# The trend of Male bashing **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 2, 2005, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954 "2005-02-02T06:21:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![GomiBoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b2d939/32.png) [@GomiBoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GomiBoy)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/81 "2005-02-04T14:21:38Z")
I refuse to take on the sins of my father, but I also accept that my father had some sins and maybe I need to do something positive to be sure I ain’t like him. I’m willing to be the butt of some jokes for that, just so long as it never becomes sexism against me. I am not sexist, and refuse to be treated in a sexist fashion. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/82 "2005-02-04T14:23:46Z")
> [@](#): > > **Othersider** said: > That’s true, that does happen. I’d like to see, though, a woman say that men are smarter. It would be interesting to see the number and gender of people who react to it. Amber Pawlik. The reaction to her has been hatred from all but a few, and that’s hatred by men, hatred by women, hatred by feminists, hatred by women who defend men… Course, she doesn’t seem to think she’s a comedian. ---
**Author:** ![GomiBoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b2d939/32.png) [@GomiBoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GomiBoy)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/83 "2005-02-04T14:41:19Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Amber Pawlik. > > The reaction to her has been hatred from all but a few, and that’s hatred by men, hatred by women, hatred by feminists, hatred by women who defend men… > > Course, she doesn’t seem to think she’s a comedian. Please say it’s not this [Amber Pawlik](http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/p/pawlik/2004/pawlik071004.htm)? ---
**Author:** ![Othersider](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/cab0a1/32.png) [@Othersider](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Othersider)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/84 "2005-02-04T15:13:25Z")
I couldn’t find an article on her website that specifically mentions that men are more intelligent than women, but one of the comments on her “what people have said about me” page seems to correlate with what you said about her. 😉 :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/85 "2005-02-04T19:42:57Z")
If there’s not a trend of acceptable male bashing, explain this: Today, one of my co-workers was thrilled to show me the following joke > [@](#): > > Dear Tide: > I’m writing to say what an excellent product you have! I’ve used it since the beginning of my married life, when my Mom told me it was the best. Now that I am older and going through menopause, I find it even better! > > In fact, about a month ago, I spilled some red wine on my new white blouse. My unfeeling and uncaring husband started to berate me about how clumsy I was and generally started becoming a pain in the neck. > Well one thing led to another and I ended up with a lot of his blood on my white blouse. I tried to get the stain out using a bargain detergent, but it just wouldn’t come out. > > After a quick trip to the supermarket, I purchased a bottle of liquid Tide with bleach alternative, and to my surprise and satisfaction, all of the stains came out! > > In fact, the stains came out so well, that when the detectives w ho came by yesterday told me that the DNA tests on my blouse were negative. > > Later, my attorney called and said that I would no longer be considered a suspect in the disappearance of my husband. What a relief. > > I thank you, once again, for having such a great product. Well, gotta go now, I have to write a letter to the Hefty bag people. … > > Signed, > A very relieved menopausal wife Pretty gruesome and if the roles were reversed you can be sure there would be hell to pay. And two years ago when a man told the following joke there was: > [@](#): > > Q: What’s the first thing a woman should do when she gets out > of the battered womens’ shelter? > > A: The dishes, if she knows what’s good for her. After telling that joke, the man was reprimanded and told if he ever did anything like that again he would be fired. So answer me, Great Debaters, why is one joke (told by a woman but implying killing your husband) a good laugh to be shared by all when another joke (told by a man implying a battered wife) is a fireable offense? ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/86 "2005-02-04T19:53:18Z")
> [@Bryan Ekers](#): > > In more recent years, the various men’s magazines like _Maxim_ and whatnot carry a disturbing subtext: as a man, you are by default an idiot and your only choice is to copy the alpha males in matters of clothing, food and drink, all in the vague hope that women (who will forever be mysterious creatures beyond your comprehension) won’t notice how much of an idiot you are until it’s too late. I hate maxim, they pull all that shyte trying to break down a person’s self esteem then they try to take advantage of that state to get you to buy $200 sunglasses and $150 shirts. Womens mags do the same thing, but they are 10x worse, still sucks though. What bothers me more is the ‘Everybody Loves Raymond’ Ray Ramone stereotype of a male. ie, a guy who will put up with verbal abuse from a self centered spouse and call it a normal, healthy relationship. It is the reversed modern version of All in the Family. I just watched welcome to mooseport and it was pretty pathetic. The idea of a bitchy, demanding, self centered woman who is mentally and physically abusive to her boyfriend (shoving him on national TV, dating the president to make him jealous, insulting him, etc) being considered some kind of ‘catch’ is pretty sad. I hope no young men are going to grow up thinking its normal to act that way. Yes i’m overreacting, and yes I know it. ---
**Author:** ![2\_click\_twiddle\_flare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/82dd89/32.png) [@2\_click\_twiddle\_flare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/2_click_twiddle_flare)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/87 "2005-02-04T19:54:47Z")
> [@uglybeech](#): > > Offhand I offer Phoebe on Friends, Kelly Bundy, Grace on Will and Grace, Ally McBeal, Mimi Bobeck on Drew Carey. Then I give you the reality t.v. triumverate: Jessica Simpson, Anna Nicole Smith, Nicole Richie. There’s the main character in Clueless, Sally on Third Rock from the Sun, Absolutely Fabulous. Keeping Up Appearances. Since I don’t watch a lot of t.v. comedies I think that’s pretty fair list. Movies: Clueless, Romy and Michelle’s High School Reunion, Miss Congeniality, Bring it On, Legally Blonde, To Die For, Death Becomes Her, Pretty Woman, Election. > > And with the possible exception of the “reality” idiots and Mimi Bobeck, I love them all. I’m happy to see women do comedy successfully. > > I find this whole thread a little dense. All you’re noticing when you say there’s this recent “male-bashing” trend is that men do comedy more than women. Really, I’m surprised noone here is offended by Monty Python or the Kids in the Hall or the Daily Show - all or nearly all the actors in these shows are men. And here they are playing the fools all the time. I saw John Stewart asked this by some woman on c-span - why don’t they have (m)any women on the Daily show? - and he answered “we don’t think women are funny.” Probably half joke, half truth. After reading this thread I don’t know who’s supposed to be offended by that crack - men because they’re funny or women because they’re not? In most of your example, the woman are portrayed as “kooky” funny lovable characters, not morons who you are supposed to view as pathetic and arnt capable of doing anything well. There is a difference in portaying a “funny” character, and demeaning people to have the opposite group find it funny, so you can sell more of your product. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/88 "2005-02-04T19:59:17Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > For over 2,000 years, women were told they were like infants, of lower mental capacity than men, incapable of higher reasoning, a waste of schooling, fit only for breeding and domesticity, etc., etc. Don’t like trying the shoe on the other foot? Don’t like a taste of your own medicine? Yeah, karma is a bitch. 🙂 I had nothing to do with that. I am German and French in descent, my ancestors lived under feudalism and the virtual slavery thereof. I don’t feel any anger at the modern royal families of europe. I remember Dinesh D’souza talking about how silly it was for people in India to get worked up over British occupation and demanding reparations since the British were about the 8th country to invade and occupy India in its history. Everyone can find some way people like them have been screwed over in the past if they look hard enough. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/89 "2005-02-04T20:16:45Z")
> [@Wrath](#): > > :eek: Major Nelson was _gay_? > > That explains alot… It does? I’m completely confused by this comment, but then I don’t remember _I Dream Of Jeannie_ very well. Can you clue me in? Oh wait, didn’t she always have the hots for him, but he wanted no part of it? Was that it? ---
**Author:** ![Wrath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ee7513/32.png) [@Wrath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrath)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/90 "2005-02-04T21:52:28Z")
One of the lasting jokes regarding “I Dream of Jeannie” centered around the fact that, well… have you _seen_ Barbara Eden in that costume? What hetero guy _wouldn’t_ wish for… I mean, what would _you_ do? What _didn’t_ Major Nelson do, not even once? Alright, it was a family show. But towards the end I think they got married. That’s when they [jumped the shark.](http://www.jumptheshark.com/) ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2005, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/91 "2005-02-04T21:57:19Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > If there’s not a trend of acceptable male bashing, explain this: > > Today, one of my co-workers was thrilled to show me the following joke Sorry to be contrarian, but isn’t that joke really at the expense of the _woman_? I took it to mean that she behaved that way because of the onset of menopause. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/92 "2005-02-05T00:13:45Z")
That joke reminded me somewhat of another joke that was making the rounds of the Arabic E-mail circuit. I have translated it from Arabic for you: An Englishwoman, a Frenchwoman, and an Arab woman got together and agreed that they would go home and tell their husbands: I will not do any more housework until you start doing your fair share of the housework. Then later they got together again and compared stories. The Englishwoman said: “The first day, I didn’t see anything. The second day, I didn’t see anything. On the third day, he did the laundry.” The Frenchwoman said: “The first day, I didn’t see anything. The second day, I didn’t see anything. On the third day, he washed the dishes.” The Arab woman said: “The first day, I didn’t see anything. The second day, I didn’t see anything. On the third day I was able to see a little out of my left eye…” ---
**Author:** ![Othersider](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/cab0a1/32.png) [@Othersider](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Othersider)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/93 "2005-02-05T07:16:35Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > That joke reminded me somewhat of another joke that was making the rounds of the Arabic E-mail circuit. I have translated it from Arabic for you: > > An Englishwoman, a Frenchwoman, and an Arab woman got together and agreed that they would go home and tell their husbands: I will not do any more housework until you start doing your fair share of the housework. Then later they got together again and compared stories. > > The Englishwoman said: “The first day, I didn’t see anything. The second day, I didn’t see anything. On the third day, he did the laundry.” > > The Frenchwoman said: “The first day, I didn’t see anything. The second day, I didn’t see anything. On the third day, he washed the dishes.” > > The Arab woman said: “The first day, I didn’t see anything. The second day, I didn’t see anything. On the third day I was able to see a little out of my left eye…” Wrong or not, I cracked up. Good one. 😃 :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Zonyx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a183cd/32.png) [@Zonyx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zonyx)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/94 "2005-02-05T14:32:01Z")
> [@2 click twiddle flare](#): > > Anyone who watchs modern televisions, movies, adverts will know that men are increasingly being represented as moron beings who forget everything, are lazy, and can only get by with the help of women. > A typical ad on television, one we had back in NZ here a while ago: > Showing a man puzzling at a washing machine, finally figuring out the press the start button. and the ad slogan something to the effect of “so simple, even a man can use it.” Isn’t this also another ad which is offensive to women? Implying that we are still the ones in charge of the housework, washing clothes etc. It’s a minefield out there. ---
**Author:** ![AtomicDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@AtomicDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AtomicDog)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/95 "2005-02-05T16:46:28Z")
> [@Atropa3](#): > > If you’re really worried about impressions on children growing up watching TV, you should check out Nickelodeon sometime. > > I never objected to my kids watching Rugrats or Ren & Stimpy, but the commercials in between were appalling. The common message being that parents are uncool and clueless about the wonders of this cereal, candy, toy, etc. And the crazy thing is, these are parents that grew up in the '70s and '80s, that for the most part ATE THE SAME CEREAL and PLAYED WITH THE SAME TOYS! ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/96 "2005-02-05T17:22:32Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Amber Pawlik. > > The reaction to her has been hatred from all but a few, and that’s hatred by men, hatred by women, hatred by feminists, hatred by women who defend men… > > Course, she doesn’t seem to think she’s a comedian. Right, the reason that Amber Prawlik gets shit on isn’t because she’s a Coulterish troll, but because she thinks men are smarter than women. Some excerpts: > [@Amber](#): > > The entire plot of the movie Anchorman is leftist in nature. It is set in the 1970s, and a woman joins an all-male news team. The men are portrayed as nothing but piggish brutes while the ever-so-clever woman is harassed and given crap jobs. While competing for the lead anchor position on the news team, the woman, Veronica Corningstone, (played by Christina Applegate) cons the man, Ron Burgundy, (played by Will Ferrell) to say “Go f— yourselves San Diego” on TV. After being fired from his job and turning to booze, the bartender tells Ron that, “The ladies are doing things now,” and he has to accept it. The movie ends with such heroism as Ron’s dog saving the girl, Veronica, from bears about to kill her. :rolleyes: > [@Amber on the Left](#): > > I’m going to state the obvious: the only reason why we are divided is because of the left. In fact, they are proud of their divisiveness. They boasted that they were a minority voice, and that those who were patriotic were mindless followers. Exactly who was the left united with? Europe? The United Nations? Terrorist organizations? > > You have free speech in this country, even to cripple your own countrymen and soldiers during war time. But when you do it, don’t expect the rest of the country to forget it. Leftists, we remember your treason. :rolleyes: > [@Amber](#): > > Leftists have unyielding support for Islamic terrorists and an undying hatred for any civilized nation. :rolleyes: Give me a fucking a break. That you take this woman seriously tells a lot about you. ---
**Author:** ![Othersider](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/cab0a1/32.png) [@Othersider](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Othersider)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/97 "2005-02-06T03:04:08Z")
> [@](#): > > Leftists have unyielding support for Islamic terrorists and an undying hatred for any civilized nation. :eek: WOW. Just wow. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/98 "2005-02-06T04:22:00Z")
> [@Zonyx](#): > > Isn’t this also another ad which is offensive to women? Implying that we are still the ones in charge of the housework, washing clothes etc. That is what I think every time this topic comes up. It’s not nice to suggest that men are too stupid to do simple household chores, but isn’t the real message of these ads that since men _can’t_ do domestic work, women _must_? Back to the kitchen with you, ladies! I mean, these commercials don’t show men being too stupid to join the military, go into business, play sports, or hold public office. It’s only when it comes to traditionally feminine tasks that the “smart women” have to step in and take care of things for the “dumb men”. I don’t think it really boils down to smart women vs. dumb men at all. It’s just more of the old “women are good at feminine things, men are good at masculine things, and disaster strikes whenever anyone defies their proper gender role.” ---
**Author:** ![butter\_pie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/aca169/32.png) [@butter\_pie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/butter_pie)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/99 "2005-02-06T13:14:53Z")
I think commercials just use stereotypes according to their intended audience. How is a guy in a commercial not knowing how to use the dishwasher any different from the muffler commercial on the radio, where the woman calls in and sounds like a total doorknob because her husband told her she needed expensive metal brake pads? I get really tired of the goofy male stereotype in sitcoms, but I also find most sitcoms unwatchable because the wives tend to all be shrill banshees that do nothing but bitch and try to manipulate their husbands and are obsessed with appearing smarter and always RIGHT. IMO neither party is portrayed in a positive light. The whole purpose of the show is to make fun of both of them for laughs. When I want to see smart guys on TV, I watch Law & Order. My boyfriend once called me from the grocery store because he couldn’t figure out what brands of things (milk I think) he needed to get and where they were, and his experience shopping consists mostly of following me around while I toss things in the basket. I swear it was a scene straight from one of those cellphone commercials. He also stuck his hand in a frying pan once, trying to flip over a grilled cheese, and burnt his hand pretty bad. The spatula was less than a foot away. I don’t think he’s an idiot, but he doesn’t cook or grocery shop or do housework, just like I don’t know how to work on cars (neither does he, actually.) Everyone has their less than stellar moments, and Bog knows I’ve had my share and so has he. They’re stereotypes that exist because they do have a bit of truth to them. And there are plenty on both sides of the fence. I’m as offended by dumb guys in commercials as I am by the ladies that make it seem like a better dishwashing detergent is the high point of my existence, or that taxes are too complicated for my puny brain to comprehend and I need to go to H&R block, or that assume because I’m home in the daytime I must be either unemployed, or in need of a lawyer to get workman’s comp, and that I need phone lines with no credit check and debt consolidation services. Until advertisers stop assuming every last one of their customers is a bloody idiot, I’ll just be content to be marginally offended on behalf of everybody (male, female, or other). And maybe order a Pasta Pot [sup]TM[/sup] because I just haven’t quite figured out how to use a colander with my macaroni noodles. And as long as stupid == funny, I don’t see any of this changing soon. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954/100 "2005-02-06T13:42:29Z")
You really should watch more infomercials. The women there can’t handle a spoon, can opener, pot, baking sheet, broom, iron, etc etc etc. I’m surprised that they can breath without assistance. And of course, when you leave comedy and cross over into other genres the stereotype doesn’t hold. For example, in lifetime movies and shows the men aren’t ineffectual bumblers. They’re heartless killers and criminal masterminds. :smack: Wait, bad example. Look at your one hour dramas. **24** : How incompetent is Jack Bauer? Well, he’s never thought to take a day off. Still, he saves the world and his terribly helpless daughter all without a drop of sleep. **Lost** : Let’s see. Kate can handle herself and a gun pretty well but still defers to Dr. Jack, Sawyer, Sayid, and Locke. Sun is very intelligent, but defers to Jin. Shannon is entirely helpless and kind of a witch. Claire is pregnant. **Law and Order** : The women involved their are secondary characters. S. Epatha Merkeson manages maybe 10 minutes of screen time and the other major female character is secondary to Sam Waterson. I could probably go on, but I don’t watch enough television. Movies are the same way though. Once you step out of comedy, the trend falls apart. Since it’s mainly confined to comedy (and not exactly good comedy at that), maybe ya’ll should stop reading so much into it and learn to take a joke. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trend-of-male-bashing/287954.md?page=6)