# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making Part Deux (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 22, 2020, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083 "2020-06-22T03:36:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 200
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2020, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/3998 "2020-09-26T19:45:30Z")
“The car crashed, but it was already an old dented up jalopy that smelled like a raccoons’ outhouse, so it needed to be replaced anyway. Always look on the bright side of …” ---
**Author:** ![tripthicket](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripthicket/32/297_2.png) [@tripthicket](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tripthicket)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2020, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/3999 "2020-09-26T19:48:04Z")
Leftist scientists? I guess this is now a thing, since the Republicans are making _everything_ political. Would not at all be surprised to see someone denigrated as a ‘leftist vegan’ or a ‘socialist librarian.’ Sheesh. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2020, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4000 "2020-09-26T22:11:48Z")
Compared to the current Administration the entire damn _universe_ is leftist! ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2020, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4001 "2020-09-26T23:26:06Z")
> [@tripthicket](#): > > Leftist scientists? I guess this is now a thing, since the Republicans are making _everything_ political. Not just leftist scientists, but _working for the government_. Like, er, Mr. Caputo. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2020, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4002 "2020-09-26T23:42:59Z")
Well of course librarians are socialists - they let the poors read their books for free instead of letting them earn their education like Jesus and St. Ronald intended when they signed the 2nd Amendment. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2020, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4003 "2020-09-26T23:48:10Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > HHS [is about to embark on](https://www.politico.com/news/2020/09/25/trump-hhs-ads-coronavirus-421957) an ad campaign to “defeat despair over COVID-19”, featuring celebrities like Dennis Quaid and CeCe Williams, and they are also trying to get Mehmet fucking Oz and Garth Brooks. > > The budget for this effort to make people feel better about the trainwreck will be $300M, overseen by department spokespiece Michael Caputo. [Trump’s attitude on the subject.](https://www.gocomics.com/calvinandhobbes/1990/08/17) ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4004 "2020-09-27T16:42:31Z")
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trumps-strategy-is-not-to-win-its-to-invalidate-the-election-results/2020/09/24/2b201d48-fe82-11ea-9ceb-061d646d9c67\_story.html](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trumps-strategy-is-not-to-win-its-to-invalidate-the-election-results/2020/09/24/2b201d48-fe82-11ea-9ceb-061d646d9c67_story.html) > The Atlantic’s Barton Gellman has written a [horrifying account](https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2020/11/what-if-trump-refuses-concede/616424/) of President Trump’s well-developed plans to sabotage the legitimacy of a presidential election that seems to be going against him. The U.S. electoral system, it turns out, has disturbing gray areas and no authoritative referees, making it surprisingly vulnerable to a ruthless violator of democratic norms. Trump appears to have the means and the intention to contest mail-in ballots, to claim massive electoral fraud, to muddy outcomes in battleground states and to refuse any form of concession. It is a strategy designed not to win an election but to invalidate its results and hold on to power through fraud. > > This is the context in which Trump has repeatedly refused to affirm that he would accept a loss in the 2020 election. Often it is advisable to ignore Trump’s provocations, on the theory that some bait should be left untaken. Not this time. In this case, as Gellman shows, Trump is developing a mechanism to implement his destructive madness. We may be seeing the development of a presidential coup against American democracy. > > In the coming weeks, the country is likely to depend on the health and authority of three institutions. There is the judiciary, which may be the only accepted arbiter of an election outcome. **There is the news media, which will need to shed light on shady maneuvering.** And there is the U.S. military, which may be required to politely but firmly escort Trump off the White House grounds. > … He’s referencing the Atlantic article that I’ve quoted from extensively from in at least two threads. Re my bolding: now is the time for the mainstream news media to really take off the gloves and call what he is doing by the correct names. No more “misleading misstating, unclear” equivocating. Call his statements LIES with immediate fact-checking. In the next month, the media needs to report the bald, bare FACTS. There doesn’t even need to be a lot of editorializing as his lies speak for themselves. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4005 "2020-09-27T19:58:30Z")
Anyone that thinks that Trump is running this circus is badly mistaken. I doubt that he can find the Offal Office without help. Typo, but under this administration, that’s better than Oval Office. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4006 "2020-09-27T20:25:24Z")
> [@ThelmaLou quoting WaPo discussing Atlantic article](#): > > And there is the U.S. military, which may be required to politely but firmly escort Trump off the White House grounds In an article I saw somewhere just today, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff re-iterates that it is not the job of the military to insert itself into any election squabbles. The topic at hand had to do with Trump ordering troops into cities to maintain order during the election, which he suggests the military will refuse to do, but probably applies also to the idea of using the military to extract Trump from the White House. That task most likely falls to the Secret Service or National Park Police. It will all depend, of course, on whose orders they obey when two people both claim they are president. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4007 "2020-09-27T21:05:12Z")
How [unsurprising](https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/politics/donald-trump-father-will/): > Donald Trump was facing financial disaster in 1990 when he came up with an audacious plan to exert control of his father’s estate. > > His creditors threatened to force him into personal bankruptcy, and his first wife, Ivana, wanted “a billion dollars” in a divorce settlement, Donald Trump said in a deposition. So he sent an accountant and a lawyer to see his father, Fred Trump Sr., who was told he needed to immediately sign a document changing the will according to his son’s wishes, according to depositions from family members. > > It was a fragile moment for the senior Trump, who was 85 years old and had built a real estate empire worth hundreds of millions of dollars. He would soon be diagnosed with cognitive problems, such as being unable to recall things he was told 30 minutes earlier or remember his birth date, according to his medical records, which were included in a related court case… ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4008 "2020-09-27T21:21:17Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > In an article I saw somewhere just today, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff re-iterates that it is not the job of the military to insert itself into any election squabbles. The topic at hand had to do with Trump ordering troops into cities to maintain order during the election, which he suggests the military will refuse to do, but probably applies also to the idea of using the military to extract Trump from the White House. If the Chief Justice administers the oath of office to not-Individual-ONE, that other person becomes the CiC of the armed forces and they are expected to carry out his orders. ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4009 "2020-09-27T21:40:58Z")
Hmm. One might imagine the New York Times has seen Trump’s tax returns. > **[Trump frequently paid no federal income taxes in years leading up to...](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-taxes/trump-paid-no-income-taxes-in-10-of-last-15-years-new-york-times-idUSKBN26I10L?il=0)** > > President Donald Trump paid just $750 in federal income taxes in both 2016 and 2017, after years of reporting heavy losses from his business enterprises to offset hundreds of millions of dollars in income, the New York Times reported on Sunday,... I wonder for how long those will remain under wraps. 😏 ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4010 "2020-09-27T22:50:08Z")
Link to the original Times piece: > **[Trump’s Taxes Show Chronic Losses and Years of Income Tax Avoidance...](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/27/us/donald-trump-taxes.html)** > > The Times obtained Donald Trump’s tax information extending over more than two decades, revealing struggling properties, vast write-offs, an audit battle and hundreds of millions in debt coming due. Some screenies: [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/EuyYgGbgDB3dg0cbbSt7HihkHGGJfcDBgUtfijGeXut1jzjaaNmCcATFM06lzsbV1-pXFPyN3h499rXILK74bCizmCNgJa7Wm4772NwksCbukkI-WmqRIMf1VtT_EBQQwaJ8ZxrRIg=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/PpaaWpN2YfZMo7n67) [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/t1uCYNyFvpcGeVvyNt0TcCLICws0V5ZpjTMMPY7tQoYF96aexgnKTlLuP7B0EeksSOK4WI9C-JCitWovc09CEfGbdGS9xjuDrBWCT9kIPqrGLlH2sIAaVWvBBkLJ5BYMNo0mGdeZ0w=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/5wvSWe5AW2d5a71g9) [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/JdRA5oBcwNSBaYD2jxa5XWQoOn8yDTjAUFcnKFdqFxYZXYE_xjB7xfK8_ZCh6sjNLQ4Muem0tHI7b61NCPZH_Op7YBlzylNB-Bu18iYrGB0f5_aIoOAsK7i1Jyu5ov1rwmoLv2FNlg=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/ZwY6Nqa1mbiG5JFQ9) As President, he paid $750 to the US treasury in taxes, but paid $156k in taxes to the Philippines: [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Cia1v68_OGV4-DpXMm3Jm7pMciH4CsQ64vtkJssHvrpK3pX3PB0KJO2GsPwrvRCaCtPc7Z_whpU8kPvTl0zTbYGBPQQOlxK5hSmuMCHacO1XIguZi4TA2WPdRgE0IfMabGOEZPUyDA=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/ySS1RDCxSidZ8AK59) Stiffed lenders to the tune of $287 million: [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_DWn3QCq0UWf29U-Q0DMLC8ZlWMgEFQRaJq78nT1ZvSzXLhyKuHPmDoUz_qKkEOTiD-jv91veCEPHtpZNKSBJ5Q7KQ2PdmmMn7VEuUu7ZDUJjX8zsf4LBzu0YiAGgSoA-QNIxa0NzA=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/tE7uC3x5ninihWku7) There’s a $100 million principal payment due on Trump Tower in 2022: [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/q9h_su_-2I_X2UYwNg_yTOinetY6O5tnwjqs4mudBk2EZsM51VENt5uj8R6NjRrJi2IUvbioiKS6r4Df7gQ0IwTt4E6y5NW8o66f8YZ9pZzYy9_MLd7uSCcmCjLrPzph9qxZE1qjwQ=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/Y1Jecca8g9QwLyGe9) And Trump himself has personally guaranteed an additional $400+ million in debt, most of which comes due in the next 4 years. [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/OdTYdI1abu6HsS3X85wgVsYYPJdiIN0z6JB7k5veHRhvVq9xhjw-6gWLD2t4wGJS5kOHqLbuwIX3ElSZX_L0oOIOw5hfKXqNbkzgoDRl8TWOqRqQ5fL-n0mPOi1ctZ_uCMwvHbLDZQ=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/LVJVrT4QkxUJsuHA8) There’s more, a lot more, including Russian and Turkish debts. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4011 "2020-09-27T22:53:51Z")
Graphic visualizations via an interactive timeline are in a 2nd article: > **[Charting an Empire: A Timeline of Trump’s Finances (Published 2020)](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/09/27/us/donald-trump-taxes-timeline.html)** > > Tax records provide a detailed history of President Trump’s business career, revealing huge losses, looming financial threats and a large, contested refund from the I.R.S. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4012 "2020-09-27T23:12:50Z")
> is what the video appears to show (CFSG’s droning heard in the background). ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4013 "2020-09-27T23:15:09Z")
One last item… [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/z7dNK5FLKnnAVGjNsZRuuu1HoqTMOFWFpAIpK1xPCA1fBdYNXu0DAjQ3AhHS3eZOLdccDk4oUKSX25x2ROpH6_RlF7eSj0Cm1IPXZmAuFVyO-lGXwfZj7Y5xUrOmH-RzrCJuXml3LA=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/9LJRy9Tm5jz6mdP79) ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4014 "2020-09-27T23:25:47Z")
So Obama paid, in one year, more that Trump paid in a lifetime. Got it. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4015 "2020-09-27T23:27:01Z")
He cheated creditors, he cheated investors, he cheated contractors, he cheated on all three of his wives and he cheated on his taxes. And still the rubes love the worthless piece of shit. Trump supporters are either racist, greedy or stupid, or some combination thereof. There are no honest and well-intentioned reasons to vote for him. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4016 "2020-09-27T23:38:35Z")
I AM SEEN… [![Google Photos](https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/bQebLReYWof7guspTLZgm2hqV5zs3bNepsohQVnSv3U6lXYUI70hXmkNtgl39dCZHuI6DjrqFAFs_nNeepujCZtVYG2qL5JsTVKRR86-dgAchr_zVInNJ7iAuMmjp8vn7oC9dw0zLw=w600-h315-p-k "New item by John Thornton") ](https://photos.app.goo.gl/zLKuthG84R3PfRFv8) ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2020, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4017 "2020-09-27T23:41:09Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > One might imagine the New York Times has seen Trump’s tax returns. > > > [@](#): > > > > President Donald Trump paid just $750 in federal income taxes in both 2016 and 2017, the New York Times reported Sunday, citing tax-return data. > > I wonder for how long those will remain under wraps. There must be dozens of people, at least, who have access to Trump’s tax returns (or substantial portions of them). It may be that one or more of those people see dictatorship looming and have therefore been moved to do something they wouldn’t ordinarily do (i.e. make those returns available to people who will make them public). Similarly, there must be dozens of people, if not more, who have signed non-disclosure agreements relating to their connections with Trump. Some of them might even be women who have had abortions at his command. There must be many people in possession of credible evidence of other malfeasance by Donald. As we get closer to November 3, one or more may believe that the urgency of the situation requires them to come forward. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=199) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=201)