# The Trump Administration: A Clusterfuck in the Making **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 7, 2016, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070 "2016-12-07T00:25:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1855
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37085 "2019-09-26T18:03:47Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > And even after this latest betrayal, people STILL support and defend this traitor piece of shit. I suspect they’d cheer him on to commit murder on Fifth Avenue before their very eyes. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37086 "2019-09-26T18:03:57Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Oompah Loompahs? That’s unfair to Oompah Loompahs. Sure, they have orange skin and weird hair and tiny little hands. But Oompah Loompahs are hard working, entertaining, and cognizant of the people around them. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37087 "2019-09-26T18:07:03Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > The WH apparently “[moved records of conversations with foreign leaders onto a separate computer system](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-whistleblower-ukraine-call-records-foreign-officials-separate-computer-system-a9120961.html)”. > > But I’m sure that’s fine. Yeah, the “scandal” is that they are restricting access to politically sensitive information in a system that is reserved for national security sensitive information. But here’s the thing: when you ARE the state, your personal political interest is equivalent to the national security interest. Clear? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37088 "2019-09-26T18:12:28Z")
And they can sing and dance. Trump looks more like a still-mobile Jabba the Hut. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37089 "2019-09-26T18:16:28Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I suspect they’d cheer him on to commit murder on Fifth Avenue before their very eyes. “Ha ha, he triggered the Libtards! 6 dimensional chess!” ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37090 "2019-09-26T19:22:45Z")
Giuliani thinks he should be seen as a hero for his Ukraine work. [_The Atlantic_ White House correspondent](https://twitter.com/elainaplott/status/1177288410689671170): > [@](#): > > Rudy Giuliani was nearly shouting in my phone call with him. “It is impossible that the whistle-blower is a hero and I’m not. And I will be the hero! These morons—when this is over, I will be the hero,” he told me. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37091 "2019-09-26T19:27:07Z")
Seems like a full-blown meltdown. ---
**Author:** ![Mollie\_Magill](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mollie_magill/32/20882_2.png) [@Mollie\_Magill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mollie_Magill)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37092 "2019-09-26T19:27:56Z")
New whackadoodle theory: Giuliani is the whistle blower! ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37093 "2019-09-26T19:33:52Z")
I’m definitely incorporating “These morons—when this is over, I will be the hero” into my daily life. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37094 "2019-09-26T19:36:03Z")
> [@Mollie\_Magill](#): > > New whackadoodle theory: Giuliani is the whistle blower! He sure likes to blow Trump’s whistle. On a more serious note, I think Giuliani has lost his mind. ---
**Author:** ![Mollie\_Magill](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mollie_magill/32/20882_2.png) [@Mollie\_Magill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mollie_Magill)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37095 "2019-09-26T19:40:18Z")
Honestly, I agree. I think years of being Trump’s lapdog have not done him any favors. He’s gone from Grade A asshole to full blown nutcase. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37096 "2019-09-26T19:40:29Z")
In case anyone missed it, [here was Giuliani having a “moron” meltdown](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ri4kmIpymjM) on Fox News a day or so ago. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37097 "2019-09-26T19:55:01Z")
I saw a blurb, and didn’t read the article, but I think the NY Times has identified the whistleblower as a CIA agent assigned to the White house. No cite, I didn’t even read the article. ---
**Author:** ![Defensive\_Indifference](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/defensive_indifference/32/6502_2.png) [@Defensive\_Indifference](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Defensive_Indifference)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37098 "2019-09-26T20:10:31Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > I saw a blurb, and didn’t read the article, but I think the NY Times has identified the whistleblower as a CIA agent assigned to the White house. No cite, I didn’t even read the article. And I thought Robert Novak was dead! ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37099 "2019-09-26T20:20:21Z")
😃 Here’s a link… WASHINGTON — The whistle-blower [who revealed](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/26/us/politics/whistleblower-complaint-released.html?module=inline) that President Trump sought foreign help for his re-election and that the White House sought to cover it up is a C.I.A. officer who was detailed to work at the White House at one point, according to three people familiar with his identity. > **[White House Knew of Whistle-Blower’s Allegations Soon After Trump’s Call With...](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/26/us/politics/who-is-whistleblower.html)** > > The whistle-blower, a C.I.A. officer detailed to the White House at one point, first expressed his concerns anonymously to the agency’s top lawyer. I still haven’t read the article, because after “according to” the text fades out and I’m admonished for not being a subscriber. ---
**Author:** ![mjmlabs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mjmlabs/32/69_2.png) [@mjmlabs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mjmlabs)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37100 "2019-09-26T20:21:26Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > If it’s not a hill worth defending WHY THE FUCK DID YOU COME IN HERE TO DEFEND IT? > > And with shit-for-brains Hurricane-Ditka-like reasoning, too. :dubious: Lighten up, Francis. For clarity: My colloquialism regarding the advisability of defending a certain hill could be more explicitly stated thus: 1. It’s true and amusing that claimed there was “a winner” from Ukraine when in fact there has never been a Miss Universe from Ukraine. 2. That notwithstanding, it’s not too farfetched to see a dotard vaguely recalling a contestant from Ukraine being announced, walking upstage to receive a sash or whatever the hell happens in pageants, I dunno, given that it was 8 years ago. 3. That not withstanding, OTOH, kinda seems like support staff should have done a little research for his Presidential Phone Call notecards. 4. In any event, despite the amusement potential, let’s not let an inconsequential verbal miscue become a major talking point **WHEN THAT WOULD DISTRACT FROM ALL THE CRIMES AND ABUSES OF POWER** , Jeebus. :eek: I guess I assumed that this would be clear to all, in my wee-hours bleariness. Oh, well, they can’t all be gems. \ Nothing to see here; move along. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37101 "2019-09-26T20:33:48Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I’m definitely incorporating “These morons—when this is over, I will be the hero” into my daily life. Isn’t that a classic Hollywood mad scientist line? Usually with “fools!” instead of “morons”, though. And add a “bwaahahahah” at the end. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37102 "2019-09-26T23:15:52Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Have you seen the way he keeps digging himself deeper into a hole while trying to communicate even the simplest message? Giuliani’s obviously a Horta. You’re saying that Giuliani is a misunderstood protective mother?\* \*I liked the Horta. She rocked. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37103 "2019-09-26T23:16:28Z")
Meanwhile… “Trump’s company, seeking to revive a money-losing golf course in Scotland, gets approval to build 550 homes there” > **[Trump’s company, seeking to revive a money-losing golf course in Scotland,...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trumps-company-seeking-to-revive-a-money-losing-golf-course-in-scotland-gets-approval-to-build-550-homes-there/2019/09/26/e26e7e8a-e066-11e9-8dc8-498eabc129a0_story.html)** > > The move runs counter to the general trend for the company, which has revenue decline at some key properties. > [@](#): > > ABERDEEN, Scotland — A local council in northeastern Scotland granted approval on Thursday to the Trump Organization to build 550 houses on pastureland and forests in a remote swath of North Sea coastline, a rare victory for the company amid declining fortunes elsewhere for the president’s family business. > > The Aberdeenshire Council voted 38 to 24 to allow the Trump Organization’s residential development to move forward despite vocal opposition from many residents who fear it would crowd the roads and schools of their windswept village. > > By winning the council’s approval, the Trump Organization is poised for one of its most ambitious foreign expansion of his presidency. It is also a rescue effort of sorts for Trump’s first golf course in Europe, which has lost money each year since it opened in 2012. A second local council this week also approved the company’s plan to build a second golf course on the site. > … Cause if one golf course is a loser, it makes sense to build another one. Plus, there is something deeply troubling and just wrong with the phrase, “ **most ambitious foreign expansion of his presidency**.” :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2019, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070/37104 "2019-09-26T23:26:00Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Question: When the congress opens up an official impeachment investigation, are there still going to be court battles over how the party under investigation should be allowed to withhold and hide evidence, and prevent witnesses from testifying? > > Because this sounds a bit suspect. Congress will tell the Executive branch that they have to hand X over. The White House will ask the lawyers in the Executive branch to find a justification that ignores any precedent set by the Supreme Court in similar cases (which will be relatively easy since there aren’t all that many). Given that it’s their job to comply, the lawyers will issue guidance to the person in the Executive branch that they do not need to turn X over because of Y argument that has not yet ever been tried in court. Congress (i.e. the House Intelligence Committee) will issue a counter-argument saying that Y is nonsense, that this is clearly the same situation as Nixon, Clinton, etc. and between that and the right to investigate impeachment there’s no counter-argument. They will, thus, issue a subpoena against them. Depending on how many and how bad all of the different transcripts are that are in the secure system - which is probably many and real, real bad - the subpoena is liable to be ignored. If ignored, Congress can either send the Congressional police to lock someone up, or take the issue to court. They are more likely to take the person to court. Nearly every court will decide that it’s above their pay grade and bump it to the next level, until the Supreme Court. At that point, the SC will either determine without trial that Y is nonsense and refuse to take the case, saying that Y is nonsense and that the President’s lawyers are stupid and the Executive branch has to do what Congress says. Or, the Supreme Court will hear the case. They will almost certainly rule in favor of Congress. At that point, depending on how bad the transcripts are, Trump tries to get them deleted and shortens the impeachment cycle. But, in general, Trump wants to drag things out for as long as he can. The key to winning this fight is to leak as much information about the matter, anonymously, to the press as he can so that none of it can be used by Congress in formal impeachment queries. The longer the general public knows everything that he’s done, the more they’ll move on from it and move back to supporting Trump. Humanity only has a two week memory and then they flush everything and just consider it old news when mentioned again. Now, granted, that’s all just a prediction. But I’d put the probability of it being accurate pretty dang high. At the moment, Trump decided to go forward with releasing information to the public that’s fairly damning. That’s counter to the general approach that we would expect Trump to take. My read on that is that it’s because the Senate Intelligence Committee (lead by the Republicans and Richard Burr) decided to throw in with the House Intelligence Committee. Mitch McConnell generally gives Burr room to do what he wants, actually doing the job of Intelligence oversight and review of the President’s slimy activities. How strongly McConnell wants to fight for America’s interests and the security of our political system, I don’t know, but I do think that he considers Trump to be a good foil to distract the voters while the party moves to accomplish its agenda and a good political campaigner, but otherwise largely just a nuisance to be managed and mitigated when Trump tries to do anything that would go against the party’s agenda. So my expectation would be that McConnell views Burr and his desire to keep on top of Trump as a part of that mitigation process. He doesn’t want that to get to impeachment, just to more leverage over the President. At the moment, Trump is being forced to hand stuff over. But, I don’t think, McConnell will let that last too long. He’ll want to cut off the tap as soon as Burr has gotten enough to be able to tell Trump that they know where the jewels are and that he’d better behave if he wants them to hold back from grabbing them. Once Trump is subdued, McConnell will go back to aiding the White House and supporting any delays in the process, so that Trump can protect himself from further inquiry. Unless Burr doesn’t get what they need in time for Schiff to get to the subpoena phase, I would expect the above prediction to hold. And given that McConnell is so good at what he does, I’d be doubtful that he can’t get what they need in time to allow Trump to get into defense mode. One thing to know about Trump is that he’s an expert in being extorted. His whole presidency is, in essence, a daily balance of deciding who he needs to knuckle under for that has compromising info on him, while minimizing how much he pisses off someone else by submitting to the orders of the person telling him to do something. I do not envy the man. Even for as great a narcissist as the man is, even he has to realize on an every day basis how crappy his life is in almost every way outside of some minimal indulgences like being able to eat an infinite supply of cheeseburgers, have sex with models, and crow about being the President of the USA. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1854) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-trump-administration-a-clusterfuck-in-the-making/774070.md?page=1856)