# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making Part Deux (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 22, 2020, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083 "2020-06-22T03:36:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 355
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7101 "2020-11-29T00:15:46Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > My guess is that to get a camera-friendly impression of ‘filled to capacity,’ Trump will have to rent a fairly small venue. I’d suggest the smaller banquet room at the Broken Bow, Nebraska Elks Club, AKA Lodge 1688. It’s about 15’ by 25’. Donny should be able to make it look full, by use of careful camera angles. Outdoor event at the Four Seasons in Philadelphia. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7102 "2020-11-29T00:18:35Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Outdoor event at the Four Seasons in Philadelphia. 😉 Before posting, I actually thought through the question of whether the Four Seasons Total Landscaping patio/entranceway/whatever-it-was would be a good venue. But I rejected it. It’s too spacious, and it wouldn’t be possible to make it look full. Well, unless they brought it a few truckloads of mannequins…hmn. Maybe that COULD work! ETA: If Trump can get the mannequins to pay full ticket-price, that would be even better! ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7103 "2020-11-29T00:47:40Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Well, unless they brought it a few truckloads of mannequins… Inflatable dolls from next door. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7104 "2020-11-29T00:48:28Z")
I imagine he will have his rally in Florida, one of the loyal states that voted for him in the election he won. The nice weather will be a plus so more fans can come out. I’d bet DeSantos will attend. With Franklin Graham administering an oath to the “real” president. MAGAs will go wild and then he can go play golf. Rage tweeting will follow after he watches the news. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7105 "2020-11-29T00:48:59Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > That’s what I don’t get. Trump’s a TV guy, right? Doesn’t he understand that unless you’re selling advertising, or being paid by someone who’s selling advertising, the concept of “ratings” is utterly meaningless? He’s the sponsor, The whole point is to boost his ego. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7106 "2020-11-29T02:59:39Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Doesn’t he understand that After all this time, is it not absolutely clear that no matter the rest of the question, the answer is almost always a resounding “no”? I mean, seriously, how long can people continue overestimating his personal ability or intelligence? He does have a form of low animal cunning that has served him quite well, especially in the cesspool that American society has become the last few decades, but ascribing to him even a modest level of introspection or strategic thought at this stage of the game boggles my mind. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7107 "2020-11-29T03:18:57Z")
Interesting piece comparing a dramatization of the Nazi Wannsee Conference to Stephen Miller’s meeting on child separation. I know that comparisons to the Nazis are easy, and overdone, but this one’s got some teeth to it: > **[Stephen Miller and those who enabled him must be investigated and prosecuted](https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2020/11/28/1998756/-I-just-watched-Conspiracy-for-the-second-time-Here-s-exactly-what-it-reminded-me-of?utm_campaign=trending)** > > For those of you who haven’t seen it, Conspiracy is a 2001 BBC/HBO film addressing the infamous 1942 Wannsee Conference, in which Gen. Reinhard Heydrich, on orders of Adolf Hitler, convened a group of 15 high-ranking German officials.... > [@](#): > > For those of you who haven’t seen it,[“Conspiracy”](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/17504902.2019.1637492) is a 2001 BBC/HBO film addressing the infamous 1942 Wannsee Conference in which General Reinhard Heydrich, upon orders of Adolf Hitler, convened a group of fifteen high-ranking German officials to set forth the parameters of what became known as “The Final Solution,” the comprehensive and systematic plan to exterminate all Jews from the continent of Europe. > > … > > The juxtaposition of fifteen men sitting around an oval-shaped conference table, alternately breaking for refreshments and wine, then returning to discuss the logistical necessities, facts and figures relating to the identification and classification of Jews, the proposed means of transport for their “evacuation” and ultimately the efficiencies of various means of murdering them, is beyond jarring—it’s fairly horrifying. The acting (Heydrich is played by Kenneth Branagh; Wilhelm Stuckart, the author of the Third Reich’s racial laws, is played by Colin Firth, and Adolf Eichmann by Stanley Tucci) is superior and riveting; you forget rather quickly that the entirety of the action revolves around a seemingly dry bureaucratic discussion around a conference table. > > …In 2018, the current administration held a meeting, doubtlessly around an oblong conference table, in which it was calmly determined to forcibly and permanently separate children, many as young as babies, from their parents after those parents had been stopped following unlawfully crossing-- or attempting to cross–over the border into the United States from Mexico. > The meeting was held at the instigation of one of Donald Trump’s senior policy advisors, Stephen Miller, who was unquestionably operating to implement the specific policy aims of Donald Trump. Miller’s rabid xenophobia and anti-immigrant rhetoric had by that time (and has still) conferred upon him the unusual distinction of being one of the few members of Trump’s inner circle to have kept his position throughout Trump’s entire tenure. > > As the NBC news report explains, the U.S. Justice Department under the orders of Jeff Sessions had already implemented Miller’s preferred “zero tolerance” policy towards prosecuting any undocumented immigrants captured crossing the U.S. border, a radical departure from decades of prior practice covering multiple U.S. administrations. Yet, as Julia Ainsley and Jacob Soboroff of NBC News reported, the forced separation between parents and their young children had not yet been put into place. According to the report, Miller was “furious at the delay,” and had convened a meeting to emphasize his authority. > > Those present at the meeting were Attorney General Jeff Sessions, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, Secretary of Health and Human Services Alex Azar, and Department of Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen. According to NBC’s sources, other participants may have included White House counsel Don McGahn, Deputy Chief of Staff Chris Liddell, and representatives of Vice President Pence’s office. > > Nielsen, much like several of the participants at Wannsee nearly eighty years ago, had some issues she wanted to air out concerning the logistics. Specifically, she bemoaned the fact that DHS had insufficient resources to implement the separation process, in which children so taken from their parents would be removed to isolated separate facilities. Hers were practical objections, and she noted that the ability of her agency to ultimately return these essentially kidnapped children to their parents was in doubt. She warned that the process could “get messy,” and could end up in children getting “lost” in a system of holding pens, without any recourse. > > These complaints did not find a willing audience in Miller, who not only did not perceive any inherent moral issues with separating children from their parents, but in fact wanted to accelerate and expand the process, so that such separated children would ultimately number in the tens of thousands. > … > Back at the Cabinet meeting, a frustrated and angry Miller accused Nielsen of “stalling” and demanded that all present demonstrate their loyalty to the policy by a show of hands. Incidentally, the participants at Wannsee were also required to voice their assent for “the policy,” which they dutifully affirmed with varying degrees of enthusiasm (this is one of the more gut-churning events in the film). > > With the exception of Nielsen, who still clung to her logistical objections, all hands went up. > … > Thus did our lawfully elected government enter on a course that at this count, has left over 600 children permanently separated from their parents, ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7108 "2020-11-29T04:10:11Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > I know that comparisons to the Nazis are easy, and overdone, but this one’s got some teeth to it: Yes, but they are sometimes quite apt. And that should rightly horrify us. As should the fact that more people than we thought possible think the Nazi philosophy wasn’t actually all that bad. It’s just the word “Nazi” as epithet they care about. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7109 "2020-11-29T05:07:33Z")
Pennsylvania Supreme Court unanimously throws out Republican motion to declare mail in voting unconstitutional in the state. > **[Pa. Supreme Court Dismisses Request From Mike Kelly And Sean Parnell To...](https://www.cbsnews.com/pittsburgh/news/pennsylvania-supreme-court-dismisses-mike-kelly-and-sean-parnell-request/)** > > The PA Supreme Court has dismissed the Mike Kelly-Sean Parnell lawsuit that wanted to disqualify millions of no-excuse mail-in votes in the state. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7110 "2020-11-29T05:44:39Z")
In this [article on the PA decision,](https://www.wtae.com/article/pa-supreme-court-dismisses-lawsuit-to-throw-out-mail-in-ballots/34811647) this little nugget of a quote: > [@](#): > > “It is not our role to lend legitimacy to such transparent and untimely efforts to subvert the will of Pennsylvania voters. Courts should not decide elections when the will of the voters is clear,” Justice Wecht wrote. Anyhoos… The longer all this shit goes on, as truth-denying Trumpers back it, the more difficult it’s becoming to resist from writing off this demographic as completely worthless, toxic excuses for “citizenry”, who, on the one hand, more or less contribute to the overall workings of society, but on the other, over time, will go down on the wrong side of history, which many of them deep down _do_ realise with their “fuck your feelings” core approach to things. These never-to-be-reachable subhumans know exactly who the fuck they are, and because they own it, I will acknowledge accordingly. or should that be “accordiOngly?” 🙄 It’s the only thing that президент Trump has ever thoroughly accomplished: rooting out all the scumbags in the US and giving them voice, whatever their choice of well-known poisons may be. And with a psychotic pipfuck like Steven Miller lording over and orchestrating a lot of the shit going on over the last four years - this fucker’s simpy gotta be stopped. And eventually held accountable. /end of rant ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7111 "2020-11-29T19:46:45Z")
The crowd at his rally will look especially large because he will hold the rally in the tweetroom. ---
**Author:** ![SoToasty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sotoasty/32/2803_2.png) [@SoToasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoToasty)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7112 "2020-11-29T20:00:39Z")
Or possibly [Whitehouse Landscaping](https://www.whitehouselandscaping.com) ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7113 "2020-11-29T21:19:13Z")
The final results of the Wisconsin recount are in, and Individual 1 lost over 80 votes. And now he says he’s going to file a lawsuit to challenge the recount. > ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7114 "2020-11-29T21:51:40Z")
It occurs to me that he’s putting more effort and energy day in and day out into this election BS than he ever did into being president. Which is really paradoxical because if he (perish the thought!) did get the results overturned and he magically got to stay president, well, then he’d go back to doing absolutely nothing. 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7115 "2020-11-29T21:56:29Z")
Trump did plenty, and it was far worse than absolutely nothing. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2020, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7116 "2020-11-29T22:00:30Z")
Where is that sarcasm tag? Obviously, I meant he didn’t do a credible job as president, but he is working very hard, not to mention diligently and tirelessly at _keeping_ the job that he basically showed no interest in doing while he had it. But then we all know it’s BEING president that interests him, not doing stuff a president is supposed to do. Oh never mind. It loses something if you have to explain it. 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7117 "2020-11-30T00:12:04Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > > [@Sherrerd](#): > > > > Well, unless they brought it a few truckloads of mannequins… > > Inflatable dolls from next door. Perfect! And of course if there is still a need for bodies to fill out the photos, the crematorium could donate a few that have not yet enjoyed the service they provide… ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7118 "2020-11-30T00:40:57Z")
Individual l1 is furious that the FBI hasn’t helped him overturn the election results. [Trump attacks FBI for not helping him overturn election result: ‘They just move on’ | The Independent](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-election-2020/trump-interview-fox-election-results-fbi-b1763539.html)? ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7119 "2020-11-30T00:43:30Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > It occurs to me that he’s putting more effort and energy day in and day out into this election BS than he ever did into being president. I respectfully disagree. All Trump himself seems to be doing is emitting a few Tweets. An ever-changing bunch of ambulance-chasing lawyers are doing all the heavy lifting. I seriously doubt Trump has read a single word of any of the numerous election-related lawsuits filed in his name and wouldn’t understand them if he did. OK. I’ll meet you halfway. He’s half-assing this just about about to the same degree he’s half-assed his entire Presidency. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2020, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/7120 "2020-11-30T01:01:34Z")
I respectfully disagree with your respectful disagreement. His presidency could be uniquely characterized by the attitude of not giving a shit about much of anything except golf (and not even that, really, because he cheats at it). All he really did was rubber-stamp Supreme Court justices that far-right ideologues wanted appointed, and sign EOs with a Sharpie that he felt would win him the adoration of hateful bigots. But winning this election is something he really does care about, because his ego demands it, hence the nonstop ranting about “massive fraud” and organizing this team of all the crooked lawyers that money – or promises of money – can buy. He cares desperately about not having to admit that he’s a loser who lost, no matter what, and no matter how he manages to avoid it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=354) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=356)