater. But this particular stance reveals how truly vile and morally bankrupt he is as a human. A clearer picture of exactly how twisted, partisan and morally bankrupt the Right is, I can’t imagine. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/351 "2018-02-19T14:19:53Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I’ve been very cynical about the future of this country, but this morning I saw strength in one of the unlikeliest of places: today’s youth. > > Simply put, they’ve had enough of this shit. Their bullshit detectors are going off and they’re not going to accept “Thoughts and prayers,” “#Parkland-strong,” or silly-assed yellow or black ribbons. I see people who are pissed off and who want to actually do something about the problem. I’m slightly optimistic, too, but I’d have to see the 18-29 cohort no longer be the one least likely to vote. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/352 "2018-02-19T14:22:23Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > A clearer picture of exactly how twisted, partisan and morally bankrupt the Right is, I can’t imagine. How about Mitch McConnell, smiling? ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/353 "2018-02-19T14:26:08Z")
**Fartist** wants to take us back to a better time in America, before the nasty liberals ruined everything. A time of Jim Crow and Sundown towns. A time when men could beat and rape their wives with impunity. Ah yes, the 50s. A golden age. A time when abuse and molestation went unpunished because the victims went unheard. A time when women and minorities were denied equal access to jobs and housing. A time when the homos got what they deserved. Go shove a giant Saguaro cactus up your ass, **Sharting Fartist**. You’ll have my sincere thoughts and prayers as you try to pull it out. ---
**Author:** ![Kiber](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kiber/32/317_2.png) [@Kiber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kiber)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/354 "2018-02-19T15:26:17Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Now, having said that, it so happens that ‘thoughts and prayers’ are often quite comforting to people in times of stress or loss. I have a friend who’s been battling cancer and she is most certainly comforted by the thoughts and prayers of her family and friends and is quite vocal in saying so. One of the things we hear most often when serious misfortune befalls someone and is publicized in the media is how comforting it is to receive cards and letters expressing sympathy and prayers and to know that so many people, often strangers, are thinking of and wishing them well. > > So you’re off base there too. > > Anything else? I don’t think you’re making the point you think you are. You said your friend is “battling” cancer. Does that mean she’s undergoing treatment? Or does she simply rely on “thoughts and prayers” to cure her cancer? Because, for the “thoughts and prayers” brigade – there’s no point in actually treating the disease of gun violence. For Republicans, “thoughts and prayers” are apparently **all** that’s necessary. So help us out. In the example of your friend appreciating “thoughts and prayers” – is that all she wants? Or does she also want things like chemo, radiation, surgery, research? Because for some of us, “thoughts and prayers” are a nice side dish, but for the main course, we really want action. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/355 "2018-02-19T17:59:32Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Yep. > > Donations from the NRA is not what’s preventing gun control. The crime rate that exploded starting in the late sixties and which even now hasn’t returned to former levels, combined with the fact that crime is much more widespread now geographically than ever before is why people don’t want to give up their guns. How about a cite for this? You’ve been saying this shit for years, but you have yet to offer any proof of it. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/356 "2018-02-19T18:13:50Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > How about a cite for this? You’ve been saying this shit for years, but you have yet to offer any proof of it. Starving Artist maintains his assertions by never ever ever risking them being contaminated by evidence. He’s the sociological equivalent of the perfectly elastic collision in a vacuum. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/357 "2018-02-19T18:19:46Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > How about a cite for this? You’ve been saying this shit for years, but you have yet to offer any proof of it. It’s true! Al Capone, Frank Nitti and Dutch Schulz, Bonnie and Clyde, John Dillinger, the Klan, the Bund, racist skinheads, dominionism, neoConfederate, neoNazi, the Lincoln County wars, the Hatfields and McCoys, the Kansas-Missouri Border War, etc etc etc Those damn dirty hippies caused all the violence and discontent. None of this happened until the Sixties ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/358 "2018-02-19T18:22:31Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Yep. > > Donations from the NRA is not what’s preventing gun control. The crime rate that exploded starting in the late sixties and which even now hasn’t returned to former levels, combined with the fact that crime is much more widespread now geographically than ever before is why people don’t want to give up their guns. Many, many more people than those killed in school shootings would be killed by intruders, carjackers, robbers, etc. if they knew their prey were unarmed. > > There is a huge criminal underclass in this country, made larger than it would be otherwise by relentless efforts by the left for acquittals on technicalities, early parole, and by glamorizing criminal and thug culture in movies and video games. The problem has become so great that many of our states have passed concealed and/or open carry legislation so law-abiding citizens can protect themselves from it. > > One can find stories in the news every day where people’s lives were saved because they guns with which to fight off criminals who’d accosted them or had broken into their homes. How many people are protecting themselves with AK47s? > [@](#): > > But, as we’ve seen by the many, many people over the years who’ve been raped, robbed and killed by people your side has put back on the street, your side has never cared about victims of street crime. And now, after you’ve done such a bang up job of exacerbating crime and making the streets unsafe for everyone, you want to take away our ability to defend ourselves from it. :rolleyes: Our side? The criminal justice system isn’t run by liberals, as far as I can tell. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/359 "2018-02-19T18:22:47Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I’m guessing that when you told your mommy about all the swearing going on she told you to shut the fuck up and grow a pair, didn’t she? rofl ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2018, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854/360 "2018-02-19T18:24:31Z")
[Assault rifle giveaway to support third graders still on.](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/youth-basketball-team-to-hold-ar-15-raffle/) Unbelievable. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-tree-of-liberty-needs-to-be-watered-with-the-blood-of-school-children/808854.md?page=19)