# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1311
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26205 "2018-10-03T22:24:16Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > … He generates cash because he knows how to draw attention to himself. He knows people love a good spectacle. > … I seriously question how much cash he has. In the bank, probably not nearly as much as he wants us to think. And in his pockets? He’s one of those guys who never has cash on him and the people with him always have to pick up the tab. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26206 "2018-10-03T22:38:06Z")
Everyone really needs to read this article. The scope of criminal behavior exhibited by the Trump Crime Family is astounding. These parasites sucked every available penny out of Fred’s real estate empire while simultaneously using every legal and illegal tax dodge possible. Again, read it: > **[Trump Engaged in Suspect Tax Schemes as He Reaped Riches From His Father...](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-schemes-fred-trump.html)** > > The president has long sold himself as a self-made billionaire, but a Times investigation found that he received at least $413 million in today’s dollars from his father’s real estate empire, much of it through tax dodges in the 1990s. Donald Trump is a bloodsucking parasite whose wealth is derived off the backs of hard working New Yorkers. They paid their rent. And you know, that unlike the Trumps, they paid their taxes. We all know what happens to regular folks who break the rules. When organized crime families like the Trumps do it, they just get richer. Donald Trump, like Madoff and Milken et al before him, belongs in a prison cell. Lock him up. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26207 "2018-10-03T23:11:40Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > … the statute of limitations has expired on the particular cases of fraud outlined in the report. … I don’t have a citation on this yet–I heard someone on one of the cable shows mention it, but it doesn’t seem to be online yet. But the gist is: watch Trump’s tweets and remarks on this topic. The theory is that Trump himself could reactivate one of these old cases by making statements specifically denying the charges in the NYT story. _The statute-of-limitations clock could be re-started_ if Trump commits an overt act (including verbal denials) intended to cover up past acts. If true, Trump would have to submit every tweet for vetting before he hits ‘send,’ to prevent the disaster of re-activating a potential fraud case against him. How he’d hate that! ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2018, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26208 "2018-10-03T23:33:00Z")
> [@Llama\_Llogophile](#): > > Here’s an excerpt from [Michael Lewis’ new book, about the Trump transition team.](https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/sep/27/this-guy-doesnt-know-anything-the-inside-story-of-trumps-shambolic-transition-team) > > Pretty depressing reading. Taking Lewis’ assertions as factually correct for the moment, what I found interesting is that Trump never fires anyone face to face. It’s always an intermediary. I posted some of this in another thread about this book in Elections but I don’t think that thread is going anywhere. I got the book and finished it in one day. Michael Lewis is one of my favorite writers and I found this book very compelling. It’s not really “another Trump book”. And it’s not about the transition, except for the first chapter. The quoted anecdotes about the transition are possibly the only direct mention of Trump in the book. (I’m guessing Chris Christie was the source behind those.) The book is an exploration of the missions behind the various federal agencies (DOE, USDA, Dept of Commerce) that compose the “Deep State” and the ways in which they are being threatened by an incompetent executive branch. Lewis spends most of the book talking with administrators in these agencies, profiling them and describing their projects. Incredibly important stuff that no one ever thinks about. For example, the USDA underwrites billions of dollars in loans for rural development. These loans are made to municipalities and private businesses for things like fire stations and medical clinics and water treatment and telecom in small towns and rural areas - services that are needed but aren’t necessarily profitable or low risk enough to attract private investment. The thing is, the beneficiaries of these loans often don’t even know that they are getting a government loan. The loans are administered via banks, who identify applicants that qualify for these loans. In the name of streamlining, this Rural Development program is being moved into the Office of the Secretary. The official Lewis interviewed suspects that they want to get their hands on the 200 billion dollar loan portfolio in order to sell it to their Wall Street friends. The program will become privatized and benefits will go to bankers instead of to the citizens that the programs are supposed to help. There is a similar situation with happening with the vast amount of data accumulated by the Department of Commerce. This data is used heavily in weather forecasting, firefighting and farming applications. Private industry wants to restrict the free availability of this data as they greatly profit from applications that use this data. And it’s important, for example, if it weren’t for journalists poring through publicly available Medicare and Medicaid data we probably wold think even know we had an opioid epidemic. The one thing that struck me was that the large majority of the vast number of programs that are being threatened exist to benefit areas that are typically very politically conservative. Because business and industry in urban areas have much better access to capital markets, a much larger tax base at the state and local level, and are much less dependent on the vagaries of climate, weather and nature in general. Which made me feel better and worse at the same time. And I fear that the interview Lewis did with the guy at the USDA in charge of the food stamp program will end his career ( the bureaucrat’s career, not Lewis’s ). Because the guy talked about maximizing participation among the eligible population as being a goal of the program. And he talked about how frustrating it was when state executives and legislators try to torpedo those efforts. It’s a really good book, and it’s not centered around Trump’s antics. TLDR - I think he should’ve called the book “You Didn’t Build That”. This is a important book, you need to read it. ---
**Author:** ![Turek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/turek/32/18782_2.png) [@Turek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Turek)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26209 "2018-10-04T00:11:35Z")
> [@Skywatcher](#): > > “That wasn’t mockery!” - [Sarah the Huckster](https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/03/politics/white-house-trump-ford-defense/index.html) From earlier in that press conference: > [@The Fucking Hypocrite](#): > > On the night President Trump nominated Judge Brett Kavanaugh, Senator Schumer declared the Democrats would oppose this nomination with everything they had. Before a single document was produced, a single meeting with the senator, or a hearing was ever scheduled, Chuch Schumer and the Senate Democrats telegraphed a strategy to throw the kitchen sink at the judge, with no regard for the process, decency, or standards. They’re not opposed to Judge Kavanaugh’s judicial views; **they’re literally trying to undercut the voice of the American people when they elected Donald Trump**. ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME, YOU FUCKING HYPOCRITE??? What do you think Mitch “The Turtle” McConnell did with Merrick Garland’s nomination, if it wasn’t “undercutting the voice of the American people?” She makes me want to puke every time she opens that gaping maw in her face. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26210 "2018-10-04T00:17:27Z")
Also: Popular vote. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26211 "2018-10-04T03:22:15Z")
> [@Superdude](#): > > [https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/02/politics/trump-mocks-christine-blasey-ford-kavanaugh-supreme-court/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/02/politics/trump-mocks-christine-blasey-ford-kavanaugh-supreme-court/index.html) > > > [@National Disgrace](#): > > > > Before the crowd Tuesday night in Southaven, Mississippi, Trump imitated Ford during her testimony, mocking her for not knowing the answers to questions such as how she had gotten to the high school party where she says Supreme Court nominee Brett Kavanaugh sexually assaulted her. > > > > “I had one beer. Well, do you think it was – nope, it was one beer,” Trump said, mimicking Ford’s testimony last week to the Senate Judiciary Committee. > > > > “How did you get home? I don’t remember. How’d you get there? I don’t remember. Where is the place? I don’t remember. How many years ago was it? I don’t know.” > **[Trump Can't Remember 'World's Greatest Memory' Boast](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/trump-u-lawsuit-deposition-trump-can-t-remember-world-s-n597986)** > > He cited memory lapses 59 times during the December deposition, a transcript from which was released on Wednesday. > [@](#): > > Donald Trump claims to have a world-class memory, but it certainly wasn’t on display during his deposition for a lawsuit over Trump University. > > “I don’t remember,” Trump told lawyers 35 times during his December testimony, which was released on Wednesday. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26212 "2018-10-04T03:23:21Z")
Where are your compassion and humanity, Mr. President? “I don’t remember.” ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26213 "2018-10-04T03:29:50Z")
Impossible to miss what you never had. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26214 "2018-10-04T13:03:25Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > I dare you to tell someone from the UK or Germany that private rail is better than public rail. If you’re talking about the provision of passenger rail services in the UK, it’s a “swings and roundabouts” situation - British Rail wasn’t exactly a paragon of public service either. If you’re talking about the infrastructure, yeah, Railtrack was a fucking stupid idea. > [@ThelmaLou](#): > > What do you think the “H” stands for? Humperdoo. > [@asahi](#): > > The Russians (and perhaps Deutsche Bank) have him now. DB was one of the few banks that would actually do business with him, and one can only speculate as to why they’d agree to do that. That’d be the same Deutsche Bank recently under investigation for facilitating money laundering activity, no? ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26215 "2018-10-04T13:43:00Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > The book is an exploration of the missions behind the various federal agencies (DOE, USDA, Dept of Commerce) that compose the “Deep State” and the ways in which they are being threatened by an incompetent executive branch. Lewis spends most of the book talking with administrators in these agencies, profiling them and describing their projects. Incredibly important stuff that no one ever thinks about. A recurring theme in Lewis’s work is the issue of _complexity._ Over and over he explores the impact of things being more complex that people can understand. “The Big Short” and a lot of his shorter works about the fiscal crisis delve at length into the fact that financial instruments had become so bizarrely convoluted that most people in the financial industry had no idea what they were doing. “Moneyball” is about the difficulty in measuring how good people are, or aren’t, at their jobs. “the Undoing Project” talks about two scientists who found that human behaviour is much harder to understand than basically every economist in the world realized. I have only read one part of the book so I’m interested in how he ties it together, but if you think about it, to a lot of Trumpists, Trump is the manifestation of a very common fantasy, of the outsider who can fix the government because everyone in the government’s crazy and just a little common sense will do. It’s like that scene in “Dave” where Kevin Kline and Charles Grodin fix the U.S. federal budget in one evening over beers and pizza because they’re Just Guys and all the government people are idiots. It’s fun but it’s exactly as logical and realistic as “Guardians of the Galaxy” and exactly as smart in real life as having your dog perform your heart surgery. Government is much more complicated than anyone can comprehend and you need experts and insiders to run it. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26216 "2018-10-04T14:33:42Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > I posted some of this in another thread about this book in Elections but I don’t think that thread is going anywhere. > > I got the book and finished it in one day. Michael Lewis is one of my favorite writers and I found this book very compelling. > > TLDR - I think he should’ve called the book “You Didn’t Build That”. This is a important book, you need to read it. Thanks for the review. I also enjoy reading his books and look forward to getting this one. My small library only has one copy - I’m on the wait list. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26217 "2018-10-04T14:42:41Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > I posted some of this in another thread about this book in Elections but I don’t think that thread is going anywhere. > > I got the book and finished it in one day. Michael Lewis is one of my favorite writers and I found this book very compelling. > > It’s not really “another Trump book”. And it’s not about the transition, except for the first chapter. The quoted anecdotes about the transition are possibly the only direct mention of Trump in the book. (I’m guessing Chris Christie was the source behind those.) > > The book is an exploration of the missions behind the various federal agencies (DOE, USDA, Dept of Commerce) that compose the “Deep State” and the ways in which they are being threatened by an incompetent executive branch. Lewis spends most of the book talking with administrators in these agencies, profiling them and describing their projects. Incredibly important stuff that no one ever thinks about. > > For example, the USDA underwrites billions of dollars in loans for rural development. These loans are made to municipalities and private businesses for things like fire stations and medical clinics and water treatment and telecom in small towns and rural areas - services that are needed but aren’t necessarily profitable or low risk enough to attract private investment. > > The thing is, the beneficiaries of these loans often don’t even know that they are getting a government loan. The loans are administered via banks, who identify applicants that qualify for these loans. > > In the name of streamlining, this Rural Development program is being moved into the Office of the Secretary. The official Lewis interviewed suspects that they want to get their hands on the 200 billion dollar loan portfolio in order to sell it to their Wall Street friends. The program will become privatized and benefits will go to bankers instead of to the citizens that the programs are supposed to help. > > There is a similar situation with happening with the vast amount of data accumulated by the Department of Commerce. This data is used heavily in weather forecasting, firefighting and farming applications. Private industry wants to restrict the free availability of this data as they greatly profit from applications that use this data. And it’s important, for example, if it weren’t for journalists poring through publicly available Medicare and Medicaid data we probably wold think even know we had an opioid epidemic. > > The one thing that struck me was that the large majority of the vast number of programs that are being threatened exist to benefit areas that are typically very politically conservative. Because business and industry in urban areas have much better access to capital markets, a much larger tax base at the state and local level, and are much less dependent on the vagaries of climate, weather and nature in general. Which made me feel better and worse at the same time. > > And I fear that the interview Lewis did with the guy at the USDA in charge of the food stamp program will end his career ( the bureaucrat’s career, not Lewis’s ). > Because the guy talked about maximizing participation among the eligible population as being a goal of the program. And he talked about how frustrating it was when state executives and legislators try to torpedo those efforts. > It’s a really good book, and it’s not centered around Trump’s antics. > > TLDR - I think he should’ve called the book “You Didn’t Build That”. This is a important book, you need to read it. I believe I’ve linked to this before, but a good bit of the transition story at the USDA was previously published in **Vanity Fair** : [“Inside Trump’s Cruel Campaign Against the U.S.D.A.’s Scientists”](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/11/usda-food-stamps-school-lunch-trump-administration). It’s quite eye-opening. ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26218 "2018-10-04T15:29:46Z")
> [@Max\_Torque](#): > > I believe I’ve linked to this before, but a good bit of the transition story at the USDA was previously published in **Vanity Fair** : [“Inside Trump’s Cruel Campaign Against the U.S.D.A.’s Scientists”](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/11/usda-food-stamps-school-lunch-trump-administration). It’s quite eye-opening. Same author. He’s published much of the book material already. This article, which focuses on the Department of Energy, is in the same series: [Why the Scariest Nuclear Threat May Be Coming from Inside the White House | Vanity Fair](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/07/department-of-energy-risks-michael-lewis/amp) ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26219 "2018-10-04T19:33:50Z")
Anyone here familiar with the Gamble v United States case coming before the Supreme Court? Some of my conspiracy-minded friends mentioned it to me. In a nutshell, the theory goes that the case above could possibly give the President the power to pardon state crimes if it overlaps with a federal crime or prevent prosecution if there’s already a federal pardon. Kavanaugh would be predicted to vote for this. The result would be that Trump could then pardon federal and state crimes and use this newly granted power to try to effectively shut down the Russia probe. Could a Case Currently Before the Supreme Court Result in a Stronger Presidential Pardon? > **[Could a Case Currently Before the Supreme Court Result in a Stronger...](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-gamble-court-case/)** > > Gamble v. United States concerns a felon who was arrested for possession of a firearm. It could also have significant bearing on the President’s much vaunted pardon power. > [@](#): > > **Gamble v. United States concerns a felon who was arrested for possession of a firearm. It could also have significant bearing on the President’s much vaunted pardon power.** > > **Why Would President Trump Be Interested in the Outcome of This Case?** > The reason Gamble v. United States is generating buzz from people other than constitutional law scholars is that the separate sovereigns exception also prevents President Trump from pardoning people for state crimes. Under current Supreme Court precedent, a presidential pardon of an individual does not prevent that individual from being prosecuted for the same or similar crimes under state law. “Under the dual sovereignty doctrine,” Adam J. Adler wrote in the Yale Law Review, “as long as two offenses are defined by different jurisdictions, they cannot constitute the ‘same offense.’” > > > [@](#): > > > > The Gamble case may nevertheless have significant collateral legal effects … A win for Gamble could also indirectly strengthen the President’s pardon power, by precluding a state from prosecuting an already-pardoned defendant who has gone to trial on an overlapping offense. > > **What Does This Have to Do with Brett Kavanaugh?** > Some pundits have speculated that the reason why certain politicians seem to be in a rush to seat Judge Brett Kavanaugh on the Supreme Court is that is that he has a notably strong view of presidential powers and therefore would be a vote in favor of Gamble and for an expansion of presidential pardon powers — and the Supreme Court announced they would be hearing this case the day after Justice Kennedy’s retirement. This temporal proximity has prompted some commenters to opine that the rush might be motivated by a desire to limit the president’s legal liability in the Russia probe and other investigations > > … > > While we cannot speculate on the motives of politicians who are supporting Judge Kavanaugh’s nomination, The Atlantic reported that prominent political legal scholars agree in a general sense with the view of this case’s having importance with regard to President Trump’s pardon power: > > > [@](#): > > > > Within the context of the Mueller probe, legal observers have seen the dual-sovereignty doctrine as a check on President Donald Trump’s power: It could discourage him from trying to shut down the Mueller investigation or pardon anyone caught up in the probe, because the pardon wouldn’t be applied to state charges. Under settled law, if Trump were to pardon his former campaign chairman Paul Manafort, for example — he was convicted in federal court on eight counts of tax and bank fraud — both New York and Virginia state prosecutors could still charge him for any crimes that violated their respective laws … If the dual-sovereignty doctrine were tossed … then Trump’s pardon could theoretically protect Manafort from state action. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26220 "2018-10-04T19:35:33Z")
The Russian handler of Natalia Veselnitskaya, the Russian “lawyer” who met with Donnie Jr. and other Trump associates in the Trump Tower, has died in a “helicopter crash”. > **[Russian Official Tied to Natalia Veselnitskaya, the Trump Tower Lawyer, Is Dead](https://www.thedailybeast.com/russian-official-linked-to-natalia-veselnitskaya-the-trump-tower-lawyer-is-dead?via=FB_Page&source=TDB)** > > Russia’s Deputy Attorney General Saak Karapetyan was exposed this year for running a foreign recruitment operation with Natalia Veselnitskaya. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26221 "2018-10-04T19:53:30Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > The Russian handler of Natalia Veselnitskaya, the Russian “lawyer” who met with Donnie Jr. and other Trump associates in the Trump Tower, has died in a “helicopter crash”. > [Russian Official, Linked to Trump Tower Lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya, Is Dead](https://www.thedailybeast.com/russian-official-linked-to-natalia-veselnitskaya-the-trump-tower-lawyer-is-dead?via=FB_Page&source=TDB) I think the quotes around “helicopter crash” imply that the helicopter didn’t actually crash - I’d be pretty sure it did. Now, if you had said accident instead of crash, then the quotes would have been appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26222 "2018-10-04T19:55:23Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > Anyone here familiar with the Gamble v United States case coming before the Supreme Court? > > Some of my conspiracy-minded friends mentioned it to me. In a nutshell, the theory goes that the case above could possibly give the President the power to pardon state crimes if it overlaps with a federal crime or prevent prosecution if there’s already a federal pardon. Kavanaugh would be predicted to vote for this. The result would be that Trump could then pardon federal and state crimes and use this newly granted power to try to effectively shut down the Russia probe. > > Could a Case Currently Before the Supreme Court Result in a Stronger Presidential Pardon? > [Could a Case Currently Before the Supreme Court Result in a Stronger Presidential Pardon? | Snopes.com](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-gamble-court-case/) > > :eek: Started a so far brief GD thread on this: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=863048](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=863048) ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26223 "2018-10-04T20:08:11Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > I think the quotes around “helicopter crash” imply that the helicopter didn’t actually crash - I’d be pretty sure it did. Now, if you had said accident instead of crash, then the quotes would have been appropriate. From the linked article: > [@](#): > > Earlier this year, Karapetyan lashed out at Britain in the aftermath of the Novichok attack against former Russian spy Sergei Skripal. He linked Skripal, Litvinenko, and Boris Berezovsky, a high-profile critic of Putin who died of suspected suicide in 2013. > > “The British authorities have based the anti-Russian campaign surrounding the poisoning of former GRU officer Skripal and his daughter on a provocative scenario. A similar scenario was used in baseless allegations of Russia’s attempt on the life of Boris Berezovsky in London in summer 2003 and the circumstances surrounding the death of Alexander Litvinenko in the U.K. in November 2006,” Karapetyan said, according to Interfax. Wow, those allegations are just looking more and more baseless and provocative every time another Russian turns up mysteriously dead. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2018, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/26224 "2018-10-04T20:16:15Z")
Why would the Ruskies kill the handler and two other guys? Why not arrange an umbrella accident for her? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1310) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1312)