# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1835
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2019, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36685 "2019-09-19T22:31:50Z")
For you, **ThelmaLou** , of course I’ll transcribe: Trump: Well there are many options, as you know, Phil; there are many options. There’s the ultimate option, and there are options that a lot less than that. Phil: When you say “the ultimate option” are you talking about nuclear— Trump: No, when I say the ultimate option meaning go in, war- no, I’m not talking about that, I’m not talking about _that_ ultimate option. Then Colbert makes fun of him. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2019, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36686 "2019-09-19T23:39:39Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Current rumors are the whistleblower complaint is that Trump was blackmailing Ukraine into sabotaging Biden’s campaign. Uh… must have missed some news. In what way would Ukraine do that? Is there some Biden Ukraine connection that I have missed? ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36687 "2019-09-20T00:14:38Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Uh… must have missed some news. In what way would Ukraine do that? Is there some Biden Ukraine connection that I have missed? The [rumors](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/whistleblower-complaint-about-president-trump-involves-ukraine-according-to-two-people-familiar-with-the-matter/2019/09/19/07e33f0a-daf6-11e9-bfb1-849887369476_story.html) were accurate. _“A whistleblower complaint about President Trump made by an intelligence official centers on Ukraine, according to two people familiar with the matter, which has set off a struggle between Congress and the executive branch.”_ And from [here](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/19/us/politics/intelligence-whistle-blower-complaint-trump.html): “According to government officials who handle foreign policy in the United States and Ukraine, Mr. Giuliani’s efforts created the impression that the Trump administration’s willingness to back Mr. Zelensky was linked to his government’s readiness to in turn pursue the investigations sought by Mr. Trump’s allies.” ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36688 "2019-09-20T00:29:47Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > For you, **ThelmaLou** , of course I’ll transcribe: > > Trump: Well there are many options, as you know, Phil; there are many options. There’s the ultimate option, and there are options that a lot less than that. > > Phil: When you say “the ultimate option” are you talking about nuclear— > > Trump: No, when I say the ultimate option meaning go in, war- no, I’m not talking about that, I’m not talking about _that_ ultimate option. > > Then Colbert makes fun of him. Thank you. 🙂 What a doofus. 😃 I’ll bet he would really have fun with the word _pen_ultimate. I’m guessing he’d think it was the ultimate penis or something. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36689 "2019-09-20T00:31:31Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > The [rumors](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/whistleblower-complaint-about-president-trump-involves-ukraine-according-to-two-people-familiar-with-the-matter/2019/09/19/07e33f0a-daf6-11e9-bfb1-849887369476_story.html) were accurate. > > _“A whistleblower complaint about President Trump made by an intelligence official centers on Ukraine, according to two people familiar with the matter, which has set off a struggle between Congress and the executive branch.”_ > > And from [here](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/19/us/politics/intelligence-whistle-blower-complaint-trump.html): > > “According to government officials who handle foreign policy in the United States and Ukraine, Mr. Giuliani’s efforts created the impression that the Trump administration’s willingness to back Mr. Zelensky was linked to his government’s readiness to in turn pursue the investigations sought by Mr. Trump’s allies.” Thanks. So this is about Hunter Biden. Joes son. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36690 "2019-09-20T00:33:47Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Thanks. So this is about Hunter Biden. Joes son. Yeah. Here’s the [rundown](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/is-trump-strong-arming-ukraines-new-president-for-political-gain/2019/09/05/4eb239b0-cffa-11e9-8c1c-7c8ee785b855_story.html): \*"Some suspect Mr. Trump is once again catering to Mr. Putin, who is dedicated to undermining Ukrainian democracy and independence. But we’re reliably told that the president has a second and more venal agenda: He is attempting to force Mr. Zelensky to intervene in the 2020 U.S. presidential election by launching an investigation of the leading Democratic candidate, Joe Biden. Mr. Trump is not just soliciting Ukraine’s help with his presidential campaign; he is using U.S. military aid the country desperately needs in an attempt to extort it. The strong-arming of Mr. Zelensky was openly reported to the New York Times last month by Mr. Trump’s personal lawyer, Rudolph W. Giuliani, who said he had met in Madrid with a close associate of the Ukrainian leader and urged that the new government restart an investigation of Mr. Biden and his son. Hunter Biden served on the board of a Ukrainian gas company, while Joe Biden, as vice president, urged the dismissal of Ukraine’s top prosecutor, who investigated the firm. Mr. Giuliani also wants a probe of claims that revelations of payments by a Ukrainian political party to Mr. Trump’s 2016 campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, were part of a plot to wreck Mr. Trump’s candidacy. In other words, Trump associates want the Ukrainian government to prove that Ukraine improperly acted against Mr. Trump in the 2016 election; but they also want it to meddle in his favor for 2020."\* ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36691 "2019-09-20T00:48:38Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > …Mr. Giuliani also wants a probe of claims that revelations of payments by a Ukrainian political party to Mr. Trump’s 2016 campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, were part of a plot to wreck Mr. Trump’s candidacy. In other words, Trump associates want the Ukrainian government to prove that Ukraine improperly acted against Mr. Trump in the 2016 election; but they also want it to meddle in his favor for 2020."\* Gawd. Trump is still mad that he lost the popular vote. And is still using Giuliani. ---
**Author:** ![River\_Hippie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/river_hippie/32/26_2.png) [@River\_Hippie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/River_Hippie)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36692 "2019-09-20T00:56:05Z")
Lucky us, we’ve lived through the election of the worst possible candidate for POTUS. Lot’s of stories to tell our descendants. “I remember back in the day…we sat on our asses and didn’t vote because politics didn’t effect me and both sides were bad…etc.” Reality TV shows were all the rage. "Who could have thought a reality show star would make a bad president? " ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36693 "2019-09-20T01:08:11Z")
Oh, my god. _Never_ tell me public outcry doesn’t have an impact on what happens in our politics! Apparently the ‘Moscow Mitch’ moniker irritated McConnell so much that today he finally reversed his stance on withholding funds to fight election interference and will allow this to go ahead. Just reported on Maddow. Tiniest thing, but damn, they’re getting nervous! ETA: I’m not going to stop referring to him as Moscow Mitch, though. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36694 "2019-09-20T01:13:49Z")
Giuliani is currently on CNN saying that if Trump did do this, it was fine to do. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36695 "2019-09-20T01:24:52Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Gawd. Trump is still mad that he lost the popular vote. And is still using Giuliani. Nah. Giuliani is using Trump. If it wasn’t for his Trump connection, Rudy would be in a rest home in Florida doing needlepoint. ---
**Author:** ![MikeF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MikeF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeF)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36696 "2019-09-20T01:32:21Z")
I was thinking Trump promised Putin that he wouldn’t interfere if Vlad wanted to take the rest of Ukraine. In exchange for more election help, of course. Which got me to more thinking. What if Trump actually looked the other way for something as outrageous as that? Nothing, I’m guessing. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36697 "2019-09-20T01:38:24Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > Nah. Giuliani is using Trump. If it wasn’t for his Trump connection, Rudy would be in a rest home in Florida doing needlepoint. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36698 "2019-09-20T02:05:32Z")
> [@Aspenglow](#): > > Oh, my god. _Never_ tell me public outcry doesn’t have an impact on what happens in our politics! > > Apparently the ‘Moscow Mitch’ moniker irritated McConnell so much that today he finally reversed his stance on withholding funds to fight election interference and will allow this to go ahead. > > Just reported on Maddow. > > Tiniest thing, but damn, they’re getting nervous! > > ETA: I’m not going to stop referring to him as Moscow Mitch, though. Joe Scarborough 1, Yertle the Turtle 0 ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36699 "2019-09-20T03:05:25Z")
Giuliani: I never asked Ukraine to intervene in the Biden investigation. Hell yes, I asked Ukraine to intervene in the Biden investigation. > **[Rudy Giuliani MeltDown in Trainwreck Interview With Cuomo](https://www.mediaite.com/news/must-watch-giuliani-says-he-asked-ukraine-to-probe-biden-seconds-after-denying-it-in-trainwreck-cnn-interview/)** > > President Donald Trump's personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani says he asked Ukraine to investigate Joe Biden seconds after denying it in trainwreck CNN interview. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36700 "2019-09-20T03:32:21Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Giuliani: I never asked Ukraine to intervene in the Biden investigation. Hell yes, I asked Ukraine to intervene in the Biden investigation. > [Rudy Giuliani MeltDown in Trainwreck Interview With Cuomo](https://www.mediaite.com/news/must-watch-giuliani-says-he-asked-ukraine-to-probe-biden-seconds-after-denying-it-in-trainwreck-cnn-interview/) [Cocaine’s a hell of a drug](https://youtu.be/RZ16H0hsQiQ) ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36701 "2019-09-20T03:47:42Z")
Oh ffs, CNN has really become the professional wrestling network of politics. And I say this as a dyed-in-the-wool Trump-hating lefty. I kept watching that train wreck just to see if Jake “The Snake” Tapper would bust in and take out that Rudy-Poo Candy-Ass with a steel chair and a box full of thumb tacks. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36702 "2019-09-20T04:49:37Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Yeah. Here’s the [rundown](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/global-opinions/is-trump-strong-arming-ukraines-new-president-for-political-gain/2019/09/05/4eb239b0-cffa-11e9-8c1c-7c8ee785b855_story.html): > > \*"Some suspect Mr. Trump is once again catering to Mr. Putin, who is dedicated to undermining Ukrainian democracy and independence. But we’re reliably told that the president has a second and more venal agenda: He is attempting to force Mr. Zelensky to intervene in the 2020 U.S. presidential election by launching an investigation of the leading Democratic candidate, Joe Biden. Mr. Trump is not just soliciting Ukraine’s help with his presidential campaign; he is using U.S. military aid the country desperately needs in an attempt to extort it. > > The strong-arming of Mr. Zelensky was openly reported to the New York Times last month by Mr. Trump’s personal lawyer, Rudolph W. Giuliani, who said he had met in Madrid with a close associate of the Ukrainian leader and urged that the new government restart an investigation of Mr. Biden and his son. Hunter Biden served on the board of a Ukrainian gas company, while Joe Biden, as vice president, urged the dismissal of Ukraine’s top prosecutor, who investigated the firm. > > Mr. Giuliani also wants a probe of claims that revelations of payments by a Ukrainian political party to Mr. Trump’s 2016 campaign chairman, Paul Manafort, were part of a plot to wreck Mr. Trump’s candidacy. In other words, Trump associates want the Ukrainian government to prove that Ukraine improperly acted against Mr. Trump in the 2016 election; but they also want it to meddle in his favor for 2020."\* Of course this would result in impeachment if the Republican in the Senate were at all concerned about the constitution or even the country. > [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Giuliani is currently on CNN saying that if Trump did do this, it was fine to do. And absolutely horrendous if Obama had done it. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36703 "2019-09-20T05:35:19Z")
> [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > Giuliani: I never asked Ukraine to intervene in the Biden investigation. Hell yes, I asked Ukraine to intervene in the Biden investigation. > [Rudy Giuliani MeltDown in Trainwreck Interview With Cuomo](https://www.mediaite.com/news/must-watch-giuliani-says-he-asked-ukraine-to-probe-biden-seconds-after-denying-it-in-trainwreck-cnn-interview/) [Video on YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghIHwOuLXH4) Holy fuck! This is a monumental meltdown! ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2019, 7:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/36704 "2019-09-20T07:13:46Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > > [@Aspenglow](#): > > > > Oh, my god. _Never_ tell me public outcry doesn’t have an impact on what happens in our politics! > > > > Apparently the ‘Moscow Mitch’ moniker irritated McConnell so much that today he finally reversed his stance on withholding funds to fight election interference and will allow this to go ahead. > > > > Just reported on Maddow. > > > > Tiniest thing, but damn, they’re getting nervous! > > > > ETA: I’m not going to stop referring to him as Moscow Mitch, though. > > Joe Scarborough 1, Yertle the Turtle 0 What this suggests to me is that MM has gotten word that the fix is in, and Putin’s cronies have their hooks firmly embedded in the US electoral machinery. So no harm in releasing the funds, since the effect is the same as securing the henhouse when the fox is already inside. (I’d be ecstatic to be wrong.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1834) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1836)