# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1689
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33765 "2019-06-21T15:49:16Z")
> [@Railer13](#): > > Now I’m even more confused than I was earlier today: > > From [The Hill](https://thehill.com/policy/defense/449667-report-iranian-officials-say-trump-warned-them-attack-was-imminent?__twitter_impression=true): > > \*Iranian officials said Friday that they were warned by President Trump to expect an imminent attack shortly before the U.S. ordered forces preparing a tactical strike on the country to stand down. > > Officials speaking under the promise of anonymity told Reuters on Friday that the Trump administration informed them of the attack a “short period” before they were set to occur, only to watch as U.S. forces were called off moments later. > > “In his message, Trump said he was against any war with Iran and wanted to talk to Tehran about various issues,” one Iranian official told Reuters.\* The fuck? I’m certainly no military strategist or diplomat, but isn’t it kind of a bad idea to warn your opponents shortly before you attack? And then, having warned them, isn’t it a bad idea then not to go through with it? I mean, I don’t want us to attack Iran. I think we’re in a corner due to Trump’s stupidity, and that we’re about to blunder into another stupid war. So, on the one hand I’m glad we didn’t go through with it. But this strikes me as just chaotic and amateurish. What the hell are we trying to accomplish? ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33766 "2019-06-21T15:50:14Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > What the hell are we trying to accomplish? Nobody knows. Not even the guy who’s supposed to be in charge. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33767 "2019-06-21T15:56:52Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > The fuck? I’m certainly no military strategist or diplomat, but isn’t it kind of a bad idea to warn your opponents shortly before you attack? And then, having warned them, isn’t it a bad idea then not to go through with it? > > … Perhaps Trump is concerned that in other countries his stupidity is not fully realized like it is here, and he wanted to demonstrate it just for the record. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33768 "2019-06-21T16:05:02Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > The fuck? I’m certainly no military strategist or diplomat, but isn’t it kind of a bad idea to warn your opponents shortly before you attack? And then, having warned them, isn’t it a bad idea then not to go through with it? > > I mean, I don’t want us to attack Iran. I think we’re in a corner due to Trump’s stupidity, and that we’re about to blunder into another stupid war. So, on the one hand I’m glad we didn’t go through with it. But this strikes me as just chaotic and amateurish. What the hell are we trying to accomplish? I kinda sorta see the rationale for this. If we destroy a missile launch site with no casualties, then that would be proportional to our loss of a drone. If there are casualties – especially, civilians – then we’ve escalated the conflict. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33769 "2019-06-21T16:07:45Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Perhaps Trump is concerned that in other countries his stupidity is not fully realized like it is here, and he wanted to demonstrate it just for the record. I think you’ve got it. Europe knows of his stupidity, Asia knows as well, but maybe he was worried that the Middle East hadn’t quite grasped his level of ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33770 "2019-06-21T16:13:54Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > I kinda sorta see the rationale for this. If we destroy a missile launch site with no casualties, then that would be proportional to our loss of a drone. If there are casualties – especially, civilians – then we’ve escalated the conflict. I could see that, yeah. Retaliation in specific kind (i.e. destroying equipment), proportionate response, that kind of jazz. Technically it also would have allowed Iran to prepare their defences, but then again anybody who thinks Iran’s 80s era, Soviet knock-off AA tech, even at its most extreme state of readiness, could hamper a motivated US strike, raise your hand please ? I didn’t think so. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33771 "2019-06-21T16:15:30Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > I kinda sorta see the rationale for this. If we destroy a missile launch site with no casualties, then that would be proportional to our loss of a drone. If there are casualties – especially, civilians – then we’ve escalated the conflict. And what is the message being sent if, because of our timely warning, Iran successfully repels our attack? ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33772 "2019-06-21T16:18:12Z")
I’m leaning towards the whole thing being a planned stunt from start to finish. Its a textbook example of Trump’s usual strategy. Create a crisis, back off a the last minute and then try to take credit for averting said crisis. Trump single-handedly prevented war between Iran and the US. Nobel peace prize here he comes. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33773 "2019-06-21T17:10:51Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > back off a the last minute If only his father had… ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33774 "2019-06-21T17:38:55Z")
Lawyers for the administration are arguing that there is no right for detainees to have soap, toothpaste, or beds. > **[U.S. Government Says It's Not Required to Provide Migrant Kids in Custody...](https://gizmodo.com/u-s-government-says-its-not-required-to-provide-migran-1835688631)** > > The U.S. Justice Department argued in federal court this week that government agencies like Customs and Border Protection have no responsibility to provide toothbrushes, toothpaste, and soap to migrant kids who are currently held in America’s vast... ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33775 "2019-06-21T17:52:16Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > I’m leaning towards the whole thing being a planned stunt from start to finish. > > Its a textbook example of Trump’s usual strategy. Create a crisis, back off a the last minute and then try to take credit for averting said crisis. > > Trump single-handedly prevented war between Iran and the US. Nobel peace prize here he comes. This. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33776 "2019-06-21T20:10:20Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > To send a message to Iran, “Don’t mess with this guy, he’s crazy” ? > [@garygnu](#): > > I don’t think that’s what Tehran is hearing, though. What, are they deaf? ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33777 "2019-06-21T22:12:11Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > I’m leaning towards the whole thing being a planned stunt from start to finish. > > Its a textbook example of Trump’s usual strategy. Create a crisis, back off a the last minute and then try to take credit for averting said crisis. > > Trump single-handedly prevented war between Iran and the US. Nobel peace prize here he comes. Yeah, put me down as another vote for this. Some military experts have gone on record saying the sequence of events Trump described is _extremely_ unlikely—the idea that no one would have mentioned potential casualties until Mr. Brilliant Mind thought of it, is utterly ludicrous. When a military action is placed before a decision-maker, the projected number of casualties is one of the first factors mentioned. Trump thought this was a great story. So much drama! It was about to go down, and only his wise intervention stopped a disproportionate military action! Such a brilliant commander he is! No one else thought about casualties or proportionality of response! What a disgusting little turd he is, playing with his toys. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2019, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33778 "2019-06-21T22:13:28Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > And, this morning, our national burden[took credit](https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1142055392488374272) for calling off the strike because it would kill too many people. Why that information was not taken into account BEFORE ordering the strike is unclear. But, seems to follow the similar pattern of screwing something up, fixing the screw up and then begging for credit for solving the problem. I wanna reporter to ask him that! I saw him being interviewed, saying he called it off because it was bad this way and bad that way and he called it off because the buck stops with him, dammit. Nobody (on this channel, anyway) asked him “_Then why the fuck did you order it then_???” ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33779 "2019-06-22T03:10:26Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > This is worrying. > > Trump, on Twitter tonight: > > [https://mobile.twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1140791400658870274](https://mobile.twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1140791400658870274) > > Article about the tweet: > [https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigration/trump-vows-mass-immigration-arrests-removals-of-millions-of-illegal-aliens-starting-next-week/2019/06/17/4e366f5e-916d-11e9-aadb-74e6b2b46f6a\_story.html](https://www.washingtonpost.com/immigration/trump-vows-mass-immigration-arrests-removals-of-millions-of-illegal-aliens-starting-next-week/2019/06/17/4e366f5e-916d-11e9-aadb-74e6b2b46f6a_story.html) > > Rounding up a few million people and evicting them from the country in a short timespan ICE says they’re going to target 2000 families in 10 cities on Sunday. Local authorities in the cities are saying they’re supporting the immigrants, or at least not assisting ICE. > **[ICE set to begin immigration raids in 10 cities on Sunday](https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/21/politics/ice-immigration-raids/index.html)** > > Immigration and Customs Enforcement is pressing forward with a plan to remove arrest and deport families with court-ordered removals in 10 cities beginning Sunday, according to a senior immigration official If they get away with deporting 2000 families, look for it to be 4000 next time, then 20,000, then millions. And then they’ll start on citizens who were born here to undocumented immigrants (another of Herr Miller’s ideas). And then maybe legal residents or naturalized citizens from “shithole countries”. We got mass deportations. We got concentration camps. What are we missing? Oh, I know! Skulls. We need skulls on our uniforms. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33780 "2019-06-22T03:15:43Z")
Been that way for all my time. 'Til forever, on it goes Through the circle, fast and slow, I know It can’t stop, I wonder. I wanna know Have you ever seen Iran I wanna know Have you ever seen Iran Calmin’ down A Sunni day ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33781 "2019-06-22T03:16:32Z")
You can’t call them concentration camps because that’s what AOC calls them! ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33782 "2019-06-22T04:34:58Z")
> [@slumtrimpet](#): > > I’m with **Fiveyearlurker**. > I think pretty much the entire Republican Party is being blackmailed. Lindsay Graham and Mitch McConnell especially, but the rest of them either are or know that the party is compromised. I seem to remember post 2016 a whole bunch of them suddenly deciding to [retire from politics](https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/here-are-all-the-republicans-retiring-from-congress-in-2018/). The blackmail theory seems a little wacky, although Trump would certainly do it, he could be his own J. Edgar Hoover. It may just be that the whole party, I mean the voters, are going so far right that any moderate can’t get elected. Either way, in the long run, this is good. This is not a majority far right country. I mean hell, in Mississippi it is. But otherwise, the Republicans are going to increasingly marginalize themselves. I really don’t see a future wave of Young Republicans coming along. Unfortunately this is going to take a long time. I hope I live to see the demise of the Republican Party. ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33783 "2019-06-22T05:02:18Z")
> [@Defensive\_Indifference](#): > > ICE says they’re going to target 2000 families in 10 cities on Sunday. Local authorities in the cities are saying they’re supporting the immigrants, or at least not assisting ICE. > > [Immigration raids in 10 US cities start on Sunday - CNNPolitics](https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/21/politics/ice-immigration-raids/index.html) > > If they get away with deporting 2000 families, look for it to be 4000 next time, then 20,000, then millions. And then they’ll start on citizens who were born here to undocumented immigrants (another of Herr Miller’s ideas). And then maybe legal residents or naturalized citizens from “shithole countries”. > > We got mass deportations. We got concentration camps. What are we missing? Oh, I know! Skulls. We need skulls on our uniforms. Sure, if they can deport 2000 they’ll deport 4000 and then 20,000. But at a certain number, these deportations are going to start affecting the daily lives of white citizens. Anthony Bourdain once said that the restaurant industry in NYC could not survive without immigrants, legal and illegal. They are the one busing the tables and doing the prep work in the kitchens. And this is also true in El Paso. Soon the MAGA-hat-wearing-moron (can I trademark that, AFAIK I coined it) will have delays getting his food because the waiters have been deported or just ran away in fear, or will have to pay more at the grocery store because prices have gone up because crops are rotting in the fields because there is no one to pick them (which happened in Alabama a few years ago), or work in the meat processing plants. I am not diminishing the threat we face or saying “it can’t happen here.” It can happen anywhere. But right now, most Americans are completely ignorant of how much immigrants, especially illegal ones, contribute to our economy. They are just going to have to find out for themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2019, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33784 "2019-06-22T05:14:11Z")
I’ll just quote the Huffpost article on this one: > [@](#): > > President Donald Trump has responded to the rape allegations described by columnist E. Jean Carroll in graphic detail in New York Magazine. > > In a statement to Bloomberg reporter Laura Litvan, Trump said that he’s “never met this person in my life” in reference to Carroll. > > Below is a photograph of Carroll, Trump, and his then-wife Ivana Trump at an NBC party in 1987. Trump didn’t stop there: > [@](#): > > (Trump made) a pointed reference to Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh, claiming Carroll’s account is on par with the allegations waged against Kavanaugh by Julie Swetnick. I’m sure Kavanaugh loved hearing that Trump compared his innocence to his own. Being on a roll, Trump then said “All should condemn false accusations” - followed by accusing Carroll of working for the Democratic Party. The article concludes by noting that Carroll is the sixteenth woman to publicly accuse Trump of sexual assault. > **[Trump On E. Jean Carroll Rape Allegation: 'I've Never Met This Person In My...](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-response-e-jean-carroll-rape-allegation_n_5d0d4a42e4b0a39418626c52?ncid=%20edlinkusaolp00000029)** > > The advice columnist and the president were photographed together in the 1980s. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1688) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1690)