# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1693
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33845 "2019-06-24T08:52:49Z")
Ah, I see now that they did have links to the documents on the site. Anyways…I was hoping to see more of the names that we didn’t know, like Ariel Emanuel. There’s probably a fairly clear set of names that were thrown into the hat by Trump. It would be interesting to see what that list looks like. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33846 "2019-06-24T10:51:06Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > We know the real deal. > > He walked away from a treaty/deal Iran was honoring, according to the UN and OUR allies. HE broke the deal and then piled on sanctions to make it worse. Trump doesn’t understand the word “deal”. He thinks that deal, negotiation and so forth mean “we talk; I bluster; eventually you say ok; I’m happy”. The idea that a deal (whether marriage, business or treaty) may require him to do something other than whatever catches his fancy at a given moment is just incomprehensible. I have someone with his basic personality, including that detail (different “negotiation” technique, but otherwise they could be twins). My life got better once I understood this and stopped expecting anything from them beyond the next five minutes. There is no brain-mouth-hands filter: if they say “I’m going to do X” and they’re already doing it they usually will finish, but if that future is more than a few seconds ahead forget it; they’ll just change their mind and do whatever has caught their fancy latest. And to that, we add that he’s a zero-sum guy: he doesn’t understand win-win, he doesn’t understand that someone else being happy (or merely not being in tears) doesn’t mean he’s come out the loser. It is this that makes him dangerous, specially with that football at hand. To him, the cries of his enemies aren’t only part of a particularly joyous victory: they’re the background he expects from daily life, and defines “his enemies” as “anybody not kissing his ass at that very moment”. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33847 "2019-06-24T12:06:42Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Trump doesn’t understand the word “deal”. He thinks that deal, negotiation and so forth mean “we talk; I bluster; eventually you say ok; I’m happy”. The idea that a deal (whether marriage, business or treaty) may require him to do something other than whatever catches his fancy at a given moment is just incomprehensible… He doesn’t get that in a “deal” both sides give up something and both sides get something. > [@](#): > > And to that, we add that he’s a zero-sum guy: he doesn’t understand win-win, he doesn’t understand that someone else being happy (or merely not being in tears) doesn’t mean he’s come out the loser. It is this that makes him dangerous, specially with that football at hand. To him, the cries of his enemies aren’t only part of a particularly joyous victory: they’re the background he expects from daily life, and defines “his enemies” as “anybody not kissing his ass at that very moment”. Yesyesyes. He is the winner ONLY if at the end the other person/side is on their knees bleeding and weeping, preferably while thanking him for the abuse and licking his … shoes. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33848 "2019-06-24T14:40:43Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > To him, the cries of his enemies aren’t only part of a particularly joyous victory: they’re the background he expects from daily life, and defines “his enemies” as “anybody not kissing his ass at that very moment”. To paraphrase the philosopher Conan the Barbarian about what is best in life: “To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of the liberals!” ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33849 "2019-06-24T17:26:01Z")
> [@Quint](#): > > I have long thought of you as a holier than thou grandstanding asshole. Reading through this gave me chills down my spine and I now consider you a holier than thou grandstanding prescient. I hope you are wrong. This. I dont usually add to these threads because Asahi is already there. And Nava, what are you doing the rest of your life? ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33850 "2019-06-24T21:05:24Z")
[Mike Pence’s unbelievable answer on whether climate change is a threat](https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/24/politics/mike-pence-climate-crisis/index.html) I actually watched _State of the Union_ yesterday. This was the most disingenuous: > [@](#): > > \*TAPPER: But I want to ask you a question about climate change. > > The director of national intelligence, Dan Coats, said in a January report on worldwide threats that the climate emergency is – quote – “likely to fuel competition for resources, economic distress and social discontent.” > > It is a priority for the DNI, Coats. > > The EPA this week, however, rolled back part of President Obama’s Clean Power Plan, letting states set their own limit for coal power plants emissions. > > Do you believe think human-induced climate emergency is a threat to the United States? > > PENCE: Well, what – what I will tell you is that we will always follow the science on that in this administration. > > TAPPER: The science says it is. > \* [Italics in original] Oh, the Trump administration is going to follow the science. I feel so reassured now. ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33851 "2019-06-24T21:10:33Z")
^That whole interview was sooo frustrating. Tapper continued to press him on whether climate change is a threat and he just continued to hem and haw and dodge and talk about ‘clean coal’. ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33852 "2019-06-24T21:26:56Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > ^That whole interview was sooo frustrating. Tapper continued to press him on whether climate change is a threat and he just continued to hem and haw and dodge and talk about ‘clean coal’. Well, “clean coal” is one way to put the miners back to work, in Trump’s understanding: [What Trump has said about ‘clean coal’ and what it is](https://abcnews.go.com/US/trump-clean-coal/story?id=49376237) > [@](#): > > “We’ve ended the war on beautiful, clean coal. and it’s just been announced that a second, brand new coal mine where they’re going to take out clean coal — meaning they’re taking out coal, they’re going to clean it — is opening in the state of Pennsylvania,” Trump said. > > His comment puzzled scientists and people with an understanding of how coal mining works. > > “He clearly doesn’t know what he’s talking about,” said Pieter Tans, the lead scientist of the Global Greenhouse Gas Reference Network of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration in Boulder, Colorado. > > “It sounds like he thinks that they’re going to wash the coal,” Tans told ABC News. “It doesn’t make any sense.” > > He added, “The concept of ‘clean coal’ is industry propaganda.” Think of all those jobs created for scrubbing coal with brushes or blasting coal with power washers. And since Trump and his administration don’t care about polluting the environment–it’s a win!!! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33853 "2019-06-24T21:34:47Z")
As awful as Trump is, I sometimes wonder if a Pence presidency wouldn’t in fact be worse. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33854 "2019-06-24T22:12:08Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > As awful as Trump is, I sometimes wonder if a Pence presidency wouldn’t in fact be worse. Trump is trashing rule of law globally, which will significantly hamper business and safety of travel for decades to come. Pence would try and possibly succeed at moving the US towards religious fundamentalism - ala Christian Wahhabism. The best of all options, given the pairing is that Trump starts things out, gets impeached before he can do too much damage and then Pence is left as a lame duck strapped to a Democratic Congress. There’s no good option. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33855 "2019-06-24T22:27:40Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > ^That whole interview was sooo frustrating. Tapper continued to press him on whether climate change is a threat and he just continued to hem and haw and dodge and talk about ‘clean coal’. When a Trumpian wants to say something that \*sounds \*like “we’re making progress!” they’ll talk about “clean air”. Pence did this yesterday. Clean air/pollution and carbon standards are 2 different things. CO2 is not smog. We breathe CO2 in and out all day with no ill effects (as long as there’s sufficient oxygen). But they sure sound the same… ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33856 "2019-06-24T22:32:19Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Trump is trashing rule of law globally, which will significantly hamper business and safety of travel for decades to come. > > Pence would try and possibly succeed at moving the US towards religious fundamentalism - ala Christian Wahhabism. > > The best of all options, given the pairing is that Trump starts things out, gets impeached before he can do too much damage and then Pence is left as a lame duck strapped to a Democratic Congress. > > There’s no good option. Wouldn’t the best option be that Trump spends all his time for the rest of his term picking out carpeting and paint swatches for Air Force One (plane AND golf cart)? And then President Anydemocrat wishes Trump good luck avoiding extradition back to the US, and Pence best wishes with his late night Jesus-Says-Please-Send-Us-Ten-Bucks TV show? ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33857 "2019-06-24T22:33:04Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > As awful as Trump is, I sometimes wonder if a Pence presidency wouldn’t in fact be worse. Trump’s “agenda” is: 1. Pack the courts with conservatives 2. Undo everything Obama did 3. Stay out of jail 4. Line his pockets as much as possible Pence’s agenda would be: 1. Pack the courts with conservatives 2. Roll back all progressive changes of the past 50 years But in terms of foreign policy, Pence would be within conservative norms – not a complete monkey-with-a-machine-gun like Trump. Fortunately, I think Pence has zero chance of ever doing more than keeping the seat warm until 2020. He has no base of his own and none of Trump’s charm and charisma (for certain definitions of those words.) ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33858 "2019-06-24T22:54:43Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > [Mike Pence’s unbelievable answer on whether climate change is a threat](https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/24/politics/mike-pence-climate-crisis/index.html) > > I actually watched _State of the Union_ yesterday. This was the most disingenuous: > > [Italics in original] > > Oh, the Trump administration is going to follow the science. I feel so reassured now. This still throws me and amazes me. How can this even be said by anyone who’s a somewhat successful person? I’m thinking it has to do with lots of evangelical money for the whole prosperity gospel lovers like Pence. Is all their money in coal? ---
**Author:** ![dasmoocher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/dbc845/32.png) [@dasmoocher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dasmoocher)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33859 "2019-06-24T23:28:11Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > This still throws me and amazes me. How can this even be said by anyone who’s a somewhat successful person? I’m thinking it has to do with lots of evangelical money for the whole prosperity gospel lovers like Pence. Is all their money in coal? It’s worse than just money influencing some of these people: [Republican Congressman Says God Will ‘Take Care Of’ Climate Change](https://time.com/4800000/tim-walberg-god-climate-change/) > [@](#): > > A Republican congressman told his constituents that he believes God will “take care of” climate change if it proves to be a “real problem.” > > … > > He continued: “Why do I believe that? Well, as a Christian, I believe that there is a creator in God who is much bigger than us. And I’m confident that, if there’s a real problem, he can take care of it.” So, you see, we have nothing to worry about. Jesus saves! ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2019, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33860 "2019-06-24T23:59:33Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > It’s worse than just money influencing some of these people: > > [Republican Congressman Says God Will ‘Take Care Of’ Climate Change](https://time.com/4800000/tim-walberg-god-climate-change/) > > So, you see, we have nothing to worry about. Jesus saves! Last time God took care of something, Noah built hisself a boat. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2019, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33861 "2019-06-25T00:11:43Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > ^That whole interview was sooo frustrating. Tapper continued to press him on whether climate change is a threat and he just continued to hem and haw and dodge and talk about ‘clean coal’. More from the same interview – Pence’s response to questions about the deplorable conditions migrant children are living in in Trump’s concentration camps. [https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/pence-dodges-questions-poor-conditions-child-migrant-centers](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/pence-dodges-questions-poor-conditions-child-migrant-centers) Basically, Americans should be appalled… at the nerve of these migrants trying to enter our country! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2019, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33862 "2019-06-25T00:21:51Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > More from the same interview – Pence’s response to questions about the deplorable conditions migrant children are living in in Trump’s concentration camps. > > [Pence Dodges Questions About Conditions At Child Migrant Centers](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/pence-dodges-questions-poor-conditions-child-migrant-centers) > > Basically, Americans should be appalled… at the nerve of these migrants trying to enter our country! Mike Pence is a guy who refused to pardon a wrongfully convicted man who spend years in prison. > **[For wrongfully convicted Keith Cooper, an 'uphill battle' after Pence letter](https://www.indystar.com/story/news/politics/2016/09/21/pence-lawyer-keith-cooper-must-exhaust-court-remedies/90772348/)** > > "I'm tired," Cooper said after reading a letter from Gov. Mike Pence's office. But he still has hope. Trump is a scumbag but everyone knows it; Pence is the stealth bomber of shitheads. He flies past some people’s radars. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2019, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33863 "2019-06-25T00:39:24Z")
> [@dasmoocher](#): > > It’s worse than just money influencing some of these people: > > [Republican Congressman Says God Will ‘Take Care Of’ Climate Change](https://time.com/4800000/tim-walberg-god-climate-change/) > > So, you see, we have nothing to worry about. Jesus saves! I bet this scumbag still sees a doctor once in a while, though. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2019, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/33864 "2019-06-25T01:07:36Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > … Fortunately, I think Pence has zero chance of ever doing more than keeping the seat warm until 2020. He has no base of his own and none of Trump’s charm and charisma (for certain definitions of those words.) I agree, but I worry about the scenario of Trump leaving office within a small number of months before November 2020.\* I’d be concerned that the timing would lend Pence a sort of glow of innocent-bystander worthiness. There might be enough voters seeing him that way that there’d be a “give the poor guy a chance” reaction, strong enough to give him four years. (I don’t think he could ever win re-election, but even four years of him would be harmful.) Meh. It’s just idle speculation. And Trump may turn out to be as immortal as we all fear, which would keep Pence irrelevant. \*Heart attack, or maybe a smoking gun of the ‘_caught selling the names of all US undercover operatives, plus plans of new fighter jets, to some foreign power for cash_’ variety–something even Mitch McConnell couldn’t spin. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1692) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1694)