# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making Part Deux (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 22, 2020, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083 "2020-06-22T03:36:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 351
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7021 "2020-11-27T14:21:08Z")
It shields websites from liability for what users post. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7022 "2020-11-27T14:23:46Z")
He will vacate the White House in two weeks. TWO WEEKS people! Write that down. Two weeks. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7023 "2020-11-27T14:58:06Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > It shields websites from liability for what users post. Unless you’re DiaperDon who can and does call everyone names. National security? You, Trump can move to the front of the line for your time in court. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7024 "2020-11-27T15:01:00Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > He will vacate the White House in two weeks. TWO WEEKS people! Write that down. Two weeks. December 11th? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7025 "2020-11-27T15:18:21Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > He will vacate the White House in two weeks. TWO WEEKS people! Write that down. Two weeks. > [@enipla](#): > > December 11th?- No, no. You misunderstand. It’s _two weeks_ from whatever day it currently is. Get it? And may I remind everyone that he NEVER EVER follows through and in fact, _two weeks_ never comes. \ Maybe it will this time. > Let’s forget about ~~tomorrow~~ two weeks > Let’s forget about ~~tomorrow~~ two weeks > Let’s forget about ~~tomorrow~~ two weeks for ~~tomorrow~~ two weeks never comes > [Domani, forget domani …](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqtyWxh5qWU) ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7026 "2020-11-27T15:35:46Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > And he’s going to make sure he’s in the headlines til the day he dies Fine with me. TRUMP INDICTED BY NEW YORK STATE AG TRUMP ORDERED TO PROVIDE DNA SAMPLE TRUMP FIRES LAWYERS, BEGINS “PRO SE” DEFENSE TRUMP CONVICTED ON ALL COUNTS TRUMP BEGINS PRISON SENTENCE ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7027 "2020-11-27T15:59:18Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > For purposes of National Security, Section 230 must be immediately terminated!!! > [@running\_coach](#): > > It shields websites from liability for what users post. Please, please. I can see Fox, all their talking heads, OAN, Rush, and the rest of the white-wing cult clutching their hearts and gasping for breath - “NO, No, no, nooooooooooo!” ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7028 "2020-11-27T16:00:11Z")
Somebody said, “The Clusterfuck will never be over,” and I have to concur. > **[The Damage Will Last](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/11/trumps-refusal-to-concede-wasnt-some-sideshow/617215/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A%2BTheAtlantic%2B%28The%2BAtlantic%2B-%2BMaster%2BFeed%29)** > > The precedents Trump has set, the doubts he has sown, and the claims he has made will linger. > …This isn’t over, folks. While the decision to begin the transition process does amount to an implicit concession by the president, Trump hasn’t yet explicitly acknowledged his loss—and there [are](https://twitter.com/jeffmason1/status/1331037768848449539) [indications](https://twitter.com/maggieNYT/status/1331049722459656193) he might never do so. As I write, in fact, the president is [continuing](https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1331219093563781122) [to insist](https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1331086969183621120) that the “2020 Election Hoax” will “go down as the most corrupt election in American political history,” that he will continue to press this case, and that he “will never concede to fake ballots & ‘Dominion.’” > > **Trump’s attack on the election wasn’t and isn’t a sideshow. As far as American democracy is concerned, this is the main show.** A democracy at grave risk one day cannot be pronounced healthy the next. The precedents Trump has set, the doubts he has sown, and the claims he has made will linger. Restoring faith in the democratic process will take time and effort—and a favorable result is by no means guaranteed. > > As I [wrote](https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2016/10/trump-election-rigged-democracy/504338/) during the 2016 campaign, when Trump was threatening to not accept a loss to Hillary Clinton, **democracy depends on the consent of the losers.** The capacity of candidates to lose gracefully—or, more specifically, to consent to the winning candidates’ right to govern, and to restrain themselves from stirring up grievances among their supporters—is at the core of democracy. > > As the authors of [_Losers’ Consent_](https://books.google.com/books?id=qMcSDAAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false), a 2005 survey of old and new democracies around the world, pointed out, it’s typical for the losers of an election to be dissatisfied with the results of the race and the democratic process that produced them. … > > At the moment they might be most tempted to subvert democratic institutions, the losers must instead recognize as legitimate a process that just yielded a bad outcome for them. Since winners have much more of an incentive to continue playing the democratic game than losers do, “losers are the crucial veto players of democratic governance,” the authors wrote. > > When I spoke with him ahead of the Trump administration authorizing the transition, Shaun Bowler, one of the co-authors of _Losers’ Consent_ and a political scientist at UC Riverside, told me that he assessed Trump’s refusal to concede as not mere noise but also signal. When a football team loses the Super Bowl, he noted, the defeated players don’t rough up the referees and denounce them and the opposing team as crooked. They don’t seize the cameras as a victorious player declares, “I’m going to Disney World!” and yell, “No, you’re going down!” > > “If you don’t [have] respect for the rules of the game, you don’t play that game anymore,” he explained. > … > > Bowler said it was important to avoid overstating the danger that Trump’s refusal to acknowledge defeat poses to the U.S. political system. But he appended a big caveat to that note of reassurance: There’s no direct precedent in [modern American history](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/19/us/politics/trump-election.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage), or even among other democracies, for what’s happening now in the United States. > … My bold. This fat ~~lady~~ bastard is never gonna sing, and, thank og, eventually he will be gone. But the damage is done. And it will last. > Bowler said his concerns extend beyond Trump to the many ([though](https://www.axios.com/biden-trump-georgia-secretary-of-state-11afac2a-d396-4711-a07c-b188b0b12b7e.html) [not](https://www.npr.org/sections/biden-transition-updates/2020/11/22/937729179/pennsylvania-gop-sen-toomey-says-trump-should-accept-election-loss) [all](https://twitter.com/mittromney/status/1329629701447573504?s=27)) Republican leaders who have supported his unsubstantiated attacks on the integrity of the election. (Republican calls for Trump to concede have [grown louder](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/republicans-call-trump-to-concede-election/) in recent days as states have certified election results.) There might be rational short-term political reasons for why they’re doing so, he allowed, “but there’s a longer-term consequence, which is that they’re standing by while someone denies the legitimacy of the electoral process and they’re saying, [to] varying degrees, ‘Yes, that’s right.’” > … ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7029 "2020-11-27T16:04:32Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > Please, please. I can see Fox, all their talking heads, OAN, Rush, and the rest of the white-wing cult clutching their hearts and gasping for breath - “NO, No, no, nooooooooooo!” Not how that works. Fox, Limbaugh, etc. _are_ responsible for _their_ content. They are _not_ responsible for what others may post in the comments section. ---
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7030 "2020-11-27T16:04:40Z")
Just being paranoid but could this be the turdnugget cherry on top of the steaming stream of shit that is this clusterfuck that Trump wants to leave the rest of us to deal with? > **[Iran's top nuclear scientist killed in apparent assassination, state media...](https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/27/middleeast/iran-top-nuclear-scientist-killed-intl/index.html)** > > Iran's top nuclear scientist, Mohsen Fakhrizadeh, was killed on Friday near Tehran, state media has reported. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7031 "2020-11-27T16:07:28Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > It shields websites from liability for what users post. So, if Trump does this, the first thing that Twitter does is ban his account. Why would they take any chances for being liable for what the idiot says? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7032 "2020-11-27T16:09:06Z")
The last thing Trump thinks about is long-term(2 minutes ahead) consequences. Correction: 2 seconds. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7033 "2020-11-27T16:10:03Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > It’s like watching Bogart play Captain Queeg in the courtroom scene in _The Caine Mutiny_ . If he starts talking about strawberries, he will have gone right over the edge. > ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7034 "2020-11-27T16:21:20Z")
It’s far more likely to be an Israeli operation. They’ve done this sort of thing before, and they have a vested interest in keeping nuclear development in their neighboring (and mostly hostile) states in chaos. ---
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7035 "2020-11-27T16:37:28Z")
Fair point , and it looks like the article has been updated with more info that supports that. I’ll just go back to twitching in the corner. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7036 "2020-11-27T16:37:58Z")
But if section 230 were terminated, they _would_ become responsible for the comments section, wouldn’t they? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7037 "2020-11-27T16:39:49Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > But if section 230 were terminated, they _would_ become responsible for the comments section, wouldn’t they? - That’s my understanding. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7038 "2020-11-27T16:41:34Z")
> [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > Just being paranoid but could this be the turdnugget cherry on top of the steaming stream of shit that is this clusterfuck that Trump wants to leave the rest of us to deal with? That is not being paranoid, history shows that Republicans do like to leave flaming bags of poo for the incoming Democratic administrations. Like The Bay of Pigs, started by Eisenhower and the Somalia intervention started by Bush senior on their last years before leaving office. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7039 "2020-11-27T16:43:42Z")
> [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > Fair point , and it looks like the article has been updated with more info that supports that. > I’ll just go back to twitching in the corner. And if section 230 is terminated, Twitch would be responsible for what you do in the corner! ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2020, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7040 "2020-11-27T16:49:28Z")
Israel is probably in an awkward situation if it were them. That is the sort of thing that would generally be shared with our intelligence agencies, to give us a heads up. But they also know that anything shared with our intelligence agencies is potentially compromised by the current oval office occupant. Whether he whispers the detail of the op in Putin’s ear, or tweets them out for the world, foreign intelligence is no longer safe in the hands of the US. Will he continue to get intelligence briefings once he is out of office? I think that that is standard, but we’ve never had a president who was such a security risk before. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=350) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=352)