# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making Part Deux (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 22, 2020, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083 "2020-06-22T03:36:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 98
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1950 "2020-08-06T12:12:43Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Because Trump would say, “China is paying the tariffs. It’s on record. You can look it up. You just don’t understand how economics works the way I do. I see the big picture.” > > Would Trump be right? Of course not. He’s one hundred percent wrong. He’d be wrong but not 100% wrong in my opinion. If Chinese imports could sell at the new price with the tariffs included they already would have been. They will sell less at the new, higher, prices. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1951 "2020-08-06T12:31:12Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > On the other, anyone who find Jacob Wohl not only attractive but worth dating has already demonstrated phenomenally poor judgement so it may not matter. This is exactly the kind of misogynist crap we need less of around here. I’m assuming, from the tone, you were not even _aware_ of how misogynist this is. A woman’s worth is NOT dependent on how attractive she is, or isn’t, to any man. It is completely irrelevant as to whether or not she is capable of doing her job (outside fashion model and/or whore, which Wohl is neither). Please STOP doing this. It is hurtful and offensive even if that is not what you intended. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1952 "2020-08-06T12:41:50Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > A woman’s worth is NOT dependent on how attractive she is, or isn’t, to any man. While this is true, I’m not finding how it is relevant to the post you are quoting, which is about Jacob Wohl’s attractiveness to women. Still sexist but not in the way you seem to have taken. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1953 "2020-08-06T12:48:46Z")
It’s misogynist because it reduces a woman’s worth to her attractiveness. While I did misread the genders involved, it is just as misogynistic to imply a woman’s worth is based on her attractiveness as a dating/sexual partner to other women as to other men. It is still judging a woman solely on her gender and not on anything relevant to what she does for a living or for a cause. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1954 "2020-08-06T12:52:04Z")
I’m not seeing it - it seems to me that the post in question was attaching worth to the woman’s judgement on who _she_ would date, and that seems entirely gender neutral to me (with the caveat that men who date “ugly” woman are often made fun of). ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1955 "2020-08-06T12:54:51Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > This is exactly the kind of misogynist crap we need less of around here. I’m assuming, from the tone, you were not even _aware_ of how misogynist this is. A woman’s worth is NOT dependent on how attractive she is, or isn’t, to any man. It is completely irrelevant as to whether or not she is capable of doing her job (outside fashion model and/or whore, which Wohl is neither). > > Please STOP doing this. It is hurtful and offensive even if that is not what you intended. I suspect there is a crossed wire here. I didn’t say or imply anything about “how attractive she is, or isn’t, to any man”. I didn’t say anything about her appearance or her “worth” or her job at all, only about her judgement. Let me clarify: Jacob Wohl is a demonstrably terrible person, as his long string of ludicrous failures to smear Mueller and various Democrats - repeatedly humiliating himself in the process - has more than amply proven. He has publicly peddled the most egregious and obvious falsehoods time and time again and shows no sign of ever acknowledging his misdeeds. And yet Corrigan appears to have found him not merely trustworthy but worth engaging in a romantic relationship with, despite the fact that he has shown himself to be a morally-bankrupt idiot and a bald-faced liar. IMO this demonstrates extremely poor judgement on her part. She now claims this was due to “naivete and inexperience” on her part which may well be true, but doesn’t refute my point. And if the issue is that I was surprised that Corrigan found Wohl “attractive”, I’ll merely add that 1) Wohl is a man, and 2) I was referring to him as a horrible person overall, not his specific physical appearance. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1956 "2020-08-06T12:55:04Z")
> [@Great\_Antibob](#): > > While this is true, I’m not finding how it is relevant to the post you are quoting, which is about Jacob Wohl’s attractiveness to women. Still sexist but not in the way you seem to have taken. > [@Folacin](#): > > I’m not seeing it - it seems to me that the post in question was attaching worth to the woman’s judgement on who _she_ would date, and that seems entirely gender neutral to me (with the caveat that men who date “ugly” woman are often made fun of). I agree with both of these. Criticism totally valid in an absolute sense, but misplaced here. Suggest you graciously admit it @Broomstick and move on. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1957 "2020-08-06T12:57:38Z")
“I will not be participating in any press conferences as claimed in my name, and will have nothing to do with individuals who forced me to hand over my devices so they could control me and the output in my name. Due to naivete and inexperience, I became involved with people who abused my trust, conned me, and claimed they were working in my interest. I became powerless in a situation, and I deeply regret not reaching out to people who knew better, or could help me.” The Repulsican boilerplate statement for future DumpserFire syncophants. Also: “I was only following orders.” ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1958 "2020-08-06T13:02:10Z")
This question has been raised somewhere-- I can’t remember where. But it’s very important (my bold): > … Nearly everyone involved in reporting on, analyzing or forecasting the upcoming presidential election agrees that Donald Trump could win another term in office. But no one save his most dedicated sycophants thinks he could do so with a majority of the public on his side. We have accepted, as a matter of course, that Trump could be constitutionally re-elected through the Electoral College, but not democratically selected by the voting public. > > That’s how he won in 2016, and the reason is straightforward. Enough of the president’s base is concentrated in swing states like Florida, Michigan, Pennsylvania and Wisconsin. Because of that fact, **he can lose by [as many as five million votes](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/how-trump-could-lose-5-million-votes-still-win-2020-n1031601) and still win an Electoral College majority.** > … The article linked to is from a year ago, but still valid. This quote is from this opinion piece: > **[Opinion | Trump Doesn’t Need the Most Votes. What if He Doesn’t Even Want...](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/04/opinion/trump-2020-electoral-college.html)** > > Government of the minority, chosen by a minority, on behalf of a minority, is not what Lincoln had in mind at Gettysburg. > … It was clear from the start of his administration that Trump saw his Electoral College advantage as license for an intentionally divisive style of politics, stoking anger and racial prejudice whenever it seemed politically advantageous. He bases key governing decisions on whether he won a state or group of states in the previous election. If the United States does not have a national strategy for the pandemic, it is at least in part because — as a report in Vanity Fair suggests — the administration originally believed the problem was [restricted to “blue” states.](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/07/how-jared-kushners-secret-testing-plan-went-poof-into-thin-air) > > All of this has obviously carried over into the president’s re-election campaign. Trump has made no attempt to win a majority of voters, no effort to bring a skeptical public to his side. Instead, he has directed his energy toward suppressing opposition in hopes of winning by technical knockout for a second time. His chief target right now is the United States Postal Service, whose operation, it almost goes without saying, is critical for the success of mail-in voting. > … IOW trump doesn’t give a rat’s ass about a popular majority. He knows he doesn’t have it and doesn’t really need it. He’s not a president of the people and plans to win not by wooing the public but by crushing the opposition and even the undecideds. No surprises here-- he’s been this way his whole life. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1959 "2020-08-06T13:19:00Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > … It was clear from the start of his administration that Trump saw his Electoral College advantage as license for an intentionally divisive style of politics, stoking anger and racial prejudice whenever it seemed politically advantageous Note: the above is a quote from the Times, that Thelma quoted. I disagree with the article from the Times. Trump fell ass first into a position that he really didn’t want. And certainly didn’t know what was involved in being President. He was mad about NBC cancelling his show and needed attention as most 5 year old children do. He certainly didn’t see Electoral College advantage, or had had the faintest idea what it was. He happened to tune into a bunch of idiots that saw him as some sort of leader. When in fact he’s just a stupid blowhard. The man is a moron that only has the ability to create ruins. That’s his only ‘skill’. Well, that and running away from any responsibility. I guess that’s his greatest skill. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1960 "2020-08-06T13:25:08Z")
He could lose the popular vote by 5 to10 million and still win the electoral college. He could lose by that margin or even more and raise enough doubts about the legitimacy of the election to convince allies to play constitutional hardball on his behalf in an attempt to steal the election. He and his team have accepted from the beginning that they will never win the majority of voters. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1961 "2020-08-06T13:27:21Z")
It doesn’t matter how he may have stumbled into this position; what matters is the situation he’s in now, and the reality is that if he loses power, he probably loses his wealth and even his freedom. Others around him are in some potential legal jeopardy as well. And even if they weren’t, power is intoxicating. It’s not just Trump that keeps Trump in power; everyone who supports him is committed to remaining in power as well. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1962 "2020-08-06T13:29:50Z")
Completely agree. He does see that if he loses he may end up in courtrooms for the rest of his life. Legal jeopardy he does understand. It’s his entire business model. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1963 "2020-08-06T13:29:57Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I agree with both of these. Criticism totally valid in an absolute sense, but misplaced here. Suggest you graciously admit it @Broomstick and move on. What happened was that I got the genders mixed around, in which case, yes, my bad. For some reason I though Wohl was a woman, not a man. On the other hand, saying “anyone who would judge someone by whether or not they were willing to date someone” in a political discussion is tacky at best. One’s suitability as a dating/sex/marriage partner is irrelevant in a political discussion. ---
**Author:** ![icon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c6cbf5/32.png) [@icon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/icon)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1964 "2020-08-06T13:30:57Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > IOW trump doesn’t give a rat’s ass about a popular majority. He knows he doesn’t have it and doesn’t really need it. He’s not a president of the people and plans to win not by wooing the public but by crushing the opposition and even the undecideds. No surprises here-- he’s been this way his whole life. I don’t think it is accurate that Trump doesn’t care about the popular majority, he doesn’t need it, but he certainly cares. He cared enough last time to say that 3 million votes for Hilary had to have been fraudulent. He very much cares about being popular, which is why he always crows about the size of his rallies, because in his mind, it shows that he is very popular despite what statistics and reality says. `//i\\` ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1965 "2020-08-06T13:54:35Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > “A house divided against itself, cannot stand.” Abraham Lincoln > > “The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.” Franklin D. Roosevelt > > “We are the ones we’ve been waiting for. We are the change that we seek.” Barack Obama [“It is what it is.”](https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/04/politics/trump-covid-death-toll-is-what-it-is/index.html) DJT ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1966 "2020-08-06T13:58:55Z")
> [@Daniel Tosh](#): > > My girlfriend says we’d have less arguments if I didn’t correct her all the time. I said ‘fewer’. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1967 "2020-08-06T14:09:07Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > On the other hand, saying “anyone who would judge someone by whether or not they were willing to date someone” in a political discussion is tacky at best. One’s suitability as a dating/sex/marriage partner is irrelevant in a political discussion. Wow; you’re still missing the point: the comment was about Miss Corrigan’s judgement. We all like you; please just stop with this embarrassing argument now. ---
**Author:** ![Frazzled](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frazzled/32/3368_2.png) [@Frazzled](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frazzled)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1968 "2020-08-06T14:54:14Z")
Mike Pence believes John Roberts is a disappointment to conservatives. Seeing his quote below I’m reminded of the wise words of Tywin Lannister, “everything said before the ‘but’ doesn’t count”. I may be reading too much into it\*, but it seems to me that this batch of Republicans doesn’t see the court as a means to responsible and considered checks and balances. Instead, they want all power to stem from the Executive and Legislative branch (assuming a Republican is in charge) and then rubber stamp whatever self serving “law” they spew. Is this legal? In the words of Emperor Palapatine, “I’ll make it Legal”. Jesus, these guys are openly playing the villains and their fans love it. But this is exactly why the constitution limits the power of each branch of government. > Vice President Mike Pence described Chief Justice John Roberts in a new interview as a “disappointment” to conservative voters, explicitly seeking to cast the Supreme Court as a campaign issue ahead of the November election. > > **“Look, we have great respect for the institution of the Supreme Court of the United States,”** Pence [told] the Christian Broadcasting Network’s David Brody on Wednesday. **“But Chief Justice John Roberts has been a disappointment to conservatives** — whether it be the Obamacare decision, or whether it be a spate of recent decisions all the way through Calvary Chapel.” > **[Pence blasts Chief Justice John Roberts as ‘disappointment to conservatives’](https://www.politico.com/news/2020/08/06/pence-john-roberts-disappointment-to-conservatives-392202)** > > The vice president’s criticism comes after Roberts sided with the Supreme Court’s Democratic appointees on several occasions in recent months. - I’m not reading too much into it ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2020, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083/1969 "2020-08-06T14:56:09Z")
> [@Frazzled](#): > > …it seems to me that this batch of Republicans doesn’t see the court as a means to responsible and considered checks and balances… Ya think? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=97) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making-part-deux-part-1/911083.md?page=99)