# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1465
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29285 "2019-01-12T03:24:40Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > MSNBC, for sure, is treating this like some sort of major scoop. > > I’m happy to be schooled if I’m missing something obvious, but what makes this such a ‘bombshell’? That is, the article mostly just reports on the existence of this enquiry, and does not clearly state how far the enquiry proceeded and what the results might have been except that, apparently, elements of the enquiry eventually were rolled into the Special Counsel’s investigation, once he had been appointed. Don’t know about anyone else, but I don’t find any of this especially surprising or earth-shattering. > > Yes, I am aware that much is being made in the press at this moment of the President’s name (supposedly) being referenced in the subject line of electronic communications on this matter, as that presumably is rather unprecedented, but I’m not clear how the mere knowledge of the existence of such an enquiry is of great significance when Mueller, has been plowing the same ground for a couple of years now. > > I’ll hang up and listen. My opinion: What distinguishes this particular news is that the man who sits as the president himself is/was the subject of this investigation. Not his campaign, not his family, not his buddies. Him. When you think about what it must have taken for the FBI – not an agency well known for its liberal bent – to seriously consider opening such a sensitive, politically-fraught investigation into the possibility that _a sitting president of the United States is a witting or unwitting asset of the Russians_, well… to me, that’s a pretty big story. Not a surprising one, I’ll grant you, given what we already know in the public domain. But it’s still shocking. Should we trust him to lead? ---
**Author:** ![AnalogSignal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/analogsignal/32/1085_2.png) [@AnalogSignal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnalogSignal)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29286 "2019-01-12T03:33:29Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > I’m happy to be schooled if I’m missing something obvious, but what makes this such a ‘bombshell’? This is a bombshell because there was sufficient evidence for the FBI to investigate whether the President was working for Russia and a threat to national security. This is much more serious than just investigating his campaign staff. On edit, Aspenglow summed it up nicely. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29287 "2019-01-12T03:43:39Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > More than the tipping point number, apparently, as he seems to still be POTUS. I spend a lot of time imagining a day when we go over the tipping point, tho, and his jig is up. “gig is up.” /pedantic ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29288 "2019-01-12T03:49:26Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > “gig is up.” > > /pedantic Wanna bet? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29289 "2019-01-12T04:01:50Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > My opinion: What distinguishes this particular news is that the man who sits as the president himself is/was the subject of this investigation. Not his campaign, not his family, not his buddies. Him. > > When you think about what it must have taken for the FBI – not an agency well known for its liberal bent – to seriously consider opening such a sensitive, politically-fraught investigation into the possibility that _a sitting president of the United States is a witting or unwitting asset of the Russians_, well… to me, that’s a pretty big story. Not a surprising one, I’ll grant you, given what we already know in the public domain. But it’s still shocking. > > Should we trust him to lead? [Frank Figliuzzi](https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1083921507158347777), former former Assistant Director for Counterintelligence at the Federal Bureau of Investigation: _“The FBI is privy to all kinds of intel … if you’re going to open a case on the POTUS, you’re going to have more than just unstable behavior … you’re going to have something that gives you at least a reasonable suspicion if not specific and articulable facts.”_ ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29290 "2019-01-12T04:06:23Z")
Now I’m wondering if “No treason!” will replace “No collusion!” in Trump’s tweets. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29291 "2019-01-12T04:51:03Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > In April, 1917, in an attempt to knock Russia out of WW1, Germany transported Vladimir Lenin from exile in Zurich to the Russian border, and let him go. > > They succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. > > Trump is Putin’s revenge on the West, revenge for damage done by Lenin to Russia. I doubt it. I’m sure Putin reveres Lenin, considering Putin is still angry about the dissolution of the USSR. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29292 "2019-01-12T05:18:59Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Wanna bet? :dubious: A friendly bet, sure. I wouldn’t bet the farm. What if we’re both right? How does the bet shake out? ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29293 "2019-01-12T05:20:43Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > In April, 1917, in an attempt to knock Russia out of WW1, Germany transported Vladimir Lenin from exile in Zurich to the Russian border, and let him go. > > They succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. Obviously they did, as the German/Austro-Hungarian alliance rules Europe from border to bolder to this day. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29294 "2019-01-12T05:21:10Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > A friendly bet, sure. I wouldn’t bet the farm. > > What if we’re both right? How does the bet shake out? > ETA: [Secondary cite](https://www.phrases.org.uk/bulletin_board/55/messages/720.html) > [@](#): > > “The expression suggests that the dance is over and that the time has come to pay the fiddler. However, its derivation is more complicated. ‘Jig’ is a very old term for a lively dance, but in Elizabethan times the word became slang for a practical joke or a trick. ‘The jig is up’ - meaning your trick or game is finished, has been exposed, we’re onto you now - derives from this obsolete slang word, not the ‘jig’ that is a lively dance.” From _Encyclopedia of Word and Phrase Origins_ by Robert Hendrickson . ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29295 "2019-01-12T05:44:27Z")
> [@AnalogSignal](#): > > Bombshell: F.B.I. Opened Inquiry Into Whether Trump Was Secretly Working on Behalf of Russia > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/11/us/politics/fbi-trump-russia-inquiry.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/11/us/politics/fbi-trump-russia-inquiry.html) > [@Aspenglow](#): > > My opinion: What distinguishes this particular news is that the man who sits as the president himself is/was the subject of this investigation. Not his campaign, not his family, not his buddies. Him. > > When you think about what it must have taken for the FBI – not an agency well known for its liberal bent – to seriously consider opening such a sensitive, politically-fraught investigation into the possibility that _a sitting president of the United States is a witting or unwitting asset of the Russians_, well… to me, that’s a pretty big story. Not a surprising one, I’ll grant you, given what we already know in the public domain. But it’s still shocking. > > Should we trust him to lead? > [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > [Frank Figliuzzi](https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1083921507158347777), former former Assistant Director for Counterintelligence at the Federal Bureau of Investigation: > > _“The FBI is privy to all kinds of intel … if you’re going to open a case on the POTUS, you’re going to have more than just unstable behavior … you’re going to have something that gives you at least a reasonable suspicion if not specific and articulable facts.”_ Even Nixon would never have stooped so low as to be a Russian asset.This comes as no surprise to me, and I am somewhat relieved the FBI took this notion seriously. Chump will no doubt claim politics and anger at the Comey firing, but really, it is impossible to initiate this sort of investigation for political purposes or personal reasons. They have to have had some hard evidence just to get this ball rolling. More proof that not only is Chump himself seriously a traitor to this nation but so is every person who voted for him, not to mention the average Republican trash. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29296 "2019-01-12T05:47:25Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Wanna bet? :dubious: [My favorite Mel Brooks joke](https://youtu.be/VeBbAPiJVeI)–obscene and racist in four little words. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29297 "2019-01-12T05:49:51Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Even Nixon would never have stooped so low as to be a Russian asset.This comes as no surprise to me, and I am somewhat relieved the FBI took this notion seriously. Chump will no doubt claim politics and anger at the Comey firing, but really, it is impossible to initiate this sort of investigation for political purposes or personal reasons. They have to have had some hard evidence just to get this ball rolling. > > More proof that not only is Chump himself seriously a traitor to this nation but so is every person who voted for him, not to mention the average Republican trash. Actually, I kinda expect him to give us a few encores of his hit from the Spring of 2017, _I’ve Been Assured by the Director of the FBI That I’m NOT Under Investigation._ A Golden Oldie. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29298 "2019-01-12T05:59:08Z")
Please help me understand English, CFSG: _ **Humanitarian Crisis at our Southern Border. I just got back and it is a far worse situation than almost anyone would understand, an invasion! I have been there numerous times – The Democrats Cryin’ Chuck and Nancy don’t know how bad and dangerous it is for our ENTIRE COUNTRY…** _ “Humanitarian Crisis”: _we are being invaded_! I am having a very hard time trying to make those two things fit together. What am I doing wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29299 "2019-01-12T06:01:40Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Please help me understand English, > > CFSG: _ **Humanitarian Crisis at our Southern Border. I just got back and it is a far worse situation than almost anyone would understand, an invasion! I have been there numerous times – The Democrats Cryin’ Chuck and Nancy don’t know how bad and dangerous it is for our ENTIRE COUNTRY…** _ > > “Humanitarian Crisis”: _we are being invaded_! I am having a very hard time trying to make those two things fit together. What am I doing wrong? What are you doing wrong? Looking for logic in Chump’s schizoid utterances. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29300 "2019-01-12T06:21:26Z")
An “asset” is not _necessarily_ a willing co-conspirator. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29301 "2019-01-12T06:30:23Z")
We may be moving from whether a sitting president can be indicted to whether a sitting president can receive the death penalty for treason. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29302 "2019-01-12T06:32:47Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > whether a sitting president can receive the death penalty for treason. Ain’t gonna happen. (Nor should it.) ---
**Author:** ![3trew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/13edae/32.png) [@3trew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3trew)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29303 "2019-01-12T06:39:23Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Please help me understand English, > > CFSG: _ **Humanitarian Crisis at our Southern Border. I just got back and it is a far worse situation than almost anyone would understand, an invasion! I have been there numerous times – The Democrats Cryin’ Chuck and Nancy don’t know how bad and dangerous it is for our ENTIRE COUNTRY…** _ > > “Humanitarian Crisis”: _we are being invaded_! I am having a very hard time trying to make those two things fit together. What am I doing wrong? Knowing things and being able to think. Trump probably heard that “humanitarian” groups were involved, didn’t know the word and vaguely understood that some liberal reporter might use it to trap him with their fake news. A few days later, Fox does a “funny” piece on vegetarians. A few days later, some synapses connect: if vegetarians only eat vegetables, then humanitarians… it’s worse than he thought! Mexican cannibals! The humanitarians are invading, thus the “Humanitarian Crisis”. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2019, 6:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/29304 "2019-01-12T06:40:40Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > An “asset” is not _necessarily_ a willing co-conspirator. Trump is histories first witting and unwitting asset. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1464) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1466)