# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making Part Deux (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 22, 2020, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083 "2020-06-22T03:36:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 233
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4658 "2020-10-08T20:23:34Z")
The very same. He won’t be the last, either. ---
**Author:** ![MindsEye\_Watering](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mindseye_watering/32/3619_2.png) [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4659 "2020-10-08T20:24:44Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > And why is he playing an invisible accordion? [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/lhDz8xMXU8s/maxresdefault.jpg "Life Accordion To Trump #4") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhDz8xMXU8s) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4660 "2020-10-08T20:24:55Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I swear I’ve had nothing to drink - yet. You might want to start. I’m not saying 2020 _compels_ one to drink, but it surely gives incentive… ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4661 "2020-10-08T20:30:12Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > I can’t find anything else confirming this, do we know this definitively, other than the circumstantial evidence of his more-than-usually deranged behavior? It seems very strange that he is _still_ on steroids when his doctor claimed he is recovering and symptom-free. It is standard procedure to bring someone off steroids slowly. 1-2 weeks to taper a person off is typical for a typical dose. So I’d expect him to be on them through next week. As the dose goes down you’d expect there person to return to baseline… but if you consider Trump’s “baseline”… ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4662 "2020-10-08T20:35:04Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > > [@solost](#): > > > > He calls Kamala Harris a ‘Communist’ and a ‘monster’. > > Wait, no cutesy nickname? he didn’t call her “nasty”? Clearly, he _is_ slipping. > [@solost](#): > > ‘Communist monster’ ain’t cutesy enough for you? But there’s so much potential here. Leninstein, Marxula, the Maommy, the Creature from the Red Lagoon, Godlesscommunistzilla. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4663 "2020-10-08T20:36:59Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > It is standard procedure to bring someone off steroids slowly. 1-2 weeks to taper a person off is typical for a typical dose. So I’d expect him to be on them through next week. > > As the dose goes down you’d expect there person to return to baseline… but if you consider Trump’s “baseline”… I thought he only had two doses of dex–\. How do you taper off two doses? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4664 "2020-10-08T20:39:27Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > Well, what his doctors said at the weekend sounded like a dose or two of dex on Fri/Sat. I don’t think that would require a taper to wean off them. Speaking as someone who has been on steroids a couple of times for medical reasons… No, you never get just one or two doses. The shortest course I’ve ever known of was 5 days and 1-2 weeks is more typical. > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I thought he only had two doses of dex–. How do you taper off two doses? You don’t - as I said, it’s not just one or two doses. Therapeutic courses of steroids involve a taper. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4665 "2020-10-08T20:41:49Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > You don’t - as I said, it’s not just one or two doses. Therapeutic courses of steroids involve a taper.- He was only there for a couple of days… when did he take it? (I know we don’t know and will never know…) ETA: I took prednisone when I had gout a few months ago. I only took three doses over three days: 20 mg - 20 mg - 10 mg, then the pain stopped so I stopped. \ ---
**Author:** ![solost](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/solost/32/11776_2.png) [@solost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solost)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4666 "2020-10-08T20:41:50Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > > [@El\_Kabong](#): > > > > > [@solost](#): > > > > > > He calls Kamala Harris a ‘Communist’ and a ‘monster’. > > > > Wait, no cutesy nickname? he didn’t call her “nasty”? Clearly, he _is_ slipping. > > > [@solost](#): > > > > ‘Communist monster’ ain’t cutesy enough for you? > > But there’s so much potential here. Leninstein, Marxula, the Maommy, the Creature from the Red Lagoon, Godlesscommunistzilla. I don’t think you can beat @Colibri for “Kommie-la”, though I am kind of partial to “Maommy”. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4667 "2020-10-08T20:46:59Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > ETA: I took prednisone when I had gout a few months ago. I only took three doses over three days: 20 mg - 20 mg - 10 mg, then the pain stopped so I stopped. Well, OK, but withdrawal from steroids is a real thing and while most people will get past it there were undoubtedly effects on you. I find it hard to believe that was on doctor’s instructions - did you just stop because you felt better, or because you were advised to do so? I’ll also point out that dexamethasone is stronger than prednisone, but whatever. People stop taking antibiotics after one or two doses, that doesn’t mean they should. In someone’s Trump’s age and baseline health even less of a good idea. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4668 "2020-10-08T20:55:15Z")
It’s like they’re juggling knives, and people keep throwing in extra knives when they’re already dropping and cutting their hands with the knives they started with. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4669 "2020-10-08T21:02:01Z")
You don’t actually know the dosage protocol for dexamethasone for covid treatment, which has little to do with how you’ve been prescribed it for your ailments. There isn’t tapering. > **[Corticosteroids | COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines](https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/immunomodulators/corticosteroids/)** > > Review results from studies evaluating corticosteroids for the treatment of COVID-19. - On the basis of the preliminary report from the RECOVERY trial, the COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel (the Panel) recommends using **dexamethasone**** 6 mg per day for up to 10 days or until hospital discharge, whichever comes first **, for the treatment of COVID-19 in hospitalized patients who are mechanically ventilated** (AI) **and in hospitalized patients who require supplemental oxygen but who are not mechanically ventilated** (BI)**. - The Panel recommends against using dexamethasone for the treatment of COVID-19 in patients who do not require supplemental oxygen **(AI)**. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4670 "2020-10-08T21:47:32Z")
Pretty standard in chemo to get 1-3 days of dex, no tapering, but again, who knows what dose 45 got/is getting? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4671 "2020-10-08T22:08:42Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Well, OK, but withdrawal from steroids is a real thing and while most people will get past it there were undoubtedly effects on you. I find it hard to believe that was on doctor’s instructions - did you just stop because you felt better, or because you were advised to do so? I know you’re supposed to taper when you’ve been on the steroid for the full course. The doc said it was okay because I had only had two doses and half of a third. I know all about prednisone–my late husband was a kidney transplant recipient and took it every day for eight years. Let’s don’t go into that. > [@needscoffee](#): > > You don’t actually know the dosage protocol for dexamethasone for covid treatment, which has little to do with how you’ve been prescribed it for your ailments. There isn’t tapering. This is what I’m thinking. It’s not exactly like prednisone and not dosed the same way. I’m still falling back on _“Everyone talking about this story at the official level is lying.”_ Works for me. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4672 "2020-10-08T22:09:50Z")
My late fiancé took it for 3 days every two weeks while he was being treated for cancer, starting the day after a particular chemo infusion. ( On the alternating weeks, the chemo was different and he wasn’t given steroids after. ) We had made an assumption that he would be knocked down hard right after the weekly chemo and maybe feel a little better 4-5 days after. It turned out the days he was taking the steroid were his most functional days, by a long shot - so we had to recalibrate our schedules for that. ---
**Author:** ![JayRx1981](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/71e660/32.png) [@JayRx1981](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JayRx1981)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4673 "2020-10-08T22:12:55Z")
The tapering of steroids is a common practice, but it isn’t, strictly speaking, necessary in many cases. Generally, therapeutic courses of steroids which do not exceed 2-3 weeks do not often require tapering, though many prescribers still taper (likely out of an abundance of caution) in those circumstances. There are, of course, exceptions to this (development of cushingoid symptoms, treatment of poison ivy/oak/sumac, disease states which can flare up if the steroid isn’t tapered, very ill/frail patients), but a very short course of even moderately high dose steroid therapy doesn’t require a taper, particularly if that therapy doesn’t exceed 5-7 days. Dexamethasone for the prevention of chemotherapy induced nausea/vomiting, per the NCCN guidelines, is generally only given for 3-4 days without the need for a taper, as an example. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4674 "2020-10-08T22:28:38Z")
Agree. That was an incredibly interesting and thought-provoking discussion. Though I covered that in university a long, long time ago, I basically forgot about it. It does, however, address one possible future with which we might have to deal. ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2020, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4675 "2020-10-08T23:16:18Z")
Trump now says he is in favor of restarting stimulus talks. He has become George Costanza ![](https://media1.tenor.com/images/9210060bcff6160c73a553b4cea4a2e5/tenor.gif?itemid=9288970) ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4676 "2020-10-09T00:41:43Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > And why is he playing an invisible accordion? Donny’s got a squeeze box, nobody can sleep at night… ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2020, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/4677 "2020-10-09T01:39:05Z")
Ok, I have an icy pit in my stomach. Just heard it announced that the Trump cabal intervened to deter Mike Pence from traveling to Indiana tomorrow to make a big show of voting in person. Instead, Pence is recalled to the White House. They won’t say why. I have a bad feeling. Friday night, after all. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=232) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=234)