# The trial has begun. So the question must be asked. Did Michael do it? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 1, 2005, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739 "2005-02-01T05:26:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2005, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/61 "2005-02-02T06:24:37Z")
> [@Good Egg](#): > > Am I the only person who doesn’t care at all about this case? No, you’re not. > [@Good Egg](#): > > I am tired of all these trials they foist on the television public; what for? To distract us from thinking about world affairs? But of course; 20 more minutes every hour covering the Jackson trial means 20 fewer minutes to ask about the [missing $9 billion in Iraq,](http://www.commondreams.org/news2005/0131-11.htm) or [the Republicans’ Social Security scare tactics,](http://rawstory.rawprint.com/105/social_security_1.php) or [the media’s snowball job on the Iraqi election,](http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=05/01/31/1516244) or… ---
**Author:** ![deena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8e7dd6/32.png) [@deena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/deena)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/62 "2005-02-05T06:43:18Z")
Is the trial being televised in America? If so, live? Not live? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/63 "2005-02-05T06:48:31Z")
Neither live nor Memorex. No cameras in the courtroom. Some cable channel (I don’t remember which) is supposedly going to stage next day “renactments” with actors reading the previous day’s transcripts. I’m almost tempted to check it out just to see who they could possibly cast as Jacko. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/64 "2005-02-05T12:50:59Z")
> [@F. U. Shakespeare](#): > > I have a nephew by blood who’s 12. I am also very close to a 10-year old girl whose parents are essentially family, although not blood relatives. > > If I ever found myself faced with a seeming need to share a bed for the night with either one of them (even if they suggested it), I would beg off – I would sleep on the floor, or prop myself in the corner. > > I know my sexuality, but I also know that sleep is not a conscious state: when I’m asleep and dreaming that I’m holding Shania Twain/Dolly Parton/J-Lo in my arms (all three on a good night!), I’m not conscious of who is **actually** in my arms. > > It would have creeped me out to have woken up to such a ‘reaction’ when I was a kid. > > Otherwise, I agree with your post. I think **Ludovic** meant “reaction” as in how people view the idea of an adult and a child sharing a bed, not a physical reaction. But this is what kills me. MJ has done half of the prosecution’s work for them. He has placed himself at the scene by repeatedly stating to reporters that he sees nothing wrong with sleeping in the same bed with young boys. He was seen **on camera** holding hands with his accuser. For years, he has been publicly flaunting behavior that fits the pedophile profile to a T. But the stuff that he’s about to be put on trial for? Nooooooo! He never did any of **that**! He actually believes, or thinks people will believe, or both, that his admitted, so-called affection for children is entirely separate from the criminal activity he’s accused of. And meanwhile, the nutjobs who support him are saying they want him to have a fair trial. I hope they know what they’re saying, because a fair trial will convict him. ---
**Author:** ![LH75](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lh75/32/4438_2.png) [@LH75](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LH75)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/65 "2005-02-05T13:15:25Z")
friend rilchiam wrote > [@](#): > > And meanwhile, the nutjobs who support him are saying they want him to have a fair trial. I hope they know what they’re saying, because a fair trial will convict him. i also want him to be tried fairly. if he is convicted he should be sentenced accordingly, but he is entitled to due process. jmho, but i think the parents of the child should also get a fair trial and due process on the charge of child endangerment. what kind of parent would turn their child over to a weirdo like that? lh ---
**Author:** ![Zonyx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a183cd/32.png) [@Zonyx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zonyx)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/66 "2005-02-05T14:27:03Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > There will apparently be testimony (and not just from the victim) that MJ frequently makes the kids change their underwear after he molests them so that he can dispose of any potential DNA evidence. He would supply them with new skivvies. The cops found a great big supply of boy’s underwear This just shows how dodgy these “reports” are. Surely a parent would notice if a child came home wearing differing underwear than before. Or does he have underwear in every brand and size going? However, Michael does come across as a very messed up human being and I think it’s all too possible that he did it. I guess we’ll never know for 100% sure whether it’s true or not unless he confesses. ---
**Author:** ![BMax](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bmax/32/4267_2.png) [@BMax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BMax)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/67 "2005-02-05T16:38:24Z")
The porn magazine with both their fingerprints doesn’t prove anything. I have an uncle 2 years older than myself. While growing up we would raid his father’s stash of porn together. I know there was at least one porn mag in the 70s with my fingerprints, my uncle’s fingerprints and my grandfather’s fingerprints all on it, but that doesn’t prove that grandpa was looking at it with us. I’m not saying that I think Jacko is innocent. I believe that he used the boy in question for sex, just like he used the boy in 93, just like he has used several boys before and between the two incidents. I thought the whole “Peter Pan” thing was creepy 20 years ago when he was still cashing in on Thriller. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/68 "2005-02-05T16:59:07Z")
> [@Zonyx](#): > > This just shows how dodgy these “reports” are. Surely a parent would notice if a child came home wearing differing underwear than before. Or does he have underwear in every brand and size going? There aren’t THAT many types of underwear out there. Tighty whities, boxers, boxer briefs? Three basic types. How many brand names? Fruit of the Loom, Hanes, maybe one or two more major brands. It’s not that hard to have the underwear situation covered. And besides that, just because a criminal scheme is a harebrained one doesn’t make it any less illegal. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/69 "2005-02-05T17:13:17Z")
I have to make a confession-I’m finding the whole thing fascinating-it’s the proverbial trainwreck. I just find it so hard to connect Michael as he is now with the guy who did _Off the Wall_ and _Thriller_, although if you look back to the latter, you can see the signs emerging that, as Hank Hill would say, “The boy ain’t right.” It’s mostly a “What the FUCK is going on?!” As for the underwear-perhaps he hid the new stuff from his mom? And no, not all parents notice. If the woman’s so clueless as to allow her kid to spend that much time with Michael Jackson, well, what do you expect? ---
**Author:** ![furlibusea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@furlibusea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furlibusea)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/70 "2005-02-05T17:58:39Z")
I am still wondering about the parents. I am sorry but they were pimps for their child. There is no way in hell they hadn’t herd the whispering about MJ. It’s been around for years and years. They thought they would get rich out of it and didn’t even provide the basic safeguards you would provide if your kid was going to a neighborhood slumber party. I think it goes beyond stupid into the realm of deliberate procurement. Is he guilty. Hell I have no idea. I am really uncomfortable at how much has been leaked to the press. Seems like if they really have the open and shut case we think they have, they would try it in court. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/71 "2005-02-05T18:34:11Z")
They ARE trying it in court. ---
**Author:** ![furlibusea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@furlibusea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furlibusea)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/72 "2005-02-05T18:59:41Z")
Yah but they are doing their damndest to taint the jury through the press first. ---
**Author:** ![Kythereia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e8c25b/32.png) [@Kythereia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kythereia)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/73 "2005-02-05T19:50:48Z")
[QUOTE=Good Egg] Am I the only person who doesn’t care at all about this case? QUOTE] _Exactly_. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![OliverTwistofLime](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/b487fb/32.png) [@OliverTwistofLime](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OliverTwistofLime)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/74 "2005-02-05T21:01:47Z")
To respond to the OP, I believe he is guilty based on what I have heard, read, and visualized about this case. Do I think he will be convicted? Not put in a prison…perhaps into a psychiatric institution for a limited time. Why do i think that: Because there are at least 2 kinds of justice we are dealing with…Paying big big money to the so called finest lawyers available and those justice meted out to those who cannot pay for the superheavy weights. Our laws are so complex that all the hotshots have to do is find something that the prosecutors didn’t do along the way. Hopefully the jury will prove me wrong. ---
**Author:** ![OliverTwistofLime](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/b487fb/32.png) [@OliverTwistofLime](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OliverTwistofLime)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/75 "2005-02-05T21:03:56Z")
please substitute that for the word those ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/76 "2005-02-05T21:20:57Z")
Well, don’t know if he is guilty or not. I feel that there is at least a fair chance of it given his past interview history _but_ I would be willing to listen to both sides present before deciding. I am well aware of his rather abusive upbring, and am also willing to accept the outside possibility that he just wants to have a childhood he never had. If so, the sexual aspects are bothersome, but given that he didnt have a normal childhood, he may just consider sexual activity as a valid thing of juveniles - without thinking it through that whereas sexual experimentation between friends at 12 [like mutual masturbation, exchanging blowjobs] is appropriate it is _not_ for between an adult and a juvenile. I think Michael has serious ‘age identity’ issues with his wanting to have the childhood he missed, and probably should go to some form of psychiatric program rather than a jail, but that is for the judge and jury to decide. Sorry if the idea that juvenile sexual experimentation is OK, but humans have spent thousands of years living with little or no privacy in bed, with children watching sex and childbirth, and even death FWIW. Wrapping people in saran wrap and sanitizing everything is just plain silly. Life happens. ---
**Author:** ![Club\_33](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@Club\_33](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Club_33)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/77 "2005-02-06T01:17:44Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > It’s very strange to reconcile a guy who would keep sleeping with little boys after getting busted for molesting one and then paying $20 million to shut the kid up. > > Love letters > Shared porno > The kid’s testimony > > Guilty. Just had to comment on the “shared porno” charge. When I was a kid, I found some magazines under my parents beds. I would bet anything that both my and my fathers fingerprints were on every damn page. Doesn’t mean my father molested me. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/78 "2005-02-06T01:32:07Z")
Did your dad write you love letters? . ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/79 "2005-02-06T01:57:18Z")
Mr. Rilch said something today that I’d like to share. He said that, even apart from the allegations, MJ’s still not doing as much good for kids as he may think he is. The best way to mentor a kid is to teach them something. Some athletes hold sports clinics. Some actors sponsor theater programs, and some artists give classes in drawing. MJ’s supposed to be such a great dancer; if he wanted to do something nice for kids, he could give them dance lessons. Boys **and** girls. But he doesn’t do anything except buy them toys and stuff them full of junk food and Jesus Juice. Boys only. ---
**Author:** ![Club\_33](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/df705f/32.png) [@Club\_33](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Club_33)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2005, 9:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739/80 "2005-02-06T09:56:17Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Did your dad write you love letters? > . No, he didn’t. But you know what? That isn’t evidence of molestation either. It may be evidence that MJ has an attraction to boys, which is more than disturbing, but it isn’t illegal. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trial-has-begun-so-the-question-must-be-asked-did-michael-do-it/287739.md?page=5)